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Front Control Arm Ball Joints FD

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Old 10-09-09, 11:54 AM
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Front Control Arm Ball Joints FD

Ok, so I have been searching for awhile and can't seem to find any current information on FD front control arms. From what I have read, it seems that Mazda with their infinite wisdom decided that ball joints last forever and molded them into the control arms. So with that said. There is no part number from mazda for just the joint you have to replace the entire control arm. The numbers I saw from Mallory is basically 1500 bucks for the set of 4.

My ball joints may be fine as I have not taken the front suspension apart yet and did not notice any movement when i replaced the brake rotors.

My plan is to replace my front control arm bushings soon and I wanted to replace the ball joints to ensure that the front end is tight.

I know i could get used control arms with good joints and some new boots. But that is still used. So for now that seems to be the only two options available

So I have some questions for the gurus out there.

I'm assuming someone has to make the joint first and then mazda cast them into the control arms.
Has anyone ever machined out the old ball joint or actually worked for mazda and figured out what the part number is?

For the person who machined out the old joint to figure it out. Were you able to press in a new one?

Is there another control arm off a different mazda car like an FC, FB, Miata, etc that has the same geometry, mounting points, and ball joint but pressed in?

Is there an aftermarket set of control arms that has pressed in joints that cost less than than 1500 for the set of 4?
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Old 10-09-09, 12:18 PM
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Unfortunately, you/we're screwed. New factory unit's for $1500 are the only easy path.

You can look for low mile used ones, or try a JSpec importer for some, or there is one company that makes welded tubular steel replacement arms with hiem joints. Not sure how much I'd like to trust a welded part in this instance though.
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Old 10-09-09, 02:06 PM
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Moonface makes front Lower Roll center adjustable Arms, but MSRP is around $1100 for the lower fronts only. However, the design basically uses a new OEM arm, but the base is laser cut, and the new RC ball joint is pressed in. It's good for cars lowered a bit more than factory.







I have an account with Moonface so that's orderable without too much trouble if this is what you need.

Ikeya formula makes something similar for the FD as well, but is more expensive than the Moonface ones, and RHDJapan i believe sells those.

I believe Nagisa Auto makes something similar as well.....

Or, you can buy $1500 OEM ones.
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Old 10-09-09, 02:32 PM
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Is it me or does that tiny thin aluminum ring look pretty damn weak to support all the forces of a well planted RX7 in and banked corner.

1100 is not bad if you realize that out of the 1500 for OEM 1000 of that is for the lower control arms and you lower your car more and replace the ball joints as necessary in the future. Now what about the uppers?
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Old 10-09-09, 02:38 PM
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^^^

I would guess that would work similar to a lowered hub carrier, but wouldn't you also need to make standoffs for the steering tie rods? Otherwise, they wouldn't be parallel to the lower arm and could cause bump steer?
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Old 10-09-09, 03:02 PM
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It basically just knocks 2 birds with one stone.

1) Allows the lower joint to be replaceable if ever needed be. Probably need to replace it with another moonface joint since the stock probably won't fit in there.

2) Allows the cornering axis of a lowered car to be reset to OEM by allowing 15mm more play in the joint itself.

Unfortunately, I don't think anyone makes a modified upper arm due to the reason that no real performance upgrade can be done to the OEM arm and even if they did, no one makes a replacement joint. So, many suspension parts companies just use the stock.

I bought a set of moonface extended ball joints/RC joints for my GT-R a few months back, but never got around to installing them because I was waiting for some other parts. I am curious of the difference it would make (I heard it makes a big difference in cornering).
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Old 10-09-09, 03:05 PM
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Well if Moon Face can machine it out and put a different joint in there seems like it could be machined and place a stock size joint in. It just seems like its ridiculous to have to by a whole new cast aluminum piece for 500 bucks for new joints. Can we not find a way around this.

Come on we are some of the smartest car owners out there. I just happen to be an electrical guy not mechanical.

This is what i would like to be able to do take my pieces along with a mechanical drawing. Have a machine shop with the correct tools cut the holes. Buy ball joints of PN XX-XXX. Install said joints with my tried and true method. Heat Arms up in oven to 350 then cool ball joint in freezer to 32. Place arms on wooden block and use rubber mallet to tap in ball joint. How much time (estimate) would it take for a machinist to cut the holes is upper and lower control arms.
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Old 10-09-09, 03:10 PM
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I think the problem is would there be enough demand for such a part considering the time and labor it would take to make them. People probably don't want to do it for free, it might end up costing more than $500 especially if a good machine shop is involved in the equation.

More the cost effectiveness in question vs the actual ability to pull off such parts.

Because If you think about it, since most people have the stock arm, they probably need to pay to ship/modify their existing arm, or buy a arm. Then buy the joints and put it all together. I have a hunch it might be more than $500 to do all that.
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Old 10-09-09, 03:42 PM
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I agree I could see it costing more the first time. But lets say this car is the one you keep for the long haul. How much will that control arm be when Mazda runs out of stock. I guess I am thinking long term. Our cars are still relatively young and they only stopped making them 8 years ago.

I dont think I would ship the arms anywhere. If the mechanical drawing exist, which they obviously do. I would have someone I know or a local place do it. and if they screw it up big deal ill go buy the new ones like everyone else.

So when those joints wear out then now you dont have to spend $2000. Or whatever they cost in 2025 to keep your Electric/Biofueled RX-7 rolling.
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Old 10-09-09, 04:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Miata_mx5 View Post
Unfortunately, I don't think anyone makes a modified upper arm due to the reason that no real performance upgrade can be done to the OEM arm and even if they did, no one makes a replacement joint. So, many suspension parts companies just use the stock.
Aftermarket upper arms are available:

http://www.rhdjapan.com/jdm-low/Nagi...D3S-RX-7-53519
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Old 10-09-09, 08:32 PM
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Oh, good to know NAMS makes them too...

Thanks for clearing that up.
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Old 10-10-09, 07:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Miata_mx5 View Post
It basically just knocks 2 birds with one stone.

1) Allows the lower joint to be replaceable if ever needed be. Probably need to replace it with another moonface joint since the stock probably won't fit in there.

2) Allows the cornering axis of a lowered car to be reset to OEM by allowing 15mm more play in the joint itself.
#1 is good, but #2 concerns me.

If that longer stud effectively allows the lower arm to me lower/more level for a given ride height, the rest of the suspension isn't being adjusted accordingly. The steering arm and upper A-arm are still at more extreme angles, and it would seem like that could hose up the geometry.

With a drop spindle, all of the arms stay the same relative to each other.
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Old 10-11-09, 10:08 PM
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Originally Posted by jkstill View Post
Aftermarket upper arms are available:

http://www.rhdjapan.com/jdm-low/Nagi...D3S-RX-7-53519
It seems that making something like this for the front upper AND lower arms available (assuming that has replacable ball joints in it?) is a business venture ripe for the picking. All you have to do is price your product cheaper or the same as the OEM version.

I cant imagine a couple pieces of tubing, a ball joint, and some bushings would cost anywhere near that to produce.
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Old 10-12-09, 12:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Newsome79 View Post
Is it me or does that tiny thin aluminum ring look pretty damn weak to support all the forces of a well planted RX7 in and banked corner.
The forces would be pushing inward as the wheel on the inside of a turn isn't really doing much. So the thin portion does the least amount of work to begin with.
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Old 01-22-10, 01:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Newsome79 View Post
Ok, so I have been searching for awhile and can't seem to find any current information on FD front control arms. From what I have read, it seems that Mazda with their infinite wisdom decided that ball joints last forever and molded them into the control arms. So with that said. There is no part number from mazda for just the joint you have to replace the entire control arm. The numbers I saw from Mallory is basically 1500 bucks for the set of 4.

My ball joints may be fine as I have not taken the front suspension apart yet and did not notice any movement when i replaced the brake rotors.

My plan is to replace my front control arm bushings soon and I wanted to replace the ball joints to ensure that the front end is tight.

I know i could get used control arms with good joints and some new boots. But that is still used. So for now that seems to be the only two options available
I was going to make a new thread but decided to just bump this.
I do not really need to replace my ball joints but I did rip one of the boots the other day. Is there a way I can get just new boots? Any help would be great.
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Old 01-22-10, 02:38 PM
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While doing more searching I found them!
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Old 01-27-10, 05:02 PM
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I really doubt the Moonface ones will help. Changing the pivot point of the lower arm without changing the top arm can easily lead to horrible suspension geometry assuming Mazda did a good design job (which is pretty certain). The idea would work better on a strut based car.
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Old 09-08-12, 01:35 PM
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Oh as anyone yet tryed the NAGISA AUTO uppers with the moonface lowers yet?
Also has anyone tryed to have them machined out or tryed them self?
I was thinking of picking up a set to play with.
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Old 06-12-14, 04:25 PM
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Bringing this back from the dead.
I recently purchased the Nagisa UCAs and Moonface LCAs, after getting frustrated at the lack of available options. As my build is no where near the installation of these, I cannot report on the parts. I will say that they look to be very high quality. My only gripe with the Nagisa UCAs is their use of heim joints at the ends. I would prefer something a little less rigid. This is why I am currently in the process of:
1. removing the stock bushings from my stock UCAs and measuring the bushing ends (diameter, wall thickness, and length)
2. Having a machine shop build me some same-sized fourbar rod ends so that I can use bushings designed for use in stock UCAs
My build is intended to be a track build, but I need to be able to drive it to the track until I can get a truck/trailer.
That being said, after I'm done with the bushing removal, I plan to have the machine shop mill the back of the joints out of ALL of my stock front arms, and begin the search for some replacements. I have taken measurements of the stock UCA ball joint studs, and found some similar (but not identical) replacements from O'Reilly's stock. Master Pro K6664 and and K8619. I will make a thread when I get more info.
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Old 01-23-15, 02:04 PM
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Anything new?
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Old 03-31-16, 06:55 AM
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Can't a guy catch a break? I could buy a whole car for the price of balljoints. I've seen one off rally car arms go for less. Somthing is very wrong here. I think Mazda should let them go for less to keep these cars on the road. More parts sales then. Come on aftermarket. Mevotech has a listing but the part is obsolete
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Old 03-31-16, 08:15 AM
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you can buy the front upper and lower arms on rock auto for cheap
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Old 04-13-16, 06:02 PM
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Originally Posted by evo_koa View Post
you can buy the front upper and lower arms on rock auto for cheap
I saw these and I was wondering if anyone has used them.

The ones I saw on there were Mevotech but I have never used that brand before. they are only about $200 a piece for the lowers which is quite a bit cheaper than anywhere else, but that sort of makes me nervous. I don't really use my car for any kind of intense racing applications but i do drive it pretty hard. I'm just wondering if these would be acceptable replacements since my ball joints seem to be pretty worn.
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Old 04-13-16, 08:01 PM
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Ya I did the research. Dorman (chinese)uppers and Mevotech lowers are the only option I see as of now. I can get them threw work (NAPA) in a month or so when they change to Mevotech, which is from Canada and in stock.
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Old 04-13-16, 09:45 PM
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Originally Posted by MajesticRx7 View Post
Ya I did the research. Dorman (chinese)uppers and Mevotech lowers are the only option I see as of now. I can get them threw work (NAPA) in a month or so when they change to Mevotech, which is from Canada and in stock.
OK well I ordered both upper and lower from rockauto. I'll try to remember to post here after install and testing... Should be about mid-may.
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