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So I just purchased an 82 gsl shell and i am going to put the engine from my 84 gslse into it,
I am just wondering how big of a job this is going to be, Will i have to tear apart the whole interior to swap the wiring harness? Will swapping the subframe from the gslse let it bolt right in? and does the subframe bolt in? Overall how easy is it to do. And what do you recommend doing.
I am fairly new to rotary cars so I don’t know a lot about them
Thanks, Trevor
Is keeping the GSLSE EFI paramount? I went pretty far in the committing to my swap.( See my build thread)
that said, if you have the GSLSE subframe, that will help. The crossbar that the motor mounts to is the same between the 12a and 13b. I think the subframe is a few mm off. Some cut away to make it fit, I bought the racing beat adapter. If you have an SE donor car, you should be good.
the easiest option is to keep the 82 radiator and oil cooler.
yes, if you want to keep the stock EFI, you would need to swap the dash. Go to foxed.ca for factory manuals to understand the electrical schematics.
A consideration could be to using a 6port carbureted manifold. Unfortunately it seems racing beat has a real supply issue. So this simple answer may be the hardest.
Is keeping the GSLSE EFI paramount? I went pretty far in the committing to my swap.( See my build thread)
that said, if you have the GSLSE subframe, that will help. The crossbar that the motor mounts to is the same between the 12a and 13b. I think the subframe is a few mm off. Some cut away to make it fit, I bought the racing beat adapter. If you have an SE donor car, you should be good.
the easiest option is to keep the 82 radiator and oil cooler.
yes, if you want to keep the stock EFI, you would need to swap the dash. Go to foxed.ca for factory manuals to understand the electrical schematics.
A consideration could be to using a 6port carbureted manifold. Unfortunately it seems racing beat has a real supply issue. So this simple answer may be the hardest.
lots of work. Either way.
So yeah i will be keeping the EFI on the 13b, I’ll also install an upgraded rad so won’t be keeping that on the 12a car, I have a complete gslse parts car so anything i need i can swap. I was also planning on swapping the dash so i could convert it from gsl to gslse.
I've done this swap in my 85 and can help with many things. My first question is, if you have a complete GSL-SE, why not just restore that? A more valuable car and likely less headache.
My car looks like a completely stock 85 GS but i put a 13B from GSL-SE in it.. did the swap back in 2008.
I would take the 13b and install it without the factory fuel injection.....I'll get a Webber or even upgrade to a Sniper EFI. The factory fuel injection system of the 84-85 GSL-SE sucks... I think it's a step back on what the 13b should be ...... IMHO.......
I would take the 13b and install it without the factory fuel injection.....I'll get a Webber or even upgrade to a Sniper EFI. The factory fuel injection system of the 84-85 GSL-SE sucks... I think it's a step back on what the 13b should be ...... IMHO.......
Waayyyy to expensive lol, and i don’t want to run carby, Would an s4 intake and fuel injection be better?
I've done this swap in my 85 and can help with many things. My first question is, if you have a complete GSL-SE, why not just restore that? A more valuable car and likely less headache.
My car looks like a completely stock 85 GS but i put a 13B from GSL-SE in it.. did the swap back in 2008.
Thats a nice looking rx7! So the se has a lot of rust.
And there’s more where they came from. So i bought a gsl shell that’s rust free so i have no issues with rust
How hard was it wiring up the engine? and what did you do to wire it? Like a full harness swap or what
Is keeping the GSLSE EFI paramount? I went pretty far in the committing to my swap.( See my build thread)
that said, if you have the GSLSE subframe, that will help. The crossbar that the motor mounts to is the same between the 12a and 13b. I think the subframe is a few mm off. Some cut away to make it fit, I bought the racing beat adapter. If you have an SE donor car, you should be good.
the easiest option is to keep the 82 radiator and oil cooler.
yes, if you want to keep the stock EFI, you would need to swap the dash. Go to foxed.ca for factory manuals to understand the electrical schematics.
A consideration could be to using a 6port carbureted manifold. Unfortunately it seems racing beat has a real supply issue. So this simple answer may be the hardest.
lots of work. Either way.
Which build thread lmao, So i could keep the 12a subframe too because it has less km on it which is nice, if just need to get an engine mount adapter thing? I’d like to keep efi. Also id end up upgrading the radiator while everything is apart.
I understand why you want to use the other shell. That SE is pretty far gone. Its still fixable but would require another clean car to take sections from.
As for the wiring, I bought an entire GSL-SE wiring harness and installed it. I removed the entire interior and removed the original harness and installed the SE one in place of it. The harness fit perfectly as my car has the same body as a GSL-SE. All 84-85's had the new SE body. Meaning all cars had the mounting points for the front mount oil cooler, mounting points for the air box already there with captive nuts, captive nuts for the switching valve set on the firewall, and all of the harness and ecu mounts.
You will have to swap the dash and entire hvac system over from the SE. Not an issue because it will be apart anyways. I'm unsure if the dash mounts are different in an S2 versus the S3. If so, you may have to make dash mounts. You will also want to use the brake and clutch pedal set from the GSL-SE. You will also need the SE throttle cable.
I did make my own fuel feed line out of aluminum line I bought from summit racing. I used the original feed line as my return line. The GSL-SE fuel pump and filter bolted right in place. I bought a nice SE fuel tank and used the SE exhaust. This is needed to operate the 5th and 6th port actuators. They run off of exhaust backpressure and there is a tune on the main catalytic converter that feeds the actuators the required backpressure.
I understand why you want to use the other shell. That SE is pretty far gone. Its still fixable but would require another clean car to take sections from.
As for the wiring, I bought an entire GSL-SE wiring harness and installed it. I removed the entire interior and removed the original harness and installed the SE one in place of it. The harness fit perfectly as my car has the same body as a GSL-SE. All 84-85's had the new SE body. Meaning all cars had the mounting points for the front mount oil cooler, mounting points for the air box already there with captive nuts, captive nuts for the switching valve set on the firewall, and all of the harness and ecu mounts.
You will have to swap the dash and entire hvac system over from the SE. Not an issue because it will be apart anyways. I'm unsure if the dash mounts are different in an S2 versus the S3. If so, you may have to make dash mounts. You will also want to use the brake and clutch pedal set from the GSL-SE. You will also need the SE throttle cable.
I did make my own fuel feed line out of aluminum line I bought from summit racing. I used the original feed line as my return line. The GSL-SE fuel pump and filter bolted right in place. I bought a nice SE fuel tank and used the SE exhaust. This is needed to operate the 5th and 6th port actuators. They run off of exhaust backpressure and there is a tune on the main catalytic converter that feeds the actuators the required backpressure.
Is that all i’d need to do? Swap the dash, Few parts here and there. One quick question, If I put an aftermarket exhaust will the actuators work? Because My exhaust has rust holes where the hangers would be. How difficult was it to swap the whole harness? I’m guessing you just have to know how they work
I opted for a stand alone ECU for the Renesis swap into my 1980 RX7.
Since you have both cars .. it should be "relatively" easy to swap everything from your GSL-SE over to your 82 GSL. Just take your time and map everything out very carefully.
Would an s4 intake and fuel injection be better? Yes .. however you might end up chasing too many demons all at one time.
I would recommend getting your GSL-SE swap done first and running properly. Run your new car for a season or two .. and then upgrade to an S4 intake at a later date if you feel the want or need to do so.
I'm picking up a 1983 GSL project car from downtown Hamilton. I still have my 13B GSL-SE engine .. so I might end up doing the exact same swap as you.
I opted for a stand alone ECU for the Renesis swap into my 1980 RX7.
Since you have both cars .. it should be "relatively" easy to swap everything from your GSL-SE over to your 82 GSL. Just take your time and map everything out very carefully.
Would an s4 intake and fuel injection be better? Yes .. however you might end up chasing too many demons all at one time.
I would recommend getting your GSL-SE swap done first and running properly. Run your new car for a season or two .. and then upgrade to an S4 intake at a later date if you feel the want or need to do so.
I'm picking up a 1983 GSL project car from downtown Hamilton. I still have my 13B GSL-SE engine .. so I might end up doing the exact same swap as you.
whats your #?
Also where do you get your parts and stuff for this swap.
So I think i’ll eventually turbocharge the 13b, But for now when i rewire everything i don’t want to run an aftermarket ecu and s4 intake so i know that if it doesn’t start or there are issues it’s the wiring and not the ecu etc
Waayyyy to expensive lol, and i don’t want to run carby, Would an s4 intake and fuel injection be better?
I seen videos of guys that had 13b factory injected cars and had a ton of problems.....idle problems, hot start problems, cold start problems...every problem under the rainbow ....
One of them is running a Webber after a year trying to make the fuel injection run right... and it's on his Rally car and he loves it ....
I don't think it's that expensive ...but it will save you a lot of headaches on the future......good luck......
Also where do you get your parts and stuff for this swap?
Hey Trevor - you can reach me through the PM section of this forum.
For swapping your 13B into your 12A .. you should have everything needed except maybe an RB front engine mount. If you want or need to upgrade/replace any engine parts, I usually order from Atkins Rotary.
I seen videos of guys that had 13b factory injected cars and had a ton of problems.....idle problems, hot start problems, cold start problems...every problem under the rainbow ....
One of them is running a Webber after a year trying to make the fuel injection run right... and it's on his Rally car and he loves it ....
I don't think it's that expensive ...but it will save you a lot of headaches on the future......good luck......
Either way i’ll try because tons of people have done it and been successful, If not i’ll run a carburated 13b.
The 84/85 GSL-SE fuel injection is the tried and true Bosch L-Jetronic that's been used by every car manufacturer over the years and in many different makes and models. Sure, Mazda went with some tricks in the intake path (*6-port actuators), but generally speaking the system is rock solid.
Problems with the stock EFI system, even after all these years, are overrated and mostly mimicked by guys coming from carbeurated engines who are expecting a simpler system. I've been running the stock SE intake with cold air box fed from a NACA headlight lid, RB exhaust, and the EFI has never been an issue. The car drives great, I never have problems with flooding due to needle valves and seats, and even the high pressure fuel pump ran at 225k miles.
I agree with the others that OP might want to install everything to stock -SE specs with the stock wiring harness and do a straigh swap. This way, any issues can be ironed out before introducing more variables like an S4 intake and ECU change. Better men have gotten stalled chasing dragons from changing too much at one time (*me, included).
The 84/85 GSL-SE was Mazda's first production fuel injected rotary engine. IMHO fuel injection is a far better choice for a daily driver.
Having said that, I can totally appreciate why a weber carb might be a better choice for someone that has a dedicated track car or rally car.
Here's a very educational video that I watched recently that explains the pros and cons of carburetors vs. port fuel injection vs. direct fuel injection.
yes, if you want to keep the stock EFI, you would need to swap the dash. Go to foxed.ca for factory manuals to understand the electrical schematics.
Does the ECU need to communicate with something in the dash?
My first rebuild was putting an S4 EFI system and engine in my '82 and it didn't need anything there. All the connectors for the gauges and tach carried over.
As consideration, if the GSLSE wiring is swapped over , future troubleshooting could be easier than having an amalgamation of two harnesses tied together. I can’t state enough, given the early stages of the OPs journey into rotaries, my understanding of budget concerns he has and the luxury of having the complete GSLSE at his disposal. Putting the stock OEM GSLSE hardware into the 82 chassis would likely be the most frugal and reliable way to get on the road.
I did this swap... reegi engine into an SA22C. Don't judge me... I was on a budget.
I just took everything from a rusted out GSLSE (holes in the floor) I got off kijiji for 1000 bucks. This was a while ago and I'm sure there's more than what I'm listing here, but I was able to solve most issues without really spending any money using parts off the parts car. It was very bolt-on. The car was my dd for nearly 3 years after this swap, and I still drive it in the summer. Still hasn't broken at all, although I'm pretty meticulous about maintenance.
Extra work I had to do (probably not a complete list):
- Modify the engine bracket to fit the larger engine (standard 13b swap stuff)
- Make a little mount for the ecu, as well as punch a couple holes in the firewall for the wiring. I was able to reuse grommets off the parts car
- Shifter winds up being a couple inches back. I don't notice when I drive, but I had to do a weeee bit of tranny tunnel mods to make it fit
- SA22C has a full size spare, so the '85 tank didn't fit. I cut out the areas around the spare tire well and swapped them. A bit of welding but not much
- Solder some connections (eg. the '85 headlight/taillight connections needed to be put on the '80 lights)
- Make a bracket for the '85 oil cooler
- I don't remember if I had to take the '85 steering column, but I'm pretty sure I did. Don't remember how that worked
- (Optional) New rad, coolant lines, bushings, brake lines, fuel sender unit, springs/shocks, general sprucing up. Now's a good time
Pros/cons of this method:
- Interior is totally different (I was able to keep the stock shift **** and steering wheel)
- Bolt pattern is different (because I wanted the big brakes - not part of the engine swap) so I can't use the stock wheels
- "Purity"?
+ cheap, fast, and fun
+ fuel injection > carb (for me anyways)
+ it all works nearly bolt on
+ big brakes and LSD
+ 13b
For the record, I LOVE driving this car. I always did, but post-swap it just feels like a little go-kart.
Roland
Last edited by UnregisteredSA22C; 01-28-22 at 11:28 AM.
I did this swap... reegi engine into an SA22C. Don't judge me... I was on a budget.
I just took everything from a rusted out GSLSE (holes in the floor) I got off kijiji for 1000 bucks. This was a while ago and I'm sure there's more than what I'm listing here, but I was able to solve most issues without really spending any money using parts off the parts car. It was very bolt-on. The car was my dd for nearly 3 years after this swap, and I still drive it in the summer. Still hasn't broken at all, although I'm pretty meticulous about maintenance.
Extra work I had to do (probably not a complete list):
- Modify the engine bracket to fit the larger engine (standard 13b swap stuff)
- Make a little mount for the ecu, as well as punch a couple holes in the firewall for the wiring. I was able to reuse grommets off the parts car
- Shifter winds up being a couple inches back. I don't notice when I drive, but I had to do a weeee bit of tranny tunnel mods to make it fit
- SA22C has a full size spare, so the '85 tank didn't fit. I cut out the areas around the spare tire well and swapped them. A bit of welding but not much
- Solder some connections (eg. the '85 headlight/taillight connections needed to be put on the '80 lights)
- Make a bracket for the '85 oil cooler
- I don't remember if I had to take the '85 steering column, but I'm pretty sure I did. Don't remember how that worked
- (Optional) New rad, coolant lines, bushings, brake lines, fuel sender unit, springs/shocks, general sprucing up. Now's a good time
Pros/cons of this method:
- Interior is totally different (I was able to keep the stock shift **** and steering wheel)
- Bolt pattern is different (because I wanted the big brakes - not part of the engine swap) so I can't use the stock wheels
- "Purity"?
+ cheap, fast, and fun
+ fuel injection > carb (for me anyways)
+ it all works nearly bolt on
+ big brakes and LSD
+ 13b
For the record, I LOVE driving this car. I always did, but post-swap it just feels like a little go-kart.
Roland
Thanks for that, I don’t know if i’m going to be doing an axle and subframe/suspension swap. The SE brakes on all four corners are siezed. While the gsl ones are not, i’d love to have the 114.3 bolt pattern but it might not be worth it, Anyone know where to get new calipers? Or just rebuild kits for the calipers since I don’t think they make them anymore.
Shifter:
I think the hole for the shifter is a bit more forward for the 12a cars, As long as i’m swapping to gslse interior like I plan to, It should work ( With some cutting of the trans tunnel)?
Fueling:
I will run all new fuel lines, but if the tank on it is still good i’ll just weld a slosh cup into it, I believe the tank is 14 gallons and the se tank is 16 so not too much of a difference. Walbro 255 fuel pump and an se pick up tube for the right line sizes.
01-03-22, 10:20 PM
