Lightweight Wheel Nuts: Worth it?
Junior Member
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 29
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From: SF Peninsula
Originally posted by Cheers!
how is the Kumho MX less refined? do u mean the name Kumho doesn't rhyme with hoosier or bridgestone?
how is the Kumho MX less refined? do u mean the name Kumho doesn't rhyme with hoosier or bridgestone?
If anything the new MX is more refined tire with 10 years of develpment and improvements over the older Yoko AVS Sport.
Thread Starter
NA Powah, Every Hour!
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 1,302
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From: Sacramento, CA, U S of A
Yo,
Geez guys, have you SEEN the sidewall on the Kumho?
It's the freakin' Patridge Family bus!! It's horrendous. I might give up some ultimate dry grip so I can have a decent sidewall!
*grin*
The guy at Tirerack said the AVS was more refined than the Kumho, so you guys can step off.
The extra $60 I save off of the AVS Sports will get me some Kyogen lugnuts! Heh.
Best of all worlds!
Kevin
1989 GTUs "Kumho: Way to Go!"
Geez guys, have you SEEN the sidewall on the Kumho?
It's the freakin' Patridge Family bus!! It's horrendous. I might give up some ultimate dry grip so I can have a decent sidewall!
*grin*
The guy at Tirerack said the AVS was more refined than the Kumho, so you guys can step off.
The extra $60 I save off of the AVS Sports will get me some Kyogen lugnuts! Heh.
Best of all worlds!
Kevin
1989 GTUs "Kumho: Way to Go!"
www.v8less.com
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 568
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From: Edmonton, Canada
RarestRX: Look up "Muteki" lugnuts
www.evasivemotorsports.com
has them for $32USD for a set of 20
lightweight, won't strip, open ended, gotta use the key for every nut (good & bad I guess)
www.evasivemotorsports.com
has them for $32USD for a set of 20
lightweight, won't strip, open ended, gotta use the key for every nut (good & bad I guess)
Thread Starter
NA Powah, Every Hour!
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 1,302
Likes: 0
From: Sacramento, CA, U S of A
Yo,
Wow, those Muteki's look /exactly/ like the Gorilla tuner nuts that I'm running now.
Maybe I'm already JDM and don't know it!!
Heh.
Thanks for the heads up!
Kevin
1989 GTUs "Bukkakke Lugnuts."
Wow, those Muteki's look /exactly/ like the Gorilla tuner nuts that I'm running now.
Maybe I'm already JDM and don't know it!!
Heh.
Thanks for the heads up!
Kevin
1989 GTUs "Bukkakke Lugnuts."
WWFSMD
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 5,035
Likes: 4
From: SoCal
The 7x ratio for adding weight to your wheels is flawed. The real ratio is less than 2x. Think about it -- the maximum tangential velocity of the wheel is equal to the speed of the car (the outer edge of the tire will be going the same speed as the car), and anything closer to the axle on the wheel is moving slower, so the ratio must be less than 2x.
-Max
-Max
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Posts: 6,131
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From: IN
The P-Zero in 225/50-16 is 23 lbs, so I'd guess a 255/40-17 P-Zero would be more like 25 lbs? Still the P-Zero is lighter than 255/40-17 S-03, but the Bridgestone has more technology--soft rubber compound emerges as the tire wears for consistent performance, over the life of the tire. The S-03 is better in the wet, compared with P-Zero which excels in the dry. Personally I like the P-Asymmetrico (had them in 225/50-16), but I'd be willing to gain 3 lbs each corner for more tire tech--at least on the street. For track duty the P-Zero Asymmetrico would be my undisputed choice.
Originally posted by Aristo
From what I remember the difference between the Pirellis and the S03s in 255-40-17 was something like 22lbs to 28lbs..and this obviously contributes A LOT to the tire/wheel moment of intertia. This is just a general trend I noticed, and it would probably be prudent to check on weight in the particular sizes you want.
From what I remember the difference between the Pirellis and the S03s in 255-40-17 was something like 22lbs to 28lbs..and this obviously contributes A LOT to the tire/wheel moment of intertia. This is just a general trend I noticed, and it would probably be prudent to check on weight in the particular sizes you want.
Last edited by SleepR1; Jan 27, 2004 at 05:31 AM.
Sleep, I personally put the tires on the scale and they were 22lbs as advertised....maybe the thinner sidewall is an important factor in a tire's weight? The 225-50-16 S02s I took off the car and weighed immediately after were 25lbs. There is no doubt the Bridgestones are better in the wet than the Pzs, but living in Southern California I didnt really care about that.
Max, by your logic though a very loose upper bound would be 4x not 2 times since the kinetic energy of the 'fastest' moving 'blob' at the top of the rotation of the tire would 4 times that as if it were at the center. But nevertheless your bound is still correct (right answer but slightly wrong logic) since if you assume the worst case that all the spinning mass is at the outer edge of the tire/wheel and look at its moment of inertia the total kinetic energy for some velocity is 2 times that of what it is for linear motion. So in actuality the weighting that should be assigned is somewhere between 1 and 2 times, depening on geometry (1.5-2 for most reasonable configurations)
Originally posted by maxcooper
The 7x ratio for adding weight to your wheels is flawed. The real ratio is less than 2x. Think about it -- the maximum tangential velocity of the wheel is equal to the speed of the car (the outer edge of the tire will be going the same speed as the car), and anything closer to the axle on the wheel is moving slower, so the ratio must be less than 2x.
-Max
The 7x ratio for adding weight to your wheels is flawed. The real ratio is less than 2x. Think about it -- the maximum tangential velocity of the wheel is equal to the speed of the car (the outer edge of the tire will be going the same speed as the car), and anything closer to the axle on the wheel is moving slower, so the ratio must be less than 2x.
-Max
Last edited by Aristo; Jan 27, 2004 at 02:09 PM.
Lives on the Forum
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,131
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From: IN
Wow, a P-Zero Asymmetrico in 255/40-17 is only 22 lbs?? Wow that's light for a tire that wide! P-Zero will definitely be my next summer street/track tire with SSR Comps (in 9.5 x 17, 42-mm offset). Thanks for clarifying!
Originally posted by Aristo
Sleep, I personally put the tires on the scale and they were 22lbs as advertised....maybe the thinner sidewall is an important factor in a tire's weight? The 225-50-16 S02s I took off the car and weighed immediately after were 25lbs. There is no doubt the Bridgestones are better in the wet than the Pzs, but living in Southern California I didnt really care about that.
Sleep, I personally put the tires on the scale and they were 22lbs as advertised....maybe the thinner sidewall is an important factor in a tire's weight? The 225-50-16 S02s I took off the car and weighed immediately after were 25lbs. There is no doubt the Bridgestones are better in the wet than the Pzs, but living in Southern California I didnt really care about that.
Yeah I was surprised too..that is the same weight as a Michelin Pilot Sport Cup in the same size..the strange thing is my Pzeros in 235-45-17 were actually heavier at 23 lbs. It made no sense to me really unless sidewall size has more of an effect on weight that width.
By the way, the factor of 7 that someone threw out to get an idea of the effect of rotating mass on acceleration probably includes the factor of 4 for all corners.
By the way, the factor of 7 that someone threw out to get an idea of the effect of rotating mass on acceleration probably includes the factor of 4 for all corners.
Last edited by Aristo; Jan 28, 2004 at 12:02 PM.
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Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 6,131
Likes: 2
From: IN
The Michelin Pilot Sport Cup in 255/40-17 only weighs 22 lbs? That's light! I was thinking the Pilot Sport Cup Comps weighed more like 28 lbs or so?
Originally posted by Aristo
Yeah I was surprised too..that is the same weight as a Michelin Pilot Sport Cup in the same size..the strange thing is my Pzeros in 235-45-17 were actually heavier at 23 lbs. It made no sense to me really unless sidewall size has more of an effect on weight that width.
Yeah I was surprised too..that is the same weight as a Michelin Pilot Sport Cup in the same size..the strange thing is my Pzeros in 235-45-17 were actually heavier at 23 lbs. It made no sense to me really unless sidewall size has more of an effect on weight that width.
Former Rx7 *****
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 4,534
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From: Mississauga
Originally posted by RarestRX
Yo,
Wow, those Muteki's look /exactly/ like the Gorilla tuner nuts that I'm running now.
Maybe I'm already JDM and don't know it!!
Heh.
Thanks for the heads up!
Kevin
1989 GTUs "Bukkakke Lugnuts."
Yo,
Wow, those Muteki's look /exactly/ like the Gorilla tuner nuts that I'm running now.
Maybe I'm already JDM and don't know it!!
Heh.
Thanks for the heads up!
Kevin
1989 GTUs "Bukkakke Lugnuts."
Thread Starter
NA Powah, Every Hour!
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 1,302
Likes: 0
From: Sacramento, CA, U S of A
Yo,
Take a look:
http://www.jcwhitney.com/webapp/wcs/...&storeId=10101
They work like a charm, pretty cheap too!
Kevin
1989 GTUs "Sweet!
Take a look:
http://www.jcwhitney.com/webapp/wcs/...&storeId=10101
They work like a charm, pretty cheap too!
Kevin
1989 GTUs "Sweet!
Senior Member
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 488
Likes: 0
From: Syracuse, New York
Originally posted by DamonB
It's safe to use on the threads themselves, but you don't want it on the lugnut seat of the wheel.
It's safe to use on the threads themselves, but you don't want it on the lugnut seat of the wheel.
I use anti-seize too, makes a big difference when changing wheels at track events.
I don't know about those aluminum nuts, they're probably intended for racing situations where they would be replaced often. Aluminum is too soft to use for nuts and bolts, they'll wear out it notime.
I don't know about those aluminum nuts, they're probably intended for racing situations where they would be replaced often. Aluminum is too soft to use for nuts and bolts, they'll wear out it notime.
