Circuit Theory

iTrader: (52)

Adam / 7-tune care to clarify why Shin is giving out his email address which is Shin@7tune.com ? Seems you were pretty adamant about Shin not having anything to do with 7tune in this post earlier.

Seems to me Shin works for 7tune in fact a simple google search of shin@7tune.com brought up multiple posts using the facebook account for 7tune in which Shin introduced himself as being 7tunes Sales/export manager.
7tune - Hello 7Tuners!! My name is Shin and I'm the... | Facebook

He also has multiple posts about R-magic parts for sale via the 7tune facebook page.

Not to mention you also refer to him in your recent article test driving the R-magic RX-8.

If anyone owes anyone an apology I would say you and shin owe these guys their money back or products as well as an apology for the "antics" I referred to earlier in this post.

I did call R-magic by the way and they were not too happy with Shin. Sadly I took you for your word and assumed Shin was not related to 7tune and so I did not bother mentioning anything about 7tune to the guys at R-magic. I will be sure to bring it up to them the next time I speak with them.

garagemoose

iTrader: (3)

Hmm

rx7roller02

7tune,

If Shin does not work for you, then please explain this, just one of many posts by him on the 7tune Facebook page....

https://www.facebook.com/7Tune/posts/637039566333483

Posted just five months ago. His "shin@7tune" email shows up all over the place....yet, he does not work for you? Please, enlighten us, how exactly did he get an email address on your domain name then?

Shin,

You are not allowed to sell as much as a single bolt on this forum until these issues are resolved. And among the issues that you need to resolve here is the fact that you have tried to align yourself with R Magic, when they state that you are not a part of their company, you do not work for them. Claiming that you are associated with a company that you really aren't is FRAUD and will not be tolerated here.

7Tune

Mate, you're more than welcome to. I have already spoken to Ohara san about all of this and we keep in touch. We are actually good friends and 7Tune's relationship with R-Magic will remain unchanged.

What has changed however is Shin's role ( or rather his lack there-of ) within the proposed organisation and we have parted company over a number of issues, this being one of them.

You are right in saying that Shin was part of 7Tune at one point (email address etc) and the plan was to have him handle the international sales and distribution network from this year forward but obviously, having seen all of these things, that have happened unbeknownst to me, that is not going to happen. I had absolutely no knowledge of any of the transactions that have taken place in this thread. Shin has also stated as much under the "R-Magic USA" banner that he has created here a few pages back.

As I have already stated, I have received neither orders, enquiries or emails nor money for these shift kits - not to mention the fact that I was only made aware of this entire thread when BM contacted me to ask what was going on.

What has transpired here is neither 7Tune's nor my responsibility as Shin has acted upon his own accord - thereby prompting my decision to put distance between myself and the brand and Shin's dealings with the members of this forum.

While I empathise with your predicament and understand that this is frustrating for you, your arguments and questions must be directed to Shin who is operating, as of 3 months ago, on his own.

The RX-8 article was written on the 17th of March, a month after it was shot - that was 5 months ago and as we all know, a lot has happened between now and then.

The culmination of all these matters has prompted my response.

The aim of my correspondence here is to clarify that Shin Sudo and 7Tune are not collaborating on anything business related, personally and professionally.

I owe you absolutely nothing - least of all an apology.

AZ

7Tune

Please see my previous post. Ohara san and I are taking this very seriously.

A lot has happened in the last 5 months... including, unfortunately, this entire debacle.

garagemoose

iTrader: (3)

I just want my money back or the products I was promised. Shin will not respond to me about this and paypal will do nothing because I placed order on March 11th.

Circuit Theory

iTrader: (52)

garagemoose: Good news Adam Zillin has admitted that Shin was working for him 3 months ago which is April 2014. You placed your order in the beginning of March for what was approximately $800 correct? So from where I sit it seems to me you must have placed your order to Shin of 7tune since you had also placed a previous order for the rotor necklace through Shin of 7tune.

Adam Villin of 7tune: I did not ask for you to apologize to me because I have already shown you and everyone else what your "words" are worth, you wont fool me into thinking an apology or response from you is worth anything more than the electricity it draws loading onto my screen.

You do without a doubt owe garagemoose some answers to what the situation is with his order through 7tune albeit Shin but still whilst he was working for 7tune. He can clarify what all he ordered but if I recall it was the following
R-Magic Limited edition pink stitched black steering wheel
R-magic shift **** in black with R-magic on the side
R-magic sidebrake boot in black with pink stitching
R-magic shift boot in black with pink stitching

rx7roller02

I'm glad, because I'm taking this very seriously as well.

Please, do explain your comments. You state that you have nothing to do with Shin. Then you say that you distanced yourself from him upon learning of this ongoing problem. When exactly did you learn of this? You make it sound like "Shin WAS part of 7tune", as though it were years ago or something. But this situation is all much more recent than that. So when exactly did you end your association with Shin?

Also, he can call himself whatever he wants....when he's accepting orders under "shin@7tune.com", then there needs to be some clarification as to what responsibility falls upon 7tune. As an employee of yours, he was taking orders and money from people....and using your company's domain to receive them. There's a certain point when that company shares some liability because a company should be aware of what its employees are doing with its resources.

7Tune

According to Shin, he has spoken to you and you have received a refund, right Eric?

I am extremely disappointed that you have had this experience.

7Tune

Please see my answers in red.

garagemoose

iTrader: (3)

I have not received a refund.

garagemoose

iTrader: (3)

All I get is excuses!! I just want my money back.

Circuit Theory

iTrader: (52)

Adam Zillin 7tune : I almost want to laugh at how many times you keep changing your story but this is not a laughing matter. Your company 7tune employed Shin as your sales/export manager. He sold products using your domain name and your facebook page. He accepted money for products and never delivered all while still working for you. However your initial claim of him no longer being apart of 7tune 3 months ago, has all of the sudden turned into 5 months ago??? Hmm that is convenient...

Oh an maybe I should drop this quote from you here...
Interesting I thought you knew about this thread since the first day it was started on the 23rd as you stated above in red... ???

Shin may have started this thread on the Feb 23rd, you did not chime in until May 12th. All the while shin was selling the exact same products here that he had also posted on your 7tune facebook page. So if Shin was acting solely on his own with R-magic why was he also posting these items using the 7tune facebook account?

You are failing to understand that not only are you Adam Zillin / 7tune responsible for a lot of what is going on. Sadly R-magic Japan is also partially responsible. They have posted an endorsement on their website : it reads as such

about R Magic USA

R Magic products are now available in the vendor forum at Rx7club.com, under the name of "R Magic USA." We are looking forward to meet customers overseas. Please shop with confident!

I believe Shin made this statement seeing that the grammar is the same as his posts on the 7tune facebook page and other places. However by them endorsing him on their website and informing everyone to buy from him with confidence makes them responsible as well. Ignorance of what the statement says is not an excuse for R-magic just like ignorance of what your own employee ( shin@7tune.com ) does using your domain and facebook page is also not an excuse.

Man up stop making continued excuses and get garagemoose (Eric) his products or money back.

Lastly I would expect that if you were such good friends with Mr. Ohara you would inform him of what has gone down here (although I know you will paint yourself as completely innocent), and get him to remove the endorsement of Shin's " R Magic USA " account from his website.

Once this is all said and done I would be more than happy to never have to see or hear about you again, and in return you can go back to focusing your time on all the other "antics" you have been known for.

Guess you didnt dig up "all the facts"...

7Tune

I was told that you were offered a refund but opted to wait for the parts. Then I was told you spoke to Shin this morning on Facebook?

Is this true? I am in the dark here as much as you and I have not seen a cent of this transaction nor did I know you paid for products until just now, so I'm only trying to find out what has happened here.

7Tune

You can go on with your crusade all you like - the facts remain that..

1. This stillway shifter business does not and has never had anything to do with either myself or 7Tune. End of story. I am doing these paying customers a favour by chasing them up for everyone - even when I don't have to.

2. All products that have been paid for have either been delivered or refunded. I believe Eric also bought a necklace.. and I'd like to know if he received the item.

3. Shin is no longer handling any of 7Tune's affairs.

4. If you want to continue to push the issue, then I suggest you take it up with the moderators because you are clearly agitated neither having purchased nor waited for parts but are clearly looking for an axe to grind with me over rumours and heresy and that's where my correspondence with you ends. I will not waste my time replying to you again after this.

Now that that's that... Eric, there is nothing else I can do but apologise for the inconvenience caused to you. As you (I think?) bought under the 7Tune brand and I trusted Shin to do the right thing by our customers, I must ultimately accept the responsibility despite having no prior knowledge of the situation.

Eric, I need more details - did you or did you not receive the necklace...? Where did you send paypal payments. PM me or send an email to adam@7tune.com on this or if there are any further issues.

Thanks.

garagemoose

iTrader: (3)

7Tune. I paid using rmagicsales for the items. Yes Shin sent me a message that I will have my refund by Monday.

7Tune

I see. And what of the necklace?

Again, while I can empathise with your situation, my association with Shin in these matters is only through his former connection to 7Tune and if parts products or services were purchased through that particular channel - in only that case, will I then have direct responsibility to handle them immediately.

Since these matters have been created under R-Magic USA, then there is no obligation for me to accept any responsibility for what Shin has done completely upon his own accord.

But seeing as this has gotten way out of hand and Circuit Theory has seen fit to drag me into a situation not of my own doing, then I have found myself having to clean up a mess I did not create.

That said, I am happy to assist any of you because I simply believe it's the right thing to do and I am able to do so of my own volition and choosing.

Circuit Theory

iTrader: (52)

Now it is just getting silly....

Notice your statement here in Red.

Once again get your facts straight.
https://www.facebook.com/7Tune/posts/646598082044298

7Tune

Wow, sorry - I personally did not see that post. Truth be told, we did not receive any orders through 7Tune (at least not to the best of my knowledge) and I would back that claim up by giving you the username and password of my own Paypal account to see for yourself, such is my conviction in the matter.

What is happening here is a completely separate and non-related issue. Your purchases through RX7club have all been made under R-Magic USA. Not 7Tune.

The fact that Shin is the person handling all your orders (not me, nor 7Tune) is purely co-incidental and to be totally frank, quite a big surprise for me seeing as I had no idea any of this was going on until May 12th.

Your matters are to be resolved with Shin Sudo and R-Magic USA. NOT 7Tune and most definitely not me.

I am doing you a favour by allowing myself to get involved despite having nothing to do with any of this professionally.

7Tune

Now for the absolute last time, leave myself and 7Tune OUT OF THIS.

R-Magic sales on this forum have absolutely nothing to do with me. They also have absolutely nothing to do with 7Tune. Eric has already confirmed that himself when he stated that he paid R-Magicsales for the parts.

Just because Shin Sudo is involved (or in 7Tune's case "was involved") does not make me responsible for his actions by way of simple association.

That would be akin to me saying it's Circuit Theory's fault that someone you are associated with ripped me off - despite you have absolutely nothing to do with it.

Why don't you take a look from the other side and realise your error in trying to defame and slander myself and my brand? That's a criminal offence, I'll have you know.

Your emails, PM's and financial issues must be directed to Shin Sudo as I will not intervene from this point forward thanks to the absolutely disgraceful and quite frankly, insulting, attitude of Circuit Theory who has tried to hold me accountable for issues that I had absolutely nothing to do with. A large part of this whole mess is this guys personal grudge against me fuelled by nothing but rumours and lies he has "heard" through the Chinese whisperers.

If I never see or hear from you again, mate, it will be too soon.

To the rest of you in this thread, I trust you have all received what you paid for or are being reimbursed, I am glad to have helped you with what resources I had at my disposal and would like to see this matter brought to a close as soon as possible.

Cheers.

rx7roller02

OK, we'll keep your previous answers in red to avoid confusion.

Let's start with....

Here's what was posted on your 7Tune facebook page, on January 27.

Rather interesting that you "have nothing to do with Shin when it comes to export and sales", but that was his actual title when associated with you.

You clearly were OK with him calling himself an employee of your shop, otherwise you would not have allowed it to stand uncorrected on your own page.

OK, so you learned of this around May 9, you've said. When did you cut Shin out of your domain name? Because he didnt seem to have a problem collecting payment for "his own sales" with a 7tune paypal address.....


This thread is about Stillway shifters that are being promoted under the R-Magic USA avatar. 7Tune has absolutely nothing to do with any of these transactions.

And yet, we now know that he was marketing this same exact product through your website at the same time. What does that tell you? It tells me that you should keep a better eye on people who "dont actually work for you" while they are working for you. Oh, and about that....

Let's look back once again to your 7tune FB page....

A "sales/export manager" is an employee, bro. Not too many sales managers or export managers running around out there that are "not employees" of their respective companies, I imagine.

Oh, so that makes it alright then? He lied to a bunch of people, lied to you, lied to the real R Magic.....but it's cool though, because you believe that everyone got their money back?

With all due respect to you, I'd sure as hell hate to see your business model.....

Not to mention, there's at least one person still waiting....Shin has told people plenty of promises before about when things would ship, when money would be refunded, etc etc. He's broken more than he's kept, apparently. There's no reason to celebrate just yet, until that money actually makes its way back to the buyer.

rx7roller02

Problem there--it was not "simple association". He listed himself as an employee of 7tune, acting with your permission. Then he advertised parts for sale under the 7tune name, again, with your permission. It is not merely coincidence that he was trying to sell these on your FB page at the same time. It is also not coincidence that he was using a 7tune paypal address to accept payments. If you know anything about business law, you would know that an entity can call themselves whatever they wish....but the money trail speaks louder than any name. Did you have control over that paypal account? If not, it would not be a very wise move to allow a paypal account in your company's name to exist like that.

No, it wouldnt be. That's a worthless analogy if ever I have seen one. Again, it is not "simple association"--he represented himself as your employee--a manager no less--and claimed to have such authority to list parts for sale and collect payment, all in the name of 7tune. What you fail to understand is that in the business end of this, 7tune IS responsible for whatever someone does in the name of 7tune. It would then be up to you to pursue Shin for your remedy. Thats how the legal system works.

Shin was not "just some association". He was your "sales/export manager", remember?

Perhaps in Japan it might be, but defamation of character and slander are most definitely not "criminal offenses"....those are civil matters that a civil court would have to decide.

I find it very strange that you would permit him to advertise himself as a sales manager for 7tune, and only now you decide that he was not an employee. There is nothing here, aside from your denials too late in the game, that establishes that he was not an employee....but there IS plenty that shows that he was. I own a business myself, and there's no way in hell that I would allow ANYONE, for ANY reason at ANY time, to represent themselves as my employee, let alone a manager in my business, like that. I dont see any corrections from you on facebook or anywhere else for that matter. That's really strange, considering how much you have been involved with your FB page, I have no doubt that you saw it when he posted it.

And as he has routinely declared himself to have been your employee, you should take a little time and study up on the legal concept known as "vicarious liability".

Odd, you cannot say the same about me, as I have never once dealt with you before in any capacity. And yet, still, here we are....

EDIT....if I were you, I 'd be doing some heavy duty digging.....looks like Shin's been your "sales/export manager" to more places than just this forum....

http://forums.hybridz.org/topic/1162...r-cover/page-2

If he misrepresented the situation as you claim, then I would be doing a TON of checking....you have no idea just how much damage control you might have in front of you now...

7Tune

Key words here being "were" and "was". It's not hard to imagine that all companies have issues with staff on all kinds of things so one of the nature such as gross incompetency is no different than any other. "Let the one who is without sin cast the first stone." Shin is no longer a part of the 7Tune organisation.

This issue is about RX7 forum and the sales/issues/concerns contained within. I would like to know who used a 7tune paypal address for their transactions on this forum actually... if indeed there is anyone.

No offence, but what 7tune advertises, sells, promotes or ships outside this forum is absolutely none of your business. There were no sales of Stillway shifters through my channels, so let's stick to the point here.

An employee indicates that he was being paid for his work but as it appears I had someone on the team who was content to pay himself. I can't say that I was "happy" about any of this and something has been done about it.

No, it does not make it alright. You are conveniently side stepping the issue that all these sales were made under R-Magic. Not 7Tune. How hard is this for you to understand? Shin does know the people at R-Magic, and I was very surprised to even find the existence of this thread - prompting immediate action. I'm doing what I can with what I have.

I'd love to know how many used a Paypal address that has a 7Tune in the domain. Because if there is no instance of a 7tune paypal address being used then I will certainly have a little more to say. Eric has already confirmed he purchased R-Magic products - from Shin - with an rmagic paypal address - and yet circuit theory directly called me responsible for the issue. Like I said, "I am not my brothers keeper." so why are you complaining to me about what he did when it had nothing to do with me? As far as I am aware Shin had his own connections to R-Magic outside and separate to my own with the company.

This thread here is not a case of 7Tune masquerading as R-Magic USA. Oh no, that would be straight up fraud. Fact is I am good friends with Ohara san, 7Tune has its own dealer agreement and both parties are very concerned about all of this. I believe I have already done a great deal of problem solving here despite not having had a single thing to do with any of these shifter sales.

I have done this because "Shin", 7tune and R-Magic are involved and because I care enough to do something about it.

There is no celebration here. And yes, we are all extremely disappointed. Yes, there is still one person waiting but you need to remember that he bought R-Magic parts under the R-Magic USA avatar with Shin on this forum, which again, has absolutely nothing to do with me. That is what I said when i mentioned "association". I am literally going out of my way to help Eric out and I believe I have done that.

That said, I'm actually grateful for all the correspondence (except for one particular individual who clearly has an axe to grind) and have done my best to rectify the situation to the best of my abilities and resources. After Eric receives his refund, I will consider this issue closed.

In the meantime, if anyone has any outstanding orders that are in any way related to this forum, its members and parts advertised under R-Magic USA, please let me know immediately.

Cheers

rx7roller02

Thats the problem, you claimed he never was in the first place....now you claim he WAS, but no longer is. The problem I am having with this is that you keep changing your story on exactly what he was. You knowingly allowed him to tell your prospective customers that he was one of your managers....and now, when things go sour on him, you try to claim "he never was an employee". Sorry, but something just stinks about that. And, whether you agree or not, we deserve proper honesty about exactly what happened there, because he came onto this forum and marketed himself as such....



Apparently, he changed his paypal address once you "fired" him...since he no longer had access to the 7tune account anymore.



No offense, but when this guy shows up on this forum proclaiming to accept payments at a 7tune paypal address, or that you can reach him to order parts at a 7tune email address, it IS our business. You dont have to like it, thats just the way it is.

Then you never should have allowed him to have access to 7tune specific things...and you NEVER should have allowed him to publicly state that he was your sales manager. Come on, stop making excuses or trying to make an end-around. This crap happened. He declared that thats what he was for 7tune. You clearly knew about it and clearly allowed it. Stop making excuses and man up.

Again, you can call yourself whatever you want. But when you use a 7tune email address and a 7tune paypal address, it creates association. Why do you think "authorized distributors" of a company's products still have to use their own name in their email, etc??? For that simple reason--that it creates a false association. You allowed him to use 7tune name in those communications. What part of THAT do YOU not understand?


And he's scamming those people just like he apparently did to you. He claims to be working for R Magic....claims that he "handles all their overseas sales now" and so on. Funny, R Magic doesnt recall ever making that arrangement with him. He did the same to you...and you knowingly allowed it to happen. When you do that, it can put you on the hook. Wake up.

If your "more to say" falls in line with what youve said already, you can keep it and spare us.

Youre forgetting that Shin sold previously to Eric using that 7tune paypal address....how else do you think Eric would have asked him if the 7tune one was the one to use this time??? THINK. Use your head! Eric does not make any mention of officially ordering anything from 7tune....yet he knew the 7tune paypal specific to Shin, because Shin had him use it in the past for things not related to 7tune! THAT ALONE showsl you that this was happening.

Your company actively advertised them on your FB page the exact same time he was listing them for sale on here. That is more than "not a single thing to do" with the shifter issue.

So, you change the details of your story over and over again...because you care?


It was a figure of speech, mate....

If I find as much as one person that paid him at the 7tune address, you will never hear the end of it. Count on it....because youve pushed so hard in the opposite direction. You already know of a necklace that was sold to Eric using that address for payment....what kind of business do you run that you do not keep tighter control over payment accounts in your name like that?

Its not lost on me that the guy who should be speaking up in here, Shin, is notably absent....but then again, if you look back on the first page, he specifically was asked if he was the "real R Magic" or a fake. Posts 11, 12 and 13....look at his response.

I would recommend to you that next time you associate someone with your business in any capacity, you actually check them out first. Nothing this guy has said has been honest. Circuit theory even learned that, when Shin was telling people that he was waiting on parts to arrive, that the real R Magic had not even received an order for any.....and that they were in stock.

7Tune

I don't know how I missed this screen you grabbed which clearly shows that you sent payment to a different account. An R-Magic account.

Now, with that in mind... Eric, will you please inform the members of this forum whether or not you received your necklace and where you paid for it and with what account?

This will help close this particular matter so I appreciate your co-operation with me in this regard.

Cheers