Building a BEAST...R85, Jay-Tech, etc. - Questions
02-15-05, 04:19 PM
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Building a BEAST...R85, Jay-Tech, etc. - Questions
So, I've been doing a lot of thinking, and I think I want to switch to a bigger turbo. Assuming I see a few solid dynos of cars with the R85 (not that I doubt the shop's dyno), I'll be buying this kit for my car by the end of the year. In addition, I'm thinking of what else I want/need to make my car an absolute beast.
Are the Jay-Tech products worthwhile? What parts exactly would I need? Judging by the pictures, it seems that the intercooler piping/elbow goes into this plenum:
HP-2000
which sits on top of this throttle body:
#JT1200
which sits on top of one of the LIMs (not sure which one) from here http://kgparts.com/jay-tech.htm (may not be pictured?)
Anyways, would this setup be ridiculous or unstreetable? My goal for my car is to keep it a reasonably quiet street car with AC and a stereo but still make around 500 whp on pump gas and lots more on race gas with a quick spool. The R85 seems like it could do all of this, but I'm not sure if the new plenum/TB/LIM are necessary or even beneficial when I still want to keep decent driveability.
Anyways, what are your thoughts? How much would the 3 Jay-tech pieces cost? What kind of gains could I expect with the Jay-tech stuff? Would they negatively influence driveability?
Also, I thought that Ralph's new LIM might be an option as well; however, judging by various pictures, it looks as if the GroundZero/Xcessive LIM would cause significant clearance issues with the R85 (and my T66 incidentally).
Are the Jay-Tech products worthwhile? What parts exactly would I need? Judging by the pictures, it seems that the intercooler piping/elbow goes into this plenum:
HP-2000
which sits on top of this throttle body:
#JT1200
which sits on top of one of the LIMs (not sure which one) from here http://kgparts.com/jay-tech.htm (may not be pictured?)
Anyways, would this setup be ridiculous or unstreetable? My goal for my car is to keep it a reasonably quiet street car with AC and a stereo but still make around 500 whp on pump gas and lots more on race gas with a quick spool. The R85 seems like it could do all of this, but I'm not sure if the new plenum/TB/LIM are necessary or even beneficial when I still want to keep decent driveability.
Anyways, what are your thoughts? How much would the 3 Jay-tech pieces cost? What kind of gains could I expect with the Jay-tech stuff? Would they negatively influence driveability?
Also, I thought that Ralph's new LIM might be an option as well; however, judging by various pictures, it looks as if the GroundZero/Xcessive LIM would cause significant clearance issues with the R85 (and my T66 incidentally).
Last edited by pianoprodigy; 02-15-05 at 04:22 PM.
02-15-05, 06:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Kyro-2
Not tryin to be mean but you ask ALOT of questions... Maybe im just crazy but thats what ive noticed
FD3SR1 - The first picture is the "plenum" where the air is collected to go into the "throttle body" which is the second picture. The plates on the throttle body open based on gas pedal input and allows more or less air into the lower intake manifold which allows the air to flow into the intake ports.
Edit: Kyro, LOL. I just realized who you are...I still don't have my car back. Hopefully this week.
02-15-05, 08:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Kyro-2
Not tryin to be mean but you ask ALOT of questions... Maybe im just crazy but thats what ive noticed
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02-15-05, 08:20 PM
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Originally Posted by ghostrx7
Maybe Im wrong, but isnt the t66 bigger then the r85....?
And forget the Jay-tech manifold, because they arn't made anymore. I may sell mine in the spring though. The runners on the Jay-Tech are twice as large as the stock manifold, plus you able to run a much larger throttle body.
Last edited by ErnieT; 02-15-05 at 08:25 PM.
02-15-05, 08:27 PM
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Originally Posted by pianoprodigy
That's what the forum is for, right? I agree that the search should be utilized more often, but in this case, I think his question is on point.
FD3SR1 - The first picture is the "plenum" where the air is collected to go into the "throttle body" which is the second picture. The plates on the throttle body open based on gas pedal input and allows more or less air into the lower intake manifold which allows the air to flow into the intake ports.
Edit: Kyro, LOL. I just realized who you are...I still don't have my car back. Hopefully this week.
FD3SR1 - The first picture is the "plenum" where the air is collected to go into the "throttle body" which is the second picture. The plates on the throttle body open based on gas pedal input and allows more or less air into the lower intake manifold which allows the air to flow into the intake ports.
Edit: Kyro, LOL. I just realized who you are...I still don't have my car back. Hopefully this week.
02-15-05, 09:02 PM
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[QUOTE=FD3SR1]Thanks for the answers but why go after market? i have never heard of a problem with the trottle body being restrictive.[/QUOTE
If you want to make some power, you will need to upgrade. Im talking over 600rwhp. Alot of people have claims of making this much power on a "street car", but not many have.
If you want to make some power, you will need to upgrade. Im talking over 600rwhp. Alot of people have claims of making this much power on a "street car", but not many have.
02-15-05, 10:54 PM
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Although they will not be cast anymore... there are a lot of boxes that can be broken open and machined Ernie.... I have a lot of them. This dosent mean they will last forever as Puerto Rico takes them often and actualy "uses" them.
To the original poster asking the question, let it come from me, the guy selling them, that even though they are proven and DO work ( http://www.kgparts.com/Times.htm ) if you are driving this car on the street, you do not "need" to spend this money here. Not that the setup wont "work" on the street, just that you do not "need" it to obtain the power level you are trying to reach. My best advice is to spend that money on a tuner that can make that power for you, max out what you have and then move into it when needed. Even if you have to fly them in for a day or two and put them up with room and board from half way around the world and use a translator to comunicate.
If tuner "A" is able to make 600 on his own car, then you may see 450ish on yours. if tuner "B" can make 1000 on theirs, you are more than likely to see more from your car than with tuner A. trickle down.... You are NOT going to get a tuner that also races to get you the same power they have been able to achieve. If they are coming to your hometown for a weekend... one mistake by them and it will be a very expensive weekend.... Does this make any sense?
I am not trying to talk you out of your purchase, but give it to you straight. Its not about making or not making a sale, but helping make a right decission. I am not saying you "cant" do it, but i would think twice unless that money tree in your back yard is in bloom in the near future, you could buy it for the future while they are available.
To the original poster asking the question, let it come from me, the guy selling them, that even though they are proven and DO work ( http://www.kgparts.com/Times.htm ) if you are driving this car on the street, you do not "need" to spend this money here. Not that the setup wont "work" on the street, just that you do not "need" it to obtain the power level you are trying to reach. My best advice is to spend that money on a tuner that can make that power for you, max out what you have and then move into it when needed. Even if you have to fly them in for a day or two and put them up with room and board from half way around the world and use a translator to comunicate.
If tuner "A" is able to make 600 on his own car, then you may see 450ish on yours. if tuner "B" can make 1000 on theirs, you are more than likely to see more from your car than with tuner A. trickle down.... You are NOT going to get a tuner that also races to get you the same power they have been able to achieve. If they are coming to your hometown for a weekend... one mistake by them and it will be a very expensive weekend.... Does this make any sense?
I am not trying to talk you out of your purchase, but give it to you straight. Its not about making or not making a sale, but helping make a right decission. I am not saying you "cant" do it, but i would think twice unless that money tree in your back yard is in bloom in the near future, you could buy it for the future while they are available.
02-15-05, 11:13 PM
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Originally Posted by rxrotary2_7
Although they will not be cast anymore... there are a lot of boxes that can be broken open and machined Ernie.... I have a lot of them. This dosent mean they will last forever as Puerto Rico takes them often and actualy "uses" them.
To the original poster asking the question, let it come from me, the guy selling them, that even though they are proven and DO work ( http://www.kgparts.com/Times.htm ) if you are driving this car on the street, you do not "need" to spend this money here. Not that the setup wont "work" on the street, just that you do not "need" it to obtain the power level you are trying to reach. My best advice is to spend that money on a tuner that can make that power for you, max out what you have and then move into it when needed. Even if you have to fly them in for a day or two and put them up with room and board from half way around the world and use a translator to comunicate.
If tuner "A" is able to make 600 on his own car, then you may see 450ish on yours. if tuner "B" can make 1000 on theirs, you are more than likely to see more from your car than with tuner A. trickle down.... You are NOT going to get a tuner that also races to get you the same power they have been able to achieve. If they are coming to your hometown for a weekend... one mistake by them and it will be a very expensive weekend.... Does this make any sense?
I am not trying to talk you out of your purchase, but give it to you straight. Its not about making or not making a sale, but helping make a right decission. I am not saying you "cant" do it, but i would think twice unless that money tree in your back yard is in bloom in the near future, you could buy it for the future while they are available.
To the original poster asking the question, let it come from me, the guy selling them, that even though they are proven and DO work ( http://www.kgparts.com/Times.htm ) if you are driving this car on the street, you do not "need" to spend this money here. Not that the setup wont "work" on the street, just that you do not "need" it to obtain the power level you are trying to reach. My best advice is to spend that money on a tuner that can make that power for you, max out what you have and then move into it when needed. Even if you have to fly them in for a day or two and put them up with room and board from half way around the world and use a translator to comunicate.
If tuner "A" is able to make 600 on his own car, then you may see 450ish on yours. if tuner "B" can make 1000 on theirs, you are more than likely to see more from your car than with tuner A. trickle down.... You are NOT going to get a tuner that also races to get you the same power they have been able to achieve. If they are coming to your hometown for a weekend... one mistake by them and it will be a very expensive weekend.... Does this make any sense?
I am not trying to talk you out of your purchase, but give it to you straight. Its not about making or not making a sale, but helping make a right decission. I am not saying you "cant" do it, but i would think twice unless that money tree in your back yard is in bloom in the near future, you could buy it for the future while they are available.
Thanks for your informative, honest post. I realize that the tuner makes a huge difference. Just curious, what is your take on the GroundZero/Xcessive LIM? Do you find the equal volume/length issue to be significant?
-Alan
02-16-05, 04:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Kyro-2
Not tryin to be mean but you ask ALOT of questions... Maybe im just crazy but thats what ive noticed
I'd rather have a question, than someone posting mis-information, wouldn't you?
02-16-05, 06:16 AM
#14
Originally Posted by rxrotary2_7
Although they will not be cast anymore... there are a lot of boxes that can be broken open and machined Ernie.... I have a lot of them. This dosent mean they will last forever as Puerto Rico takes them often and actualy "uses" them.
To the original poster asking the question, let it come from me, the guy selling them, that even though they are proven and DO work ( http://www.kgparts.com/Times.htm ) if you are driving this car on the street, you do not "need" to spend this money here. Not that the setup wont "work" on the street, just that you do not "need" it to obtain the power level you are trying to reach. My best advice is to spend that money on a tuner that can make that power for you, max out what you have and then move into it when needed. Even if you have to fly them in for a day or two and put them up with room and board from half way around the world and use a translator to comunicate.
If tuner "A" is able to make 600 on his own car, then you may see 450ish on yours. if tuner "B" can make 1000 on theirs, you are more than likely to see more from your car than with tuner A. trickle down.... You are NOT going to get a tuner that also races to get you the same power they have been able to achieve. If they are coming to your hometown for a weekend... one mistake by them and it will be a very expensive weekend.... Does this make any sense?
I am not trying to talk you out of your purchase, but give it to you straight. Its not about making or not making a sale, but helping make a right decission. I am not saying you "cant" do it, but i would think twice unless that money tree in your back yard is in bloom in the near future, you could buy it for the future while they are available.
To the original poster asking the question, let it come from me, the guy selling them, that even though they are proven and DO work ( http://www.kgparts.com/Times.htm ) if you are driving this car on the street, you do not "need" to spend this money here. Not that the setup wont "work" on the street, just that you do not "need" it to obtain the power level you are trying to reach. My best advice is to spend that money on a tuner that can make that power for you, max out what you have and then move into it when needed. Even if you have to fly them in for a day or two and put them up with room and board from half way around the world and use a translator to comunicate.
If tuner "A" is able to make 600 on his own car, then you may see 450ish on yours. if tuner "B" can make 1000 on theirs, you are more than likely to see more from your car than with tuner A. trickle down.... You are NOT going to get a tuner that also races to get you the same power they have been able to achieve. If they are coming to your hometown for a weekend... one mistake by them and it will be a very expensive weekend.... Does this make any sense?
I am not trying to talk you out of your purchase, but give it to you straight. Its not about making or not making a sale, but helping make a right decission. I am not saying you "cant" do it, but i would think twice unless that money tree in your back yard is in bloom in the near future, you could buy it for the future while they are available.
Isn't it true that the above mentioned setup will yield more HP from mid to high rpms, than the OEM setup while keeping everything else equal (Turbo, ECU, tuner, etc)?
02-16-05, 06:18 AM
#16
Originally Posted by pianoprodigy
So, I've been doing a lot of thinking, and I think I want to switch to a bigger turbo. Assuming I see a few solid dynos of cars with the R85 (not that I doubt the shop's dyno), I'll be buying this kit for my car by the end of the year. In addition, I'm thinking of what else I want/need to make my car an absolute beast.
Are the Jay-Tech products worthwhile? What parts exactly would I need? Judging by the pictures, it seems that the intercooler piping/elbow goes into this plenum:
HP-2000
which sits on top of this throttle body:
#JT1200
which sits on top of one of the LIMs (not sure which one) from here http://kgparts.com/jay-tech.htm (may not be pictured?)
Anyways, would this setup be ridiculous or unstreetable? My goal for my car is to keep it a reasonably quiet street car with AC and a stereo but still make around 500 whp on pump gas and lots more on race gas with a quick spool. The R85 seems like it could do all of this, but I'm not sure if the new plenum/TB/LIM are necessary or even beneficial when I still want to keep decent driveability.
Anyways, what are your thoughts? How much would the 3 Jay-tech pieces cost? What kind of gains could I expect with the Jay-tech stuff? Would they negatively influence driveability?
Also, I thought that Ralph's new LIM might be an option as well; however, judging by various pictures, it looks as if the GroundZero/Xcessive LIM would cause significant clearance issues with the R85 (and my T66 incidentally).
Are the Jay-Tech products worthwhile? What parts exactly would I need? Judging by the pictures, it seems that the intercooler piping/elbow goes into this plenum:
HP-2000
which sits on top of this throttle body:
#JT1200
which sits on top of one of the LIMs (not sure which one) from here http://kgparts.com/jay-tech.htm (may not be pictured?)
Anyways, would this setup be ridiculous or unstreetable? My goal for my car is to keep it a reasonably quiet street car with AC and a stereo but still make around 500 whp on pump gas and lots more on race gas with a quick spool. The R85 seems like it could do all of this, but I'm not sure if the new plenum/TB/LIM are necessary or even beneficial when I still want to keep decent driveability.
Anyways, what are your thoughts? How much would the 3 Jay-tech pieces cost? What kind of gains could I expect with the Jay-tech stuff? Would they negatively influence driveability?
Also, I thought that Ralph's new LIM might be an option as well; however, judging by various pictures, it looks as if the GroundZero/Xcessive LIM would cause significant clearance issues with the R85 (and my T66 incidentally).
If they stop making it, you can always go the Racing Beat route
02-16-05, 09:46 AM
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Originally Posted by KNONFS
If they stop making it, you can always go the Racing Beat route
02-16-05, 02:15 PM
#19
Originally Posted by pianoprodigy
I'm not familiar with this route. Do you have a link to a picture or description? I didn't find anything on their site.
Here is the one for the 2nd gen:
The TB can be bought from different places, but on the TB I would rather go with keith's
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