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We should discuss this more once Im done with my build
Dude I'm a little buzzed right now, thought just came to me. Maybe I should drink-think more often...I'll Facebook Message you here in a minute...
Only issue I'm seeing is that the RX-8 rotors/calipers are massive, they wouldn't come close to clearing a wheel setup unless you're running 16"+ wheels. Sound easy for us, but many FB guys like to run 15's or smaller.
Fc/fd calipers are cheap and fit 11 inch rotors. Thats only 1 inch bigger than stock rotors. I dont think youll find anything much more compact other than maybe a slimmer designed caliper.
There is nothing that locks a person into using FC Calipers/rotors just because they are using FC hubs. When I was planning the brakes for my race car build, everything started with hub availability.
In the past I did a big brake conversion on a Fox mustang that consisted of using C4 Corvette parts. The key to the entire deal was the Baer Brake hubs.
tru.. when I built my own custom 4pot setup I turned the rotor of my stock gslse hub and used a rotor from an fc... ended up I read a thread wrong and it was all about upgrading a base fc to a 4pot fc setup hahaha... in the end I have a 4pot setup on my fb but it is a 1 off... I have all the files as I am a machinist... but I am yet to fully test mine... I have driven a little bit but that was without doors, hood etc as I am still in the middle of my build...
when I am done and driving I plan on revisiting my design and seeing what other bigger rotor options are around... but reality the gslse brakes are decent.. I now have 4pots in front as well... I do need to figure out rear setup being gslse calipers are unobtanium almost
Id be ok with the stock se brakes and quality fluids and pads except ive been warned that under racing conditions cracking a rotor can lead to loosing a wheel due to the one piece rotor/hub design.
as noted the fc hub adapter and bracket are on ebay. I havent ruled that out but found some other options im investigating.
Any positive news on this program? any forward progress???? or are we still on our own...LOL.... I would like to do some upgrades there...
Is it a better option to do the FC sub-frame swap into an '85??? You get the bigger FC brakes (or dual pot, or whatever), better steering, better suspension ( I guess), & other things that I have forgotten about... or perhaps never knew...LOL ... perhaps the swap is a negative venture....? I'd sure like some good info on the subject ,,,I searched around the site but really didn't come up with what I as looking for. anything that sheds some more light on the subject would be great!
I've been looking at this off and on for my build too. For the fronts you just need a spindle adapter and then a bracket to hold the caliper. Rears are much more of a pain. A gentlemen in CA shared his eMachineShop CAD files with me, but I didn't like how they were dimensioned and didn't have rounded edges to ease the install. I can't remember where I found this photo for the RX-2, but I'd want to dimension an RX-7 bracket like this once I measured for the hub-side holes. In this version, holes are positioned using a radius rather than x/y.
The second photo is my reverse-engineered rendering in Freecad. It hasn't been tested, but I can share that if anyone wants to play with it. I'd probably use SolidWorks the next round... Freecad is incredibly buggy.
I will say for the street gslse brakes are way more than you would ever need. I autox on stock rotors for years and have done some road racing without any issue on good fluid and carbotec pads. Im only upgrading due to something thats not likely to ever happen on the street.
Thx Mikey D
For me.... its not so much the brakes... as my whooped out GSL 4-wheel disk brakes still grab pretty damn well.... in this light car..
What I'm really after is the larger after market of parts available.... & for the most part RACK & PINION STEERING!!! LOL..
fc 4pot on 4lug is great... still no complaints from me. great kit for the price,, calipers and all (kit) can be completed for $600 or less - at least i did it for that
fc 4pot on 4lug is great... still no complaints from me. great kit for the price,, calipers and all (kit) can be completed for $600 or less - at least i did it for that
That's the part that's annoying, the cost is ridiculous compared to what could be put together to get almost similar results in the end. Plus the unavailability of new TII or FD calipers, everyone is going to be running into this wall soon.
Would be awesome to get something together/measured up/created that would allow for off-the-shelf parts to be bolted onto an FB spindle in order to create a new braking setup that's legal for SCCA-style racing, while also providing a cheaper and better alternative to mid-80's engineering found on FB's.
Dreamin....I can source 4 pot FC calipers from Rock Auto and Autozone without any issues. What do you mean by unavailable? Do I need to start hording?
Cost wise, going the RE Speed route (when it was available in 2010) cost me around $500-600 in parts including the kit. I was starting from scratch and had to source the hubs, rotors and calipers + $299 kit. So that doesn't seem that unreasonable.
A kit that uses a radial mount caliper from Wilwood, Outlaw, Baer, etc would be better. But....starting my broken record again.....give me a HUB. I can do the rest.
I searched the Ausrotary forums and found good reviews on their hardware.
They sell steels hubs (with dual lug patterns!) for small and large bearing FB spindles. The hubs use the standard FB bearings/seals and accommodate FC rotors that can be drilled to suit the lug pattern. Also sold in kit form with a machined steel caliper bracket for S4/S5 calipers.
Our kit includes Steel Front Hubs, caliper brackets and mounting hardware to fit the popular RX7 Series 4/5 276 mm or Series 6 294 diameter disc and caliper set.
Hubs are available in std 4 on 114.3 pattern or 4 on 110 and 5 on 114.3. Dual pattern hubs add $25 to kit price.
Upgrade bearing kit. Contains 2 bearings, steel sleeves and grease caps. Add $75.00
Our kit uses 12 x 1.5 studs and the std Mazda bearings, seal and grease cap. Price: $795.00
That seems like a pretty good deal to me. $795 AUD is $570 USD.
And I am the Canadian constantly paying +30% on exchange rate with USD and then +13% sales tax on that. Not to mention shipping.
Ive been looking into the nissan s13 hub/brake swap. It looks like it bolts up with very little modification. Need the s13 spindle, hub, lower arms, and s13 coilovers. Coilover and brake option's are endless. Parts are cheap and available anywhere. I want to keep my 4x110 lug bolt pattern. So i would need to redrill the stock s13 hubs to 4x110. There is a video on YouTube on how to do it.
While earlier reports were good, more recently people have had major delays and quality control issues with the MSF hubs. I've seen a video of someone physically able to pull the hub fore and aft on the stub axle. I have also seen two people with the FC brake conversion have the calipers foul on the front swaybar. See eg FC brakes on Series 2 rx7 - AusRotary
There are lots of Australian workshop that offer similar 1st gen brake upgrades with better quality: ACBron Motorsport, Garage48, Pac Performance etc. ACBron also now does a complete modern modular large bearing hub assembly for 1st gens (originally designed for Abel Ibarra's RX-2). See:
As for 4 pot FC/FD calipers on smaller discs, why bother? It will offer greater and more even clamping force, but you won't change the rate at which the rotors heat up from stock, which is what will cause the brakes to fade. If anything, you'll just be able to lock up the brakes more easily and heat up the rotors quicker. Better to just stick with GSLSE brakes with better pads and fluid IMO and not stuff around with a conversion and wheel fitment. Let's also not forget the most important part of the equation: tyres. If you're sticking with 13 or 14 inch wheels, chances are you won't be using tyres which can truly take advantage of better brakes. FWIW I also note that FD calipers are now easier to find and rebuild than FC calipers and offer slightly better inner wheel clearance as well, as they are slightly more compact. If you were going to stick with Mazda calipers, I'd go FD. Otherwise, I'd be looking at Wilwood calipers, which for you guys in the US would be much cheaper than they are here in Australia.
The ACBRON set up looks more robust since it literally does away with the small, stock spindle by cutting it off (I asked them) and the huge bearing+hub unit is bolted in its place. Not reversible if that's important.
I may pull the trigger on that this year. Only snag I see is eventual bearing replacement since it's integrated with the hub. They also said in 4 years they haven't had customers on street or track need replacements.
Bit of a bump as no ones been here for a little while...
Does anyone have a successful update for the rear calipers? We run a GSL-SE rear end and brakes. The calipers have become un-available and ours have developed a stiction problem giving uneven and excessive wear. I'm looking into 03-05 Mazda 6 rear calipers as they use the same pad so I'm hoping aside from an adapter bracket they should fit well on the GSL-SE rear rotor.
... um HUBS
