Upgrading fuel line
Upgrading fuel line
My plan right now is to make 500hp. I am running 1 bosch 044, 850pri, 1680sec, water/meth, fpr, and power fc. I think this set up should get me close to 500 pretty safe. Im running a borg warner s362 for this season.
'
Main question:
Im running an atl fuel cell and I was wondering what size lines I should be running. -6 feed line makes sense to me, but should I use a -6 or -8 return. please advise since im buying the fuel lines tomorrow.
thank you
Danny
'
Main question:
Im running an atl fuel cell and I was wondering what size lines I should be running. -6 feed line makes sense to me, but should I use a -6 or -8 return. please advise since im buying the fuel lines tomorrow.
thank you
Danny
850/1680 will be pushing your luck for 500whp. I (personally) also wouldn't trust too much in the PFC at that level, though there are many on here who would argue against that..
If you feel the need to run new lines than I would run a -8 feed, split to parallel -6 lines in the engine bay with a -6 return line.
Also, I would consider going with the PTFE lines...
All told running new lines is NOT cheap (I just did it over the winter) so go into it knowing that, and your car will thank you if you accept that you'll likely be spending upwards of $700 (at least, I'd have to go back and check my receipts to be sure) on the new lines and fittings and DO NOT cut corners.
If you feel the need to run new lines than I would run a -8 feed, split to parallel -6 lines in the engine bay with a -6 return line.
Also, I would consider going with the PTFE lines...
All told running new lines is NOT cheap (I just did it over the winter) so go into it knowing that, and your car will thank you if you accept that you'll likely be spending upwards of $700 (at least, I'd have to go back and check my receipts to be sure) on the new lines and fittings and DO NOT cut corners.
-8 feed -6 return
The issue is pressure drop at those flow rates.
with a base pressure of 43.5psi + 20psi (or more) boost +7-10 psi drop across the filter that's 70-73psi + what ever drop is in the feed line, you start getting into a region that hampers fuel pump efficiency.
So go with the bigger feed lines.
The issue is pressure drop at those flow rates.
with a base pressure of 43.5psi + 20psi (or more) boost +7-10 psi drop across the filter that's 70-73psi + what ever drop is in the feed line, you start getting into a region that hampers fuel pump efficiency.
So go with the bigger feed lines.
really. I was under the impression that the return line had to be larger. maybe just a piston motor thing? Im well aware of the cost on this. Everything is set and ready to go for the exception of the lines and an fittings. don't want to order a bunch of wrong fittings. I think the power levels could be reached with one bosch and those injectors. Ray@pfsupercars will be tuning the PFC and he knows this edu pretty well. Im not changing things right now just to make a few more ponies. Ill leave that for next year. I might add another bosch 044 .......
go ask rice.. maybe he knows??
OP .. bypass fuel system requires same sized return and feed lines else it will have a fuel pressure creep issue when at low fuel demands
.. im not reinventing the wheel.. this is well established fact and has been for eons
OP .. bypass fuel system requires same sized return and feed lines else it will have a fuel pressure creep issue when at low fuel demands
.. im not reinventing the wheel.. this is well established fact and has been for eons
Trending Topics
google it // bypass fuel system return line size
thats english right???
so... tell me what the top three responses have to say-
or wait.. i can do it for you !!
( not that i need to back up for myself what is established eons ago , or takes five seconds worth of contemplation to see WHY )
http://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rc...44770516,d.aGc
The QFT Fuel Line/By-Pass Regulator kit works for most 4150-style carbs and requires a fuel return line. Installing the QFT by-pass regulator helps prevent vapor lock and erratic throttle response during stop-and-go driving. The return line attaches to the bottom of the fuel regulator and should return to the top of the fuel tank. The return line needs to be the same size as the feed line.
http://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rc...44770516,d.aGc
These types of regulators are also referred to a “loop style” system as well, in that a return line is required to exit unused fuel back to the fuel tank. These regulators start to “open” when the pressure is built up to the calibrated or adjusted level. Excess fuel is routed back to the fuel tank or fuel cell. A more proper name to call these types of regulators would be “relief valves”. The advantage of these types of regulators, and why they are used in modern EFI vehicles today, is its accurate fuel pressures, especially at low engine operating conditions. Another advantage to these types of regulators is that a higher pressure source to the regulator is not required, and thus not requiring an additional bypass or relief system to prevent “dead-heading” the fuel pump. One disadvantage of a bypass style regulator is that the regulator regulates all of the fuel system, typically preventing multiple pressure levels (such as the use of Nitrous Oxide).
Capacity of the regulator is related directly to the ability to “open” enough to send fuel back to the tank fast enough. If the return line is too restricted or if the regulator capacity is too low, the fuel pressure regulator will not operate. This will result in an over-pressure condition. If the fuel pressure is too high (higher than the desired amount and yet still supposed to be within the range of the regulator), chances are you have too much restriction in the return line, or have too “small” of a regulator.
Capacity of the regulator is related directly to the ability to “open” enough to send fuel back to the tank fast enough. If the return line is too restricted or if the regulator capacity is too low, the fuel pressure regulator will not operate. This will result in an over-pressure condition. If the fuel pressure is too high (higher than the desired amount and yet still supposed to be within the range of the regulator), chances are you have too much restriction in the return line, or have too “small” of a regulator.
http://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rc...44770516,d.aGc
Many people base fuel line sizing based on common misconceptions and customs and as such a fair amount of fuel installations may be fine for a race only application they are unsuited for street applications due to the street duty cycle being on average 20%-30% with idle, city cruise of 15%-20% of the engine power and if the fuel system has reserve these duty cycles would be 5%-10% of the fuel system capacity.
Fuel pressure supply lines are usually adequate for maximum performance, with a preference of 125%-150% fuel line delivery of 100% power to ensure adequate fuel in the event of an unforeseen problem with fuel delivery, i.e. pump speed/voltage/dirt. Fuel pressure lines should be sized to expected capacity and fluid velocity below 4 fps to reduce the Reynolds Number which signifies excess turbulence hence reduced performance.
With such low volume use of the fuel system capacity return fuel lines area usually inadequately sized. The purpose of the return line is for the unused fuel delivered to the engine to be bypassed back to the tank as all constant volume pumps cannot be dead headed. When this fuel is bypassed it experiences a pressure drop and any air dissolved in the fuel or entrained in the fuel boils out forming air bubbles as well as any fuel components vaporizing during this pressure drop. Ideally we want this activity to occur in the fuel line and not in the tank. When the pressure drop in the line is not sufficiently close to ambient the gasses do not condense back into the fuel and the air does not form complete bubbles in the line to escape the fuel in the tank. What does occur with an insufficiently sized return line is that when the bypassed fuel returns to the tank there has not been a sufficient pressure drop in the line and the remaining pressure is discharged in the tank and with it air and gasses discharging forming foam. Return line velocity should preferably be less than pressure line fluid velocity to accomplish the reduction of foam and fuel rail pressure rise.
Fuel line bypasses are commonly called a regulator which is incorrect. A regulator controls pressure on the outlet of the regulator, regardless of the input pressure to the regulator. A fuel bypass function is to bleed off a preset pressure to the outlet; the outlet pressure should be atmospheric and is determined by any restriction downstream. The bypass outlet pressure is ideally ambient atmospheric although return line sizing if too small will increase outlet pressure and added rising fuel pressure line/rail pressures. Another problem with fuel bypasses is the under sizing of the bypass orifice resulting in low flow causing low fuel consumption pressures higher than high fuel consumption pressures causing erratic fuel rail pressures. A larger bypass would be required or a series of bypasses to bypass the total fuel not used at low fuel consumption conditions.
Return line example - If the engine requires 600 lb/hr of fuel at maximum power and is used in low speed/power applications then the return line and bypass needs to return 90% of the fuel with ideally no pressure loss. That would mean a return line sizing equal or larger than the pressure line.
Fuel pressure supply lines are usually adequate for maximum performance, with a preference of 125%-150% fuel line delivery of 100% power to ensure adequate fuel in the event of an unforeseen problem with fuel delivery, i.e. pump speed/voltage/dirt. Fuel pressure lines should be sized to expected capacity and fluid velocity below 4 fps to reduce the Reynolds Number which signifies excess turbulence hence reduced performance.
With such low volume use of the fuel system capacity return fuel lines area usually inadequately sized. The purpose of the return line is for the unused fuel delivered to the engine to be bypassed back to the tank as all constant volume pumps cannot be dead headed. When this fuel is bypassed it experiences a pressure drop and any air dissolved in the fuel or entrained in the fuel boils out forming air bubbles as well as any fuel components vaporizing during this pressure drop. Ideally we want this activity to occur in the fuel line and not in the tank. When the pressure drop in the line is not sufficiently close to ambient the gasses do not condense back into the fuel and the air does not form complete bubbles in the line to escape the fuel in the tank. What does occur with an insufficiently sized return line is that when the bypassed fuel returns to the tank there has not been a sufficient pressure drop in the line and the remaining pressure is discharged in the tank and with it air and gasses discharging forming foam. Return line velocity should preferably be less than pressure line fluid velocity to accomplish the reduction of foam and fuel rail pressure rise.
Fuel line bypasses are commonly called a regulator which is incorrect. A regulator controls pressure on the outlet of the regulator, regardless of the input pressure to the regulator. A fuel bypass function is to bleed off a preset pressure to the outlet; the outlet pressure should be atmospheric and is determined by any restriction downstream. The bypass outlet pressure is ideally ambient atmospheric although return line sizing if too small will increase outlet pressure and added rising fuel pressure line/rail pressures. Another problem with fuel bypasses is the under sizing of the bypass orifice resulting in low flow causing low fuel consumption pressures higher than high fuel consumption pressures causing erratic fuel rail pressures. A larger bypass would be required or a series of bypasses to bypass the total fuel not used at low fuel consumption conditions.
Return line example - If the engine requires 600 lb/hr of fuel at maximum power and is used in low speed/power applications then the return line and bypass needs to return 90% of the fuel with ideally no pressure loss. That would mean a return line sizing equal or larger than the pressure line.
so...... any further questions???
U mad bro? 

Actually, by reading the links you posted above they tend to focus more on the concern of avoiding undue pressure build up in the return line which would lead to fuel pressure creep that could effect drive-ability in a stop and go (low IDC) traffic situation. They suggest that you want to avoid a return line that is too restrictive.
Lets apply a little common sense to your "five seconds of contemplation"... -6 line is not too restrictive. And it's not going to create fuel pressure creep, if it was than I would have noticed it while I was flow testing my 044 (several times) last week. When I set it to 43psi it held dead even at 43psi for the duration of multiple (five gallon) tests. When I set it to 70psi it held dead even at 70 psi for multiple tests, all at 0% IDC. Sorry, that says to me that a -8 feed and a -6 return is perfectly fine.
When was the last time you actually ran a test, yourself, to confirm what you learned by listening to "baby noises"???


Originally Posted by bumpstart
OP .. bypass fuel system requires same sized return and feed lines else it will have a fuel pressure creep issue when at low fuel demands
.. im not reinventing the wheel.. this is well established fact and has been for eons
.. im not reinventing the wheel.. this is well established fact and has been for eons
Lets apply a little common sense to your "five seconds of contemplation"... -6 line is not too restrictive. And it's not going to create fuel pressure creep, if it was than I would have noticed it while I was flow testing my 044 (several times) last week. When I set it to 43psi it held dead even at 43psi for the duration of multiple (five gallon) tests. When I set it to 70psi it held dead even at 70 psi for multiple tests, all at 0% IDC. Sorry, that says to me that a -8 feed and a -6 return is perfectly fine.
When was the last time you actually ran a test, yourself, to confirm what you learned by listening to "baby noises"???
Last edited by fendamonky; Apr 6, 2013 at 10:04 AM.
U mad bro? 

Actually, by reading the links you posted above they tend to focus more on the concern of avoiding undue pressure build up in the return line which would lead to fuel pressure creep that could effect drive-ability in a stop and go (low IDC) traffic situation. They suggest that you want to avoid a return line that is too restrictive.
Lets apply a little common sense to your "five seconds of contemplation"... -6 line is not too restrictive. And it's not going to create fuel pressure creep, if it was than I would have noticed it while I was flow testing my 044 (several times) last week. When I set it to 43psi it held dead even at 43psi for the duration of multiple (five gallon) tests. When I set it to 70psi it held dead even at 70 psi for multiple tests, all at 0% IDC. Sorry, that says to me that a -8 feed and a -6 return is perfectly fine.
When was the last time you actually ran a test, yourself, to confirm what you learned by listening to "baby noises"???


Actually, by reading the links you posted above they tend to focus more on the concern of avoiding undue pressure build up in the return line which would lead to fuel pressure creep that could effect drive-ability in a stop and go (low IDC) traffic situation. They suggest that you want to avoid a return line that is too restrictive.
Lets apply a little common sense to your "five seconds of contemplation"... -6 line is not too restrictive. And it's not going to create fuel pressure creep, if it was than I would have noticed it while I was flow testing my 044 (several times) last week. When I set it to 43psi it held dead even at 43psi for the duration of multiple (five gallon) tests. When I set it to 70psi it held dead even at 70 psi for multiple tests, all at 0% IDC. Sorry, that says to me that a -8 feed and a -6 return is perfectly fine.
When was the last time you actually ran a test, yourself, to confirm what you learned by listening to "baby noises"???
Return line example - If the engine requires 600 lb/hr of fuel at maximum power and is used in low speed/power applications then the return line and bypass needs to return 90% of the fuel with ideally no pressure loss. That would mean a return line sizing equal or larger than the pressure line.
OP .. bypass fuel system requires same sized return and feed lines else it will have a fuel pressure creep issue when at low fuel demands
.. im not reinventing the wheel.. this is well established fact and has been for eons
.. im not reinventing the wheel.. this is well established fact and has been for eons
that would be exactly what i was writing ..and i dont listen to baby noises
,, i fit and fix these damn things and yes i would know better after 23 yrs of doing this and have advised the OP of the FACTS on the matter
in fact ive had to deal with this exactly issue more than once in the last 3 months
im also ..class one .. zone one ( high pressure asphyxiating and explosive gas plant ) chemical process industry qualified
.. so you'd think by now id understand flows and valves right??
it seems even google.. who i only turned to because of your apparent learning issue ...agrees
IMO... ( and not just me ) opinion is that your pretty obviously a troll.. and seemingly incapable of understanding basic physics
and i see that in your own posts that you admit you know **** all .. and wish to learn
well.. stop leading the OP down the path.... waste your own coin ..
or go argue with every author who agrees with me on that google list
.. about how you just made an amazing advance in the laws of physics
that shall take you a while
Lets apply a little common sense to your "five seconds of contemplation"... -6 line is not too restrictive. And it's not going to create fuel pressure creep, if it was than I would have noticed it while I was flow testing my 044 (several times) last week. When I set it to 43psi it held dead even at 43psi for the duration of multiple (five gallon) tests. When I set it to 70psi it held dead even at 70 psi for multiple tests, all at 0% IDC. Sorry, that says to me that a -8 feed and a -6 return is perfectly fine.
just like when a 6 inch pipe is fed from a 8 inch one .. and there is no or little draw ... pressure will raise in the 10 inch line despite the 10 inch control valve being at full stroke .
you can take the 10 inch CV out.. step the pipe around the valve up to.. say .. lets get ridiculous to make a point.... a 16 inch pipe.. and put in it a 16 inch control valve .....
and stroke it 100% open..... and the pressure will still rise in the 10 inch pipe ....cause its got to pass through the 8 inch restriction ....
now.. lets add heat.. expansion ..perculation ..
and so good luck when you take it out of the garage and drive it in excessive temperatures for a reasonable drive..
Most aftermarket regulators have either more or larger inlets than outlets. Also don't forget that you are removing some of the volume of fuel trough the injectors. The relation of inlet and return line size doesn't really matter as long as the return line can flow as much fuel as the pump can put out..
.. the whole time we have been discussing an issue at LOW demand
.. so have all the articles.. and that is just the first three..
and link me some of these aftermarket bypass regs with uneven ins and outs
i wouldnt touch one with a bargepole ..
.. bets i can mind many more that are provided with even threads all around
seriously people.. why dont you all argue with each one of those pros out there on that google that you think have basic physics wrong ..
i can share with you 23 yrs exp..
or you can look for yourself all over google
and you will find that there is universal understanding on the issue
.. digest what you wish.. if you think you know better .. well good for you ... ..

the OP asked if he should have -6 OR -8returns with his -6 feedline
it seems he understood the issue more than the next 2 people that posted ///
this is why i have interjected.. stated facts.. had a bite at no one
if you care to read this bit again-
Fuel line bypasses are commonly called a regulator which is incorrect. A regulator controls pressure on the outlet of the regulator, regardless of the input pressure to the regulator. A fuel bypass function is to bleed off a preset pressure to the outlet; the outlet pressure should be atmospheric and is determined by any restriction downstream. The bypass outlet pressure is ideally ambient atmospheric although return line sizing if too small will increase outlet pressure and added rising fuel pressure line/rail pressures. Another problem with fuel bypasses is the under sizing of the bypass orifice resulting in low flow causing low fuel consumption pressures higher than high fuel consumption pressures causing erratic fuel rail pressures. A larger bypass would be required or a series of bypasses to bypass the total fuel not used at low fuel consumption conditions.
Return line example - If the engine requires 600 lb/hr of fuel at maximum power and is used in low speed/power applications then the return line and bypass needs to return 90% of the fuel with ideally no pressure loss. That would mean a return line sizing equal or larger than the pressure line.
Return line example - If the engine requires 600 lb/hr of fuel at maximum power and is used in low speed/power applications then the return line and bypass needs to return 90% of the fuel with ideally no pressure loss. That would mean a return line sizing equal or larger than the pressure line.
( aware of all the above,, and fully aware that idle injector demands will keep him within the window of retain the SAME and not LARGER return line )
i expect he is puzzled by the clearly misguided replies by fendamonky, Vicoor, ,zaridar, 13B-RX3
who seem to have poor concept of how a bypass control system actually works ,, and have advised him of the entire opposite of what he clearly already understood,, and conveyed in his original post
my first reply still stands..
return line must be same size as supply in a bypass type fuel system .. single 044 will be at its limits
( as the final post from google was hinting )
understand i took into account also the demands of a street used car ,, where the fuel system must be over-engineered to cope with blocked filters , struggling alternator feed or fuel pump wiring and aging pumps.. 500 rwhp ( rotary ) is marginal on any one pump system unless you have a very exclusive pump and or is running boost a pump voltages
PS .. bold added for emphasis
.. sorry for all the bubbles popped //// but physics is physics,, been there done that... is been there done that
Last edited by bumpstart; Apr 6, 2013 at 12:45 PM. Reason: PS
Most aftermarket regulators have either more or larger inlets than outlets. Also don't forget that you are removing some of the volume of fuel trough the injectors. The relation of inlet and return line size doesn't really matter as long as the return line can flow as much fuel as the pump can put out..
did you bother to read any of the links?? dont just take my word for it..
.. the whole time we have been discussing an issue at LOW demand
.. so have all the articles.. and that is just the first three..
and link me some of these aftermarket bypass regs with uneven ins and outs
i wouldnt touch one with a bargepole ..
.. the whole time we have been discussing an issue at LOW demand
.. so have all the articles.. and that is just the first three..
and link me some of these aftermarket bypass regs with uneven ins and outs
i wouldnt touch one with a bargepole ..
I never said i agreed with it that's just the way it is. Most pressure systems have a larger return than feed due to the lower flow from the pressure being decreased. For some reason aftermarket fuel systems are not that way.
3 -8, 1 -10 inlet. -10 outlet-http://www.jegs.com/p/Aeromotive/Aeromotive-Pro-Series-Boost-Reference-EFI-Fuel-Pressure-Regulator/756945/10002/-1
-12 inlet. 2 -8 outlets-http://www.jegs.com/p/Aeromotive/Aeromotive-Pro-Stock-2-Port-Regulator/804087/10002/-1
-10 inlet. -8 outlet-http://www.jegs.com/p/Aeromotive/Aeromotive-4-Port-Regulator-with-Bypass/1192209/10002/-1
-10 inlet -8 outlet-http://www.jegs.com/p/Aeromotive/Aeromotive-A1000-Carbureted-Bypass-Regulator/750089/10002/-1
2 -10 inlet. -6 return-http://www.jegs.com/p/Aeromotive/Aeromotive-A1000-Injected-Bypass-Regulator/750081/10002/-1
You have never run across one of these in your 23 years of experience????
.. i can easily go back through the last 3 months of your posts
.. make a note of every time you came in disrespectfully.. incited bites
.. i can tick you points for each one.. doesnt matter which forum you put them .. or which mod is your friend ..
i can be nice and put it to a panel.. who are already keenly watching what your activities have been lately
20 points and its all over ... be aware i already know you have been taken to notice on this by other mods
careful yourself
.. i can easily go back through the last 3 months of your posts
.. make a note of every time you came in disrespectfully.. incited bites
.. i can tick you points for each one.. doesnt matter which forum you put them .. or which mod is your friend ..
i can be nice and put it to a panel.. who are already keenly watching what your activities have been lately
20 points and its all over ... be aware i already know you have been taken to notice on this by other mods
.. i can easily go back through the last 3 months of your posts
.. make a note of every time you came in disrespectfully.. incited bites
.. i can tick you points for each one.. doesnt matter which forum you put them .. or which mod is your friend ..
i can be nice and put it to a panel.. who are already keenly watching what your activities have been lately
20 points and its all over ... be aware i already know you have been taken to notice on this by other mods
Proper leadership, or authority, would dictate that reprimands are made in private, aka through PMs. Yet you feel it's appropriate to threaten my account in public? It truly does show that you have a firm grasp of the moral upper hand.
And what? Now you're going to use the fact that I'm replying to you, in public, as justification to exercise your mod powers? Why, because I don't cower and bow to posts simply because the person who writes them has a bolded name? Are you suggesting that pointing out inconsistencies (when they come from moderators) is a bannable offense now?
How about... if you have a problem with the questions I ask, and the things that I point out, you message me about them and discuss it in private like adults. As opposed to making posts like the one above in public.
Feel free to delete both your post, and this reply to it, if you want to actually solve an issue like a responsible adult, instead of acting like a juvenile who's drunk on their "power".
3 -8, 1 -10 inlet. -10 outlet-http://www.jegs.com/p/Aeromotive/Aeromotive-Pro-Series-Boost-Reference-EFI-Fuel-Pressure-Regulator/756945/10002/-1
same size in and out......
-12 inlet. 2 -8 outlets-http://www.jegs.com/p/Aeromotive/Aeromotive-Pro-Stock-2-Port-Regulator/804087/10002/-1
dead head regulator.... one inlet,, two outlets to feed carbs.. no return ..completely different thing to a bypass fuel system ..not valid here
-10 inlet. -8 outlet-http://www.jegs.com/p/Aeromotive/Aeromotive-4-Port-Regulator-with-Bypass/1192209/10002/-1
this one is a deadhead... with a kickback return ...still not a genuine bypass reg setup .. a genuine bypass reg can be installed several ways but all effectively place it after the carb or injectors ..
.. EG either carb is fed via the other inlet port on a three port reg.. or fed from a feedline to a tee to the carb.. other tee to the reg .. as such there is NO restriction between pump and injector / carb....rail pressure all the way is the same pump up to carb/injector .. this one has 4 out ports.. indicating it is infact a deadhead design .. the kickback.. or ..bleed is there to prevent creep )
note especially it says "reg with bypass"
-10 inlet -8 outlet-http://www.jegs.com/p/Aeromotive/Aeromotive-A1000-Carbureted-Bypass-Regulator/750089/10002/-1
2 -10 inlet. -6 return-http://www.jegs.com/p/Aeromotive/Aeromotive-A1000-Injected-Bypass-Regulator/750081/10002/-1
this one i initially struggled to fathom..
then found this little gem -
and so.. this little pump is different to the rest.. its for carb and for efi use!! because-------------
so.. goodluck running this on a full speed pump !!
same size in and out......
-12 inlet. 2 -8 outlets-http://www.jegs.com/p/Aeromotive/Aeromotive-Pro-Stock-2-Port-Regulator/804087/10002/-1
dead head regulator.... one inlet,, two outlets to feed carbs.. no return ..completely different thing to a bypass fuel system ..not valid here
-10 inlet. -8 outlet-http://www.jegs.com/p/Aeromotive/Aeromotive-4-Port-Regulator-with-Bypass/1192209/10002/-1
this one is a deadhead... with a kickback return ...still not a genuine bypass reg setup .. a genuine bypass reg can be installed several ways but all effectively place it after the carb or injectors ..
.. EG either carb is fed via the other inlet port on a three port reg.. or fed from a feedline to a tee to the carb.. other tee to the reg .. as such there is NO restriction between pump and injector / carb....rail pressure all the way is the same pump up to carb/injector .. this one has 4 out ports.. indicating it is infact a deadhead design .. the kickback.. or ..bleed is there to prevent creep )
note especially it says "reg with bypass"
-10 inlet -8 outlet-http://www.jegs.com/p/Aeromotive/Aeromotive-A1000-Carbureted-Bypass-Regulator/750089/10002/-1
EFI conversions will require a larger-than-stock return line for proper low pressure control.
this one i initially struggled to fathom..
then found this little gem -
Intended for use with custom fuel rails, this true billet regulator was designed specifically for use with the A1000 In-line Fuel Pump.
• Billet Speed Pump Controller (P/N 16306) recommended for EFI street applications.
Last edited by bumpstart; Apr 6, 2013 at 01:34 PM.
My point exactly... You clearly don't like the thought of anybody questioning you, and it would seem that you feel the need to flex your muscles like a big boy and threaten me. Or are you just hoping that I'll reply in a way which would warrant what you'd like to do anyway.
Proper leadership, or authority, would dictate that reprimands are made in private, aka through PMs. Yet you feel it's appropriate to threaten my account in public? It truly does show that you have a firm grasp of the moral upper hand.
And what? Now you're going to use the fact that I'm replying to you, in public, as justification to exercise your mod powers? Why, because I don't cower and bow to posts simply because the person who writes them has a bolded name? Are you suggesting that pointing out inconsistencies (when they come from moderators) is a bannable offense now?
How about... if you have a problem with the questions I ask, and the things that I point out, you message me about them and discuss it in private like adults. As opposed to making posts like the one above in public.
Feel free to delete both your post, and this reply to it, if you want to actually solve an issue like a responsible adult, instead of acting like a juvenile who's drunk on their "power".
Proper leadership, or authority, would dictate that reprimands are made in private, aka through PMs. Yet you feel it's appropriate to threaten my account in public? It truly does show that you have a firm grasp of the moral upper hand.
And what? Now you're going to use the fact that I'm replying to you, in public, as justification to exercise your mod powers? Why, because I don't cower and bow to posts simply because the person who writes them has a bolded name? Are you suggesting that pointing out inconsistencies (when they come from moderators) is a bannable offense now?
How about... if you have a problem with the questions I ask, and the things that I point out, you message me about them and discuss it in private like adults. As opposed to making posts like the one above in public.
Feel free to delete both your post, and this reply to it, if you want to actually solve an issue like a responsible adult, instead of acting like a juvenile who's drunk on their "power".
im doing .. is putting all this up on the mod board for a looksee,,, thats hardly drunk with power is it.. and youve made mentions a few times lately
Sorry, you can't use Aeromotive as an example since they have no idea what they are doing. But seriously though, examples can be found from one extreme to the other, the simple fact is as long as your return line will flow as much fuel as the fuel pump you will have no restriction issues!
Sorry, you can't use Aeromotive as an example since they have no idea what they are doing. But seriously though, examples can be found from one extreme to the other, the simple fact is as long as your return line will flow as much fuel as the fuel pump you will have no restriction issues!
ok.. so no issue..
....lets turn down the pump.. so its not backing up pressure with the reg fully open and unable to open further when we idle ....
so what now happens when we wish to use that 500 hp???
i will refer you to this bit---
Another problem with fuel bypasses is the under sizing of the bypass orifice resulting in low flow causing low fuel consumption pressures higher than high fuel consumption pressures causing erratic fuel rail pressures. A larger bypass would be required or a series of bypasses to bypass the total fuel not used at low fuel consumption conditions.
but he is making the mistake that he thinks everyone has so far grasped this
PS
not being rude but the aeromotive pump is speed controlled .. go as far as spelling out its not for street use with that reg unless its on a controller.. and can be run so slow it can be a carb pump ... its a much more newer fuel system design concept than what is in the original EFI bypass systems we are describing here .. this is not a simple two speed voltage controller ...or a simple wound pump
Last edited by bumpstart; Apr 6, 2013 at 01:50 PM. Reason: PS
I'm getting pretty tired of the bickering. I'm not even on here much anymore for numerous reasons but BS bickering is one. Can we stop dragging crap from one thread in to another or do I just start shutting down everything that remotely starts going south?
~S~
~S~
When I posted earlier I was more focused on getting adequate fuel to supply 500whp.
It can be done with -6, but you are really gonna be working a pump hard.
-8 or larger is clearly the better choice for feed side.
Now for return, all of the setups I have seen use the same size or smaller.
I have seen setups with -10 feed and stock 8mm (-5) return used and have thought that has to be close to a problem.
I can imagine setups where a smaller return could certainly be an issue, such as a mechanical injection system on a sprint car or dragster. In these vehicles the fuel pump is driven by the crankshaft and delivers multiples of fuel relative to demand.
On a setup like this when the throttle is lifted at high RPM there would need to be a very unrestricted return circuit to prevent fuel pressure from spiking very high.
But that ain't what we are dealing with is it.
My question would be,,,,,
Has anyone had a first hand experience with a situation where a size smaller return has created a problem?
It can be done with -6, but you are really gonna be working a pump hard.
-8 or larger is clearly the better choice for feed side.
Now for return, all of the setups I have seen use the same size or smaller.
I have seen setups with -10 feed and stock 8mm (-5) return used and have thought that has to be close to a problem.
I can imagine setups where a smaller return could certainly be an issue, such as a mechanical injection system on a sprint car or dragster. In these vehicles the fuel pump is driven by the crankshaft and delivers multiples of fuel relative to demand.
On a setup like this when the throttle is lifted at high RPM there would need to be a very unrestricted return circuit to prevent fuel pressure from spiking very high.
But that ain't what we are dealing with is it.
My question would be,,,,,
Has anyone had a first hand experience with a situation where a size smaller return has created a problem?





