JALVORD_2003_68

Manntis, i'm not saying it's a bad motor (whether it is or not remains to be seen), but Mazda is doing anything to it so you could buy factory performance options. I think Mazda should champion the Rx-8 as a high performance machine, but they DON'T. What do they claim to be their "high output" car? The god dam Mazda 6! I have seen SO many commericals with the 6, or some other econobox models, but hardly ANY for the Rx-8. Mazda shouldn't wonder why they don't sell many rotaries because you have to go looking almost to hear anything about the new Rx-8. If they had as much press about the rx-8 as the dam 6, i bet they'd sell a lot more of 'em.

i_piss_on_hondas

Correct me if I am wrong but the turbo metros were 1.0 4 cyl's... before I die I will build one of those little bastards up... have to run overyone from a roll... the brakes on my 7 are bigger around then there flywheels are

hornbm

settle down man!
The rx-8 isnt even out yet so dont worry about the marketing yet. Mazda is marketing the mazda 6 as their high output car... because it IS for now!

You didnt see mazda advertising the mazda 6 as a "high output" car months before it came out did you?

The same holds true for the rx-8. When it is closer to being released i'm sure we will see PLENTY of comercials for the rx-8 emphasising performance.

Give it some time.

Spieder

The reason why you won't see ads for the RX8 is the same reason you didnt see ads for the RX7 3rd gen. It took one complete factory in Japan to make only a max of 2000 3rd gens a month. It will be the same for the RX-8. On the other hand, Mazda can produce about 50,000 Mazda 6's in the same factory.

Manufacturers typically make about 33 to 35 % above cost on a car. So, do the math:

RX-8:
2,000 * 30,000 * .33 => 20 Million a month possible net revenue.

Mazda 6:

50,000 * 20,000 * .33 => 330 Million a month possible revenue

So, what would you market?

Exotic cars are not bread winners but image creators. In the mid 90's Mazda had the sports car image. They sold more sports cars than any other manufacturer in the world for gross numbers (Miata, RX-7, MX-6, MX-3).

I think they want that image back.

Narcisse91

I hate to make random speculations, but I wonder if we'll see a new RX-7 in a year or two. Mazda refuses to compare the RX-8 to the RX-7, which leads me to believe its not a replacement...

Spieder

The RX-8 is touted as not a sports car but as a family orientated sports coupe. It does have 4 seats.

To me that is good news. A true sports car, like the 3rd gen's, are for enthusiasts and racers, not your daily drivers. The RX-8 is designed for your daily drivers. Like your BMW and Audi 2 door high line sports coupes.

Which means to me, that Mazda is trying to bring rotaries back into the houshold segment. It looks to me liek all the improvements for the Renesis are based on reliability changes. No turbo and being a LEV vehicle, which in CA grants access to special freeway lanes. Are all pluses.

If this goes well, we may start seeing Renesis motors in other vehicles.

You also need to remember that rotaries are well adapted to Hydrogen fuel due sperated processes, unlike predetonation in piston engines. Mazda has tested a fleet of 500 626's running hydrogen rotaries in the mid 90's with great success. The problem is fuel delivery, where will you get fuel?

There is currently a lot of buzz from Honda and Nissan and Toyota about how hydrogen will be the next fuel. Honda is releasing their hybrids in Ca. They have realized that battery powered cars aren't viable (actually really satiated the morons in government who had no clue but dictated them).

Once again, if Mazda is going to market their hydrogen rotary cars (like the HR-2 which looks like a cooper, but 10 years prior to today ),they need to get the public back on the band wagon to rotaries.

Another interesting piece of info, I was talking to a dealer about the RX-8. We discussed dealer markup since the RX-8's are on pre-order (only 31k for what I want). He said that Mazda has forbid the dealers from marking up the RX-8's above MSRP. So the idiots who are bidding on ebay for a contract to get the RX-8 for MSRp are morons.

It seems to me Mazda really wants people to afford this car and get it out to the public.

Manntis

When they say COST, are you sure they mean MSRP and not actual production cost?

Jaye

I thought I remembered either R&T or C&D saying that turbocharging the RENESIS was not feasible...I seem to remember something about the exhaust pressure being too low to drive a turbo...could have been something else though.

Spieder

No, it's above cost to make it. The numbers are from mid 90's not sure what mark up is now. Here's a rough break down of a Protege's cost for example:

MSRP: 14,500
Dealer Cost: 13,500 (Not counting any factory sponsored dealer programs)
Manufacturer cost: @ 9000 to 10,000, counting everything that goes into the car.

I am applying data that I read in an older motor trend from the mid 90's. They said that the average dealer profit margin (counting everything from the parts to the advertising) is about 25%. I meant 25% to 33 % not 35 to 33 %. This is typical.

Dell enjoys a total net profit of 20% above cost. Compaq was about 18%. Gateway for a while was at 25%.

Where the manufacturers make the big money, is in over priced accessories (650 dollar CD changers and what not). I am sure the profit margin on a stock RX-8 MSRP is half that of the tricked out model MSRP.

If you go to www.carpoint.msn.com and choose any new car, it will show you the raw dealer invoice cost for that vehicle and the MSRP. Your manufacturer profit will be around 25% of that invoice cost.