any of you ever read threads at rx8.com ?
06-23-06, 04:54 PM
#1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
any of you ever read threads at rx8.com ?
man, they have problems on that side. 04 rx8's....engines been replaced...like twice ! coolant dissappearing, squeaky brakes, motor mounts, rough idle, recalls, pcm being reflashed........blah blah.
I'm sure all of us first gen owners aspire to having an 8 one day....but gee whiz...our first gen's don't have problems like these guys are having...and there are like 20 years difference between the cars !
I'm sure all of us first gen owners aspire to having an 8 one day....but gee whiz...our first gen's don't have problems like these guys are having...and there are like 20 years difference between the cars !
06-23-06, 05:01 PM
#2
actually, my dad has had his rx8 forever, he has not had any problems with it.
He went in for the recall, but its been on alotta road trips and it is an everyday driver.
What happens is, people buy these cars, and they rag them out, floor it and everything else. the new rx8 is more of a family car then a race car, with gas milege and everything. the transmission is light for the sporty feel.
I can guarentee you, if you drive your car like a regular car, and red line it maybe once every 6th months, it will stay healthy.
but if you floor it every turn, you will tear up your engine.
hes had his since 04, it was on the showfloor when he bought it.
He went in for the recall, but its been on alotta road trips and it is an everyday driver.
What happens is, people buy these cars, and they rag them out, floor it and everything else. the new rx8 is more of a family car then a race car, with gas milege and everything. the transmission is light for the sporty feel.
I can guarentee you, if you drive your car like a regular car, and red line it maybe once every 6th months, it will stay healthy.
but if you floor it every turn, you will tear up your engine.
hes had his since 04, it was on the showfloor when he bought it.
06-23-06, 05:19 PM
#4
Rotary Freak
Originally Posted by Nicholas P.
actually, my dad has had his rx8 forever, he has not had any problems with it.
He went in for the recall, but its been on alotta road trips and it is an everyday driver.
What happens is, people buy these cars, and they rag them out, floor it and everything else. the new rx8 is more of a family car then a race car, with gas milege and everything. the transmission is light for the sporty feel.
I can guarentee you, if you drive your car like a regular car, and red line it maybe once every 6th months, it will stay healthy.
but if you floor it every turn, you will tear up your engine.
hes had his since 04, it was on the showfloor when he bought it.
He went in for the recall, but its been on alotta road trips and it is an everyday driver.
What happens is, people buy these cars, and they rag them out, floor it and everything else. the new rx8 is more of a family car then a race car, with gas milege and everything. the transmission is light for the sporty feel.
I can guarentee you, if you drive your car like a regular car, and red line it maybe once every 6th months, it will stay healthy.
but if you floor it every turn, you will tear up your engine.
hes had his since 04, it was on the showfloor when he bought it.
"only floor it every six monts or you'll tear up your engine!"
That's the silliest thing I've heard all day.
PS: I am an FB owner who doesn't aspire to own an 8.
Last edited by Alex-7; 06-23-06 at 05:23 PM.
06-23-06, 05:22 PM
#5
Senior Member
Thread Starter
check out this thread. It'll make you never want to buy a used 8. And if you do....bring the guy right down on price....he is so fustrated he'll want to give the car away.....and so you'll end up with an 04 8 with a new/reman engine that he paid $30k for and sold to you for $10k !
http://www.rx8club.com/showthread.php?t=68582
this is a thread for people who have had their engines replaced....there is like 100 posts !
http://www.rx8club.com/showthread.php?t=68582
this is a thread for people who have had their engines replaced....there is like 100 posts !
06-23-06, 05:31 PM
#6
Rotary Freak
I assure you that there have been startling numbers of engines replaced under waranty with every generation of RX-7. (or with every rotary powered car ever produced)
This is nothing new. How do you think the rotary got such a bad rap?
It was relativly common (compaired to other cars) for FB's FC's and esspecially FD's to have new motors in them by the time they hit 30k from new.
They don't tollerate over heating, they don't tollerate running low on oil or going to long between changes. They simply don't tollerate a multitude of things that a large percentage of new car buyers (read: non rotor heads) are going to do/expect a new car to deal with.
This is nothing new. How do you think the rotary got such a bad rap?
It was relativly common (compaired to other cars) for FB's FC's and esspecially FD's to have new motors in them by the time they hit 30k from new.
They don't tollerate over heating, they don't tollerate running low on oil or going to long between changes. They simply don't tollerate a multitude of things that a large percentage of new car buyers (read: non rotor heads) are going to do/expect a new car to deal with.
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06-23-06, 06:11 PM
#10
I owned an 04 RX-8 for 1 year,and I loved it.I never had one major issue aside from the squeeling brakes,which was fixed under warrenty.I loved the car,and I miss it very much.I think just the opposite on the whole redline thing.I figure these engines were made to be revved,so therefore I did it on a regular basis.The early cars made in 03 were a bit problematic,but not every one of them.I had a model built in 04,and it was up to date on all the computer flashes,and the A/C was fixed before I got it.I would like to get another one some day(in whitewater pearl this time),and maybe some day it will happen.
Before you all wonder why I got rid of it so early,it was a 2 year lease that I got out of early just because we bought a new house,and the payments even though they were low were better spent on the mortgage than on a car that was a toy.
Chris
79 GS
83 LE parts car
74 RE/PU
Before you all wonder why I got rid of it so early,it was a 2 year lease that I got out of early just because we bought a new house,and the payments even though they were low were better spent on the mortgage than on a car that was a toy.
Chris
79 GS
83 LE parts car
74 RE/PU
06-23-06, 10:56 PM
#13
I have a first gen, and I have an '04 RX-8 which I bought January of 04. The car was manufactured in Nov '03. It's got 39K on it right now. The first gen has 189K on it. I drive both cars a lot and hard. I take it to redline at least every day I drive it. The buzzer isn't as loud as the 1st gen, but you can still hear it. I won the B-stock class champion in my region last year in my RX-8 and take it on many weekend track days... Road Atlanta, Roebling Road, CMP, etc. I drive the **** out of it. The only modification the RX-8 has are brake pads, a front sway, and R-compound tires. It's fast, handles like a dream, and the brakes will empty your tear ducts when you stand on them. It's a wonderful car!
I've had no problems with the RX-8 outside of TSB's which Mazda has gratiously supplied service for. It was a first model year, so I knew stuff like that was going to happen. Is the car babied, no, it's driven hard, but very well cared for. The oil is changed maticulously, the brakes are checked, the fluids are replaced, and the car is usually looked over with a fine tooth comb. It has no squeaks for rattles and it still impresses me every time I drive it. I love it. I wake up every morning and can't wait to drive to work (I also have this feeling in the RX-7 btw). Why do you hear about the problems, because people don't go online and post, "DAMN, I've driven for 2.5 years and have had no problem!!!" You usually just hear about the bad stuff.
The first gen also gets the **** driven out of it, but is also very well taken care of. There isn't anything wrong with either car, you just have to take care of them. OK, the first gen has a couple things, but it's 22 years old.
I've had no problems with the RX-8 outside of TSB's which Mazda has gratiously supplied service for. It was a first model year, so I knew stuff like that was going to happen. Is the car babied, no, it's driven hard, but very well cared for. The oil is changed maticulously, the brakes are checked, the fluids are replaced, and the car is usually looked over with a fine tooth comb. It has no squeaks for rattles and it still impresses me every time I drive it. I love it. I wake up every morning and can't wait to drive to work (I also have this feeling in the RX-7 btw). Why do you hear about the problems, because people don't go online and post, "DAMN, I've driven for 2.5 years and have had no problem!!!" You usually just hear about the bad stuff.
The first gen also gets the **** driven out of it, but is also very well taken care of. There isn't anything wrong with either car, you just have to take care of them. OK, the first gen has a couple things, but it's 22 years old.
06-23-06, 11:59 PM
#14
Well think of it this way. Naturally, a lot of people are going to go to forums specifically because they have a problem. What about the majority that never has a problem and therefore never goes to forums looking for help? With something close to 200,000 cars in circulation, its hard to determine a good idea of reliability from a single forum.
06-24-06, 01:46 AM
#15
I think it is very true that mainly people with problems seek out forums to get support and empathy. I also think it is true that those who are lucky enough not to have problems tend to presume those with problems are abusing their cars or were just unlucky*. I think the truth is probably somewhere in the middle.
What I do find disturbing is that Mazda apparently voided an RX-8 warrantee due to the owner having installed a cone air filter and a cat-back. That's it. At least, that's what our customer claimed when he sent his RENESIS engine to us for a rebuild. At least it gave us an opportunity to work on one. Since most are under warrantee, the aftermarket has not had much chance to play with them. On the other hand, what we saw was scary. Due to the rotor chamfering to change port timing, pieces of broken apex seals get wedged between the rotor and the side housings and tear EVERYTHING up beyond hope of re-using, no matter how low your standards are. Seriously, you can only salvage one side housing, one rotor housing, one rotor and the eccentric shaft...two side housings, one rotor and one rotor housing are automatically junk. At least with a conventional peripheral-exhaust rotary engine, all the side housings are typically safe, so you only buy a rotor and rotor housing.
The engines are still a marvel of engineering and I hope they keep plugging away to make them more robust. That will only happen if the car sells, so I hope owners won't be too troubled and recommend them to friends. Every RX-8 I've driven has been great and I'd like to own one myself some day.
*EDIT: Please don't think I am pointing fingers; just making an observation. Personally (and kind of ironically) I have never blown a rotary engine myself -- despite years of trying in everything from stock to peripheral port and NA to N2O -- so I tend to wonder what the hell someone did wrong to blow theirs, particularly when they have a history of it. Unlucky? I dunno. Chance can explain a great deal, but I also believe luck favors those who help themselves.
What I do find disturbing is that Mazda apparently voided an RX-8 warrantee due to the owner having installed a cone air filter and a cat-back. That's it. At least, that's what our customer claimed when he sent his RENESIS engine to us for a rebuild. At least it gave us an opportunity to work on one. Since most are under warrantee, the aftermarket has not had much chance to play with them. On the other hand, what we saw was scary. Due to the rotor chamfering to change port timing, pieces of broken apex seals get wedged between the rotor and the side housings and tear EVERYTHING up beyond hope of re-using, no matter how low your standards are. Seriously, you can only salvage one side housing, one rotor housing, one rotor and the eccentric shaft...two side housings, one rotor and one rotor housing are automatically junk. At least with a conventional peripheral-exhaust rotary engine, all the side housings are typically safe, so you only buy a rotor and rotor housing.
The engines are still a marvel of engineering and I hope they keep plugging away to make them more robust. That will only happen if the car sells, so I hope owners won't be too troubled and recommend them to friends. Every RX-8 I've driven has been great and I'd like to own one myself some day.
*EDIT: Please don't think I am pointing fingers; just making an observation. Personally (and kind of ironically) I have never blown a rotary engine myself -- despite years of trying in everything from stock to peripheral port and NA to N2O -- so I tend to wonder what the hell someone did wrong to blow theirs, particularly when they have a history of it. Unlucky? I dunno. Chance can explain a great deal, but I also believe luck favors those who help themselves.
Last edited by Blake; 06-24-06 at 01:58 AM.
06-24-06, 07:59 AM
#16
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I just recently bought my 17th RX-7...
My 1st first gen (85 GSL-SE) in over a decade and the love came back quickly!
I also have never blown one...
Every Rx-8 driver I have talked to seems to LOVE their cars as well...
The importance of service/oil changes, checking the oil can never be overstated...
I sometimes get people asking about the engine and thinking its unreliable...I say... yes, it can be if your not smart enough to check your oil & take care of it...Usually rolling my eyes as I say it for added effect!
My 1st first gen (85 GSL-SE) in over a decade and the love came back quickly!
I also have never blown one...
Every Rx-8 driver I have talked to seems to LOVE their cars as well...
The importance of service/oil changes, checking the oil can never be overstated...
I sometimes get people asking about the engine and thinking its unreliable...I say... yes, it can be if your not smart enough to check your oil & take care of it...Usually rolling my eyes as I say it for added effect!
06-24-06, 08:12 AM
#17
Originally Posted by Dougster
Every Rx-8 driver I have talked to seems to LOVE their cars as well...
The people who are on the RX-8 forum, like most forums, are those who are either enthusiasts, or have a question. Plus the occasional asshat who wants to cause trouble... Therefore, you'll end up hearing about what went wrong and what issues people have. There is a poll on the 8 forum about what people like their cars. Take a look at that. Most of the folks love it.
06-24-06, 01:18 PM
#18
06-24-06, 02:47 PM
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The two main issues I have heard about from RX8 owners are either ECU issues, or engine issues.
ECU issues will occur on ANY vehicle equiped with an ECU. Plain and simple, electronics can/will fail at a given rate, no matter what they are operating.
The engine failures I have hear about, generally tend to be oil related. More specificly, OMP related. The OMP is controlled by the ECU (see above) and can fail.
I have an '83 GS, and most of the RX8 owners I know would kill for the kind of fuel mileage I average, but are otherwise tickled pink with their cars.
Since I have an old car, I don't rely solely upon the OMP to provide the oiling needed to allow the engine to live, even though it is mechanical, and has not been known to fail very often. I still have it hooked up, but I also premix 2 stroke oil in the gas at a rate of ~1/2oz per gallon of gas. This is not quite enough oil for most conditions, but is plenty when coupled with the stock output of the OMP. It is also enough oil to prevent catastrophic engine damage should the OMP fail to deliver it's share. I also check the oil at least 3 times per tank of fuel, so I would have a little better notice, should the OMP fail to provide the oil.
I don't have a desire to own a RX8, but if I did, you can bet I would continue this habit of adding 2 stroke oil to the fuel, as a safety measure.
I truely hope the Rotary engine continues to be refined and sold for a long time to come. They are remarkable feats of engineering. Simplicity at it's most complex.......
ECU issues will occur on ANY vehicle equiped with an ECU. Plain and simple, electronics can/will fail at a given rate, no matter what they are operating.
The engine failures I have hear about, generally tend to be oil related. More specificly, OMP related. The OMP is controlled by the ECU (see above) and can fail.
I have an '83 GS, and most of the RX8 owners I know would kill for the kind of fuel mileage I average, but are otherwise tickled pink with their cars.
Since I have an old car, I don't rely solely upon the OMP to provide the oiling needed to allow the engine to live, even though it is mechanical, and has not been known to fail very often. I still have it hooked up, but I also premix 2 stroke oil in the gas at a rate of ~1/2oz per gallon of gas. This is not quite enough oil for most conditions, but is plenty when coupled with the stock output of the OMP. It is also enough oil to prevent catastrophic engine damage should the OMP fail to deliver it's share. I also check the oil at least 3 times per tank of fuel, so I would have a little better notice, should the OMP fail to provide the oil.
I don't have a desire to own a RX8, but if I did, you can bet I would continue this habit of adding 2 stroke oil to the fuel, as a safety measure.
I truely hope the Rotary engine continues to be refined and sold for a long time to come. They are remarkable feats of engineering. Simplicity at it's most complex.......
06-24-06, 02:55 PM
#21
Senior Member
Thread Starter
i like that.....simplicity at its most complex !
yep...you've touched on a few points there. the rx8 def has more electronics. the throttle is controlled electronically as well (drive by wire)...no more throttle cable.
and here i go bastardising my own thread....but since you mentioned the premix thing...I thought the ratio was 1 to 100...ie I use a 200ml bottle of two stroke per 20 litres of 95 octane unleaded.
As I am using a 48ida, i do not have a linkage between the carb and the omp. I am using the mechanical omp, and i have linked it up to the two oil injector points directly into the housings (s5)
So in summary, at all times my omp is pumping at idle speed and i am premixing at ratio of 100-1
yep...you've touched on a few points there. the rx8 def has more electronics. the throttle is controlled electronically as well (drive by wire)...no more throttle cable.
and here i go bastardising my own thread....but since you mentioned the premix thing...I thought the ratio was 1 to 100...ie I use a 200ml bottle of two stroke per 20 litres of 95 octane unleaded.
As I am using a 48ida, i do not have a linkage between the carb and the omp. I am using the mechanical omp, and i have linked it up to the two oil injector points directly into the housings (s5)
So in summary, at all times my omp is pumping at idle speed and i am premixing at ratio of 100-1
06-24-06, 03:07 PM
#22
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Since you do not have the OMP linkage hooked up, then you do need to mix at around a 1:100 ratio. I still have the linkage, and it still supplies oil at or near factory settings, so I mix at a far lower ratio, just as a safety measure.
I have a freind that builds rotaries, and he agrees with my line of thinking, in that a little too much oil is far better than too little. So what if my plugs only lasted 10K before they needed to be replaced. Most people have trouble getting 10K, or even 5K from a set.
Simplicity at it's most Complex. 3 moving parts, how much simpler can it be? 30 individual metal seals that must all work together, How much more complex could it be? Simple, add electronic fuel injection...........
I have a freind that builds rotaries, and he agrees with my line of thinking, in that a little too much oil is far better than too little. So what if my plugs only lasted 10K before they needed to be replaced. Most people have trouble getting 10K, or even 5K from a set.
Simplicity at it's most Complex. 3 moving parts, how much simpler can it be? 30 individual metal seals that must all work together, How much more complex could it be? Simple, add electronic fuel injection...........
06-24-06, 03:07 PM
#23
I think two people here nailed it:
1. These cars can't put up with stupidity like low oil (OMP mean anything to you guys?) or overheating (plate warpage.. *shudders).
2. People come to forums when they have problems or need advice. Ergo, with a car as popular as the Rx8, there are going to be a ton of people coming either to share their problems or ask advice about body kits and ricer accessories.
It's like working in a callcentre for an internet company. Nobody ever calls you and says "hey, my internet works perfectly, thanks". They always call when it's broken. If you judged everything by the calls you got, you'd think the service was **** because it's always broken.
So if you judge the Rx8 by the posts on the rx8club forum, you'd think the same thing.
Redline = always
Low oil = never
Maintain your car, drive it like you stole it, and it'll always treat you well.
Jon
1. These cars can't put up with stupidity like low oil (OMP mean anything to you guys?) or overheating (plate warpage.. *shudders).
2. People come to forums when they have problems or need advice. Ergo, with a car as popular as the Rx8, there are going to be a ton of people coming either to share their problems or ask advice about body kits and ricer accessories.
It's like working in a callcentre for an internet company. Nobody ever calls you and says "hey, my internet works perfectly, thanks". They always call when it's broken. If you judged everything by the calls you got, you'd think the service was **** because it's always broken.
So if you judge the Rx8 by the posts on the rx8club forum, you'd think the same thing.
Redline = always
Low oil = never
Maintain your car, drive it like you stole it, and it'll always treat you well.
Jon
06-24-06, 09:05 PM
#25
Originally Posted by Nicholas P.
Why is it a need to redline it always. The video just sais once a month?