Zero R

iTrader: (1)

V-mount properly setup won't heatsoak from underhood temps period, I've seen the type of setup you describe as well, and it works very well if also done right,It sounds similar to what I may use on a 20B conversion I'm in the middle of doing. FMIC's that everybody installs are garbage due to most of them being garbage installs. You can also have the same problem with any IC radiator setup including v-mount, and the cost difference is negligible once you add the cost of a upgraded radiator to the cost of a FMIC.

IRPerformance

iTrader: (41)

Anything inside the engine bay will heat soak. The only thing that makes a vmount better than a stock mount is when the air exits the radiator it doesn't flow directly on the intercooler. Run the car hard or just drive around and let it warmup, and touch anything metal in the engine bay. It will be hot.

DCrosby

It's all relative...
If I drive bumper to bumper traffic, get out and touch the IC, yes it's as hot on one side as it is on the other...

If I drive 25 mph or more, for 2+miles I get out and touch the IC pipes, the turbo side is hot and the intake side is at least 10-30 degrees cooler...

Bottom line.. if you have open road to boost, the IC is cool...

Zero R

iTrader: (1)

Hey sorry, if I stepped on your toes but I've been running a V-mount now since 96/97, It don't heatsoak. I can touch it all I want and have, and it is cold, and when running hard it is a little warm on the inlet side. Another thing that makes it better is there is no restriction to the radiator,my coolant temps are excellent on my car, your basing your views on V-mounts you see on the market, they are all a compromise to include AC and aren't ducted properly, just like 90 percent of all FMIC's driving around.This is a lame arguement period. If done well what you describe can and does work rather well, from the info I've been looking into, but saying a V-mount is poor compared to a FMIC is incorrect it all depends on the setup, and can work extremely well also.

Jason

iTrader: (5)

Vmounts will heat soak. I have seen it many times. Especially if you are not running a vented hood.
I have installed front mounts at least 50 times and non have had cooling issues including my car that has had one for 7 years.
For a street car there is nothing wrong with a front mount. The only time I recommend a stock or V mount is for a roadracer that needs the extra air to the radiator. I like the V mount setup, but you can get a FMIC and radiator for $1250 and still have $1k left over.

Zero R

iTrader: (1)

WoW coming from two guys that do this for a living, this is a little scary for me, maybe we're on a different page read the post above or both posts above and you will see what I am saying since its obvious no-one cares to think about what they just read. Where did I say a FMIC wouldn't work if set up right. How many times do I have to say it depends on the setup. Unlike the post I see on here that are blanket statements like "V-mounts heatsoak" I have a blanket statement also "F- mounts block airflow to the radiator." Can you see the difference between the two statements. One is certainly more true than the other. Why because not all V-mounts will heatsoak but all F-mounts do block flow to the radiator. Just like all S-mounts get flow blocked from the radiator, and all S-mounts will heatsoak from the radiator.

Here is what was said "V-mount properly setup wont heatsoak period" and "your basing your views on V-mounts you see on the market they are all a compromise" also "You can also have the same problem with any IC radiator setup including v-mount" I wouldn't run a stock mount for serious track duty, I would run a well set up front mount that has been ducted properly for the radiator. Stock mounts are the worst of the three.

IRPerformance

iTrader: (41)

I agree with Jason. I just don't see how a v-mount is significantly better than a stock mount. To me, the extra grand just doesn't justify the benefits. On a strictly road race car it might be worth it. But not for me.

Zero R

iTrader: (1)

You are right on the cost part of it, I could come out with a nice V-mount setup, it could cost significantly less and be setup better than what is available, out of respect for Chuck and his market I do not. I think where we are not seeing eye to eye on this is, I'm not referring to average setups on the street and I think you guys are. You guys also need to keep in mind I'm not bashing here, I just hate blanket statements it misleads people who don't know better.

DCrosby

I wouldn't mind you coming out with better ducting for the V-Mount, if you think you can outdo chuck, or maybe put your heads together and offer an "upgrade kit"

Personally I'm very satisfied with my v-mount, and allthough I'm not single turbo yet, and can't fully appreciate the HP gains to be had, I'm just happy that my V-Mount is running well.... and I don't have any heat issues even in bumper to bumper traffic (L.A. Hit over 100 ambient air, in the last month), on the stock ECU, as long as I run one of the fans...

Zero R

iTrader: (1)

I wouldn't do that to Chuck just like I wouldn't do a S-mount to Kevin/ASP. There are many solutions to the problem and if done right they can all work well. I am looking at a couple different setups currently we will see what I may do. I like the idea of a slightly offset V-mount config. I also like the idea of a well ducted F-mount.

80-CU.IN.T

I ran a custom FMIC properly ducked with aluminum and never had any cooling problems. APEX'i GTR intercooler core, custom piping and a Griffin radiator ( 2 rows 1- 1/4" tubes 27" X 15" chevy style). The only reason I went this rout was that I wasn't smart enough to come up with a V-mount concept. The idea hadn't even occurred to me until I saw a setup on another car ( not a 3rd Gen). Very, very good Idea. It would have taken an equal amount of time to fabricate either one of the setups. A v-mount on a 3rd Gen. will heat soak. A properly REENFORCED and vented hood should be mandatory on any 3rd. Gen. If I were to do it again, I would go with a V-mount setup. Shorter intake runners, no extra weight hanging over the front wheels and the radiator is stile kept relatively low to the center of gravity. I have seen Chuck's setup and it could definitely be improved upon but for a V-mount it is the best one out there for the money that I have seen. Very expensive though. I am not trying to insult anybody. This is just my own personal opinion. I am not trying to sell anything or bump anybody's products so no flames please.

Zero R

iTrader: (1)

Please someone who has properly setup V-mount tell me it heat soaks so then I can be man enough to admit I'm wrong, otherwise I can tell you a properly setup one doesn't, I know I sound like a jerk in here but again I have one, I made, on a 3rd gen for years it don't heatsoak, It barely gets even warm. The F-mount I'm about to do will run the same style core you speak off. and will be ducted properly, as well. It is a heavy core for sure.

SPEED_NYC

iTrader: (3)

can you post pics of the v mount you made for your car?

btw, i agree with you that a properly set up v mount shouldnt heat soak. i just like pics

mazdaspeed00

iTrader: (6)

HKS

Zero R

iTrader: (1)

I will once I put the car back together for sure, I do not like the HKS one, way overly complicated.

80-CU.IN.T

Zero-R I do agree. A properly set up V-mount will not heat soak. All of the kits, I have seen, will heat soak because the intercooler is not separated from the engine compartment heat. When you are moving it is not a problem as with a SMIC.
A properly vented hood will GREATLY improve under hood temps. but I have not seen one after-market hood that had enough reenforcement built into it so that it would not bend and flex at speeds over 130 mph. This does not mean that there isn't a hood out there. I just have not seen it yet. This is also amplified greatly with front bumpers that have a larger than stock opening. If you travel at higher speeds you will find that it doesn't take much to throw off the Chase balance. Especially when pushing your vehicle though turns. No fun drifting when you don't want to (Even butt puckering some times. )
Just out of curiosity, why do you want to make a FMIC setup if you already figured out what it takes to make a proper V-mount. Front mount setups are not the best way of doing it for the reasons I posted before.

CCarlisi

If the radiator is UNDER the IC core, v-mount or otherwise, and heat rises (which it does) I don't see how the IC core could not heat soak in stop and go driving.

I think it comes down to what the car is used for. If I lived out in the burbs I'd go with a stock mount because both cores get good airflow and the IC pipe length is very short. However, for city driving I think there is definately a benefit to having the IC core in front of, rather than above, the radiator core.

Zero R

iTrader: (1)

I think it does matter what the car is used for, for sure, I said I think that is where me and the other two are confusing each other I'm more track minded they're more street minded.

Zero R

iTrader: (1)

20B and the owner wont let me breach the firewall like I want to, or go nutz cutting up the front of the car.

80-CU.IN.T

BUMMER - After a proper 20B swap it would be very difficult to put his/her car back to stock anyway. Don't you just hate dealing with customers. They do pay the bills though.

80-CU.IN.T

[QUOTE]Originally posted by CCarlisi
[B]If the radiator is UNDER the IC core, v-mount or otherwise, and heat rises (which it does) I don't see how the IC core could not heat soak in stop and go driving.

Fans have to be on both the radiator and intercooler. If only on the radiator, there is a very good chance that air will be drawn not only from the front of the car but also from the engine compartment through the intercooler. It all depends on how you design the system.

CarlRx7

spearco

rotaryextreme

iTrader: (2)

Any kind of IC will heat soak if there isn't any air flowing through it.

You are not going to need any power when you are stuck in traffic so I don't think heat soak in traffic is a big concern. If you want to prevent heat soak when you are stuck in traffic, you can put a fan behind the IC. I think the fan will become a restriction once the car is moving above a certain speed so I personally do not use a fan on the IC.

As far as aftermarket hoods, as long as the vents are big enough, driving it at 130 mph is no problem. I have taken my car to 180+ mph with the type S hood. The car also has a cwest bumper of which the mouth is twice as large as the stock one. There wasn't any bending or flexing on the hood. On the contrary, when I had the stock hood, I can see the sides of the hood bowing up when I go more than 140 mph and it was shaking violently.

Chuck Huang

rotaryextreme

iTrader: (2)

The radiator does not really contribute a lot to heat soak of a Vmount IC. It will heat soak less than a SMIC because the radiator fan does not blow on it.

If you want to keep your IC cool all the time, put a fan on it. But if your car is always moving such as under racing condition, you probably don't need a fan.

Chuck Huang

ptrhahn

iTrader: (9)

While I don't have one, you've got to admit that the V-mount appears to be such a superior design, its a wonder that mazda didn't set the car up this way in the first place. With either a FMIC or SMIC, you've got one heat exchanger significantly blocking the airflow to the other, no matter how you slice it... not to mention a tiny opening (if any) for cold air to the intake.