Billet turbos, whats the deal ??
03-14-09, 12:03 PM
#26
It's been in the build for some time.
Anyway the Billet GT4276 performed like we thought it would. Entire powerband is up everywhere.
We tried for more boost but wheel spin was a major problem. Power is now right at 800whp.
I guess some just like to get let left behind. 
The Precision billet wheels offer major flow improvement over the other designs for the same dimensions etc.
For example their 62mm offers greater airflow than a regular 67mm but without the drawbacks of running the larger wheel.
When you find another 62mm compressor turbo that can support almost 800whp and maintain the spool up of a 35R let me know. For the time being I will stay in front with my ''quattro'' razors.
Havent seen that one yet. How long have you guys had that one?Anyway the Billet GT4276 performed like we thought it would. Entire powerband is up everywhere.
We tried for more boost but wheel spin was a major problem. Power is now right at 800whp.
The Precision billet wheels offer major flow improvement over the other designs for the same dimensions etc.
For example their 62mm offers greater airflow than a regular 67mm but without the drawbacks of running the larger wheel.
When you find another 62mm compressor turbo that can support almost 800whp and maintain the spool up of a 35R let me know. For the time being I will stay in front with my ''quattro'' razors.
03-14-09, 12:33 PM
#27
I'm not trying to be an *** here, and I know there are no Precision turbo reps on this forum. I'd just like to consider myself an ordinary enthusiast with limited dollars and a lot of options, who needs to ask hard questions about this product.
Who would have details or side-by-side pics comparing a traditional cast Garrett 62mm wheel (62-1 or whatever) and the new Precision billet ones? How are the precision wheels shaped differently? Are there fewer blades or something? What am I getting for my money besides some well-meaning testimonials from respected people, something I can get for a lot of products?
Who would have details or side-by-side pics comparing a traditional cast Garrett 62mm wheel (62-1 or whatever) and the new Precision billet ones? How are the precision wheels shaped differently? Are there fewer blades or something? What am I getting for my money besides some well-meaning testimonials from respected people, something I can get for a lot of products?
Most people hear its a new design and it doesnt mean much, they want proven results that its a better product. You are seeing proven results from many people(or havent you?) but you want to know the turbo is really different.
As far as using the term "billet" as a marketing technique, there is a purpose. Precision has some wheels in both billet and cast, one example is the new 67mm. Retail for the older cast model is $1375 for BB, and the retail for the billet model is $2109. Big difference in price, and without a marketing technique you cant justify the price difference, and they wont sell. What differentiates them? Nothing but a new compressor from billet aluminum. How will people know the difference? You need a naming system that differentiates the two. If I go out and buy an F430, what does that tell you? Base model F430, of course. What if I say Scuderia? Its VERY different car, and the name is a dead ringer for what the differences are.
Back to the engineering aspect. Just because a turbo shares dimensions with another doesnt mean they are an equal product. Thats like comparing a professional boxer to an amateur simply because they are the same in height and weight. Dimensions between the wheels are shared for good reasons. Housings will swap easily between the older designs and new ones, and thats a HUGE advantage. You dont need new castings and you dont need to machine housings to fit correctly, it saves a huge amount of money. Additionally, if you compare the standard 6765 and the billet 6765, you will see similar spool but there is a big difference in mass flow rates(more power!).
Sure, you can move up to a bigger compressor to make more power, but why would you want to when you dont need to? Its all about the efficiency! Working smarter is better than working harder, right? If I get the chance I can take a couple pictures comparing a 35R to a 6262. You can see the difference, but you wont understand the fundamentals of what makes one better than the other(unless you have a strong engineering background).
Cliffs notes: You cant always say two things are the same by looking at the basic details. Yes, "billet" is also a marketing technique.
03-14-09, 01:11 PM
#29
When you just look into the compressor and view the the compressor wheel you can see one major difference. Looking at the inducer, the OD is the same but the major difference would be in the area around the boss/shank where the shaft goes through. Being made of billet that area can be much smaller and still be of the same strength or even stronger. So what does the smaller dimension in that area offer? The lenght of the inducer's blade when measured from the shank or boss to the OD/tip is much greater than what would be available from a casted wheel of the same inducer size.
So basically you're getting the same performance as a wheel of greater dimensions but without the drawbacks that come along with it.
There are also a lot of other benefits that come along with using these billet wheels especially when the turbo is being pushed to the limits. Being lighter they offer greater strength with quicker spool up and they maintain their flow at very high pressure ratios. Basically they have a very wide operating region or to say they offer a very wide map for the technical ones!
With the 67mm billet turbo going by what I've experienced with the 62's I'm going to say that it is very likely that it will produce the same power as a regular casted compressor wheel in the 70-72mm range. Only time will tell.
So basically you're getting the same performance as a wheel of greater dimensions but without the drawbacks that come along with it.
There are also a lot of other benefits that come along with using these billet wheels especially when the turbo is being pushed to the limits. Being lighter they offer greater strength with quicker spool up and they maintain their flow at very high pressure ratios. Basically they have a very wide operating region or to say they offer a very wide map for the technical ones!
With the 67mm billet turbo going by what I've experienced with the 62's I'm going to say that it is very likely that it will produce the same power as a regular casted compressor wheel in the 70-72mm range. Only time will tell.
03-14-09, 09:58 PM
#30
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I understand your point of view, its good to know about a product you are buying, but these turbos have proven results to be superior, and you still have doubts. As an example, the Crispeed/AWD Evo made 784whp in a T3 frame, nobody has made even close to that in a 35R. More and more people are showing that these turbos perform better than a similarly sized Garrett product. You are actually one of the people who looks at this backwards.
Most people hear its a new design and it doesnt mean much, they want proven results that its a better product. You are seeing proven results from many people(or havent you?) but you want to know the turbo is really different.
As far as using the term "billet" as a marketing technique, there is a purpose. Precision has some wheels in both billet and cast, one example is the new 67mm. Retail for the older cast model is $1375 for BB, and the retail for the billet model is $2109. Big difference in price, and without a marketing technique you cant justify the price difference, and they wont sell. What differentiates them? Nothing but a new compressor from billet aluminum. How will people know the difference? You need a naming system that differentiates the two. If I go out and buy an F430, what does that tell you? Base model F430, of course. What if I say Scuderia? Its VERY different car, and the name is a dead ringer for what the differences are.
Back to the engineering aspect. Just because a turbo shares dimensions with another doesnt mean they are an equal product. Thats like comparing a professional boxer to an amateur simply because they are the same in height and weight. Dimensions between the wheels are shared for good reasons. Housings will swap easily between the older designs and new ones, and thats a HUGE advantage. You dont need new castings and you dont need to machine housings to fit correctly, it saves a huge amount of money. Additionally, if you compare the standard 6765 and the billet 6765, you will see similar spool but there is a big difference in mass flow rates(more power!).
Sure, you can move up to a bigger compressor to make more power, but why would you want to when you dont need to? Its all about the efficiency! Working smarter is better than working harder, right? If I get the chance I can take a couple pictures comparing a 35R to a 6262. You can see the difference, but you wont understand the fundamentals of what makes one better than the other(unless you have a strong engineering background).
Cliffs notes: You cant always say two things are the same by looking at the basic details. Yes, "billet" is also a marketing technique.
Most people hear its a new design and it doesnt mean much, they want proven results that its a better product. You are seeing proven results from many people(or havent you?) but you want to know the turbo is really different.
As far as using the term "billet" as a marketing technique, there is a purpose. Precision has some wheels in both billet and cast, one example is the new 67mm. Retail for the older cast model is $1375 for BB, and the retail for the billet model is $2109. Big difference in price, and without a marketing technique you cant justify the price difference, and they wont sell. What differentiates them? Nothing but a new compressor from billet aluminum. How will people know the difference? You need a naming system that differentiates the two. If I go out and buy an F430, what does that tell you? Base model F430, of course. What if I say Scuderia? Its VERY different car, and the name is a dead ringer for what the differences are.
Back to the engineering aspect. Just because a turbo shares dimensions with another doesnt mean they are an equal product. Thats like comparing a professional boxer to an amateur simply because they are the same in height and weight. Dimensions between the wheels are shared for good reasons. Housings will swap easily between the older designs and new ones, and thats a HUGE advantage. You dont need new castings and you dont need to machine housings to fit correctly, it saves a huge amount of money. Additionally, if you compare the standard 6765 and the billet 6765, you will see similar spool but there is a big difference in mass flow rates(more power!).
Sure, you can move up to a bigger compressor to make more power, but why would you want to when you dont need to? Its all about the efficiency! Working smarter is better than working harder, right? If I get the chance I can take a couple pictures comparing a 35R to a 6262. You can see the difference, but you wont understand the fundamentals of what makes one better than the other(unless you have a strong engineering background).
Cliffs notes: You cant always say two things are the same by looking at the basic details. Yes, "billet" is also a marketing technique.
This was very well put, I guess the proof is in the pudding. For garett to make an identical replica but have it cnc'd, it may very well not make a difference, but this is not what precision is doing, they are changing the design of the compressor wheel and thus alowing the flow chaacteristics to be better then the same sized cast wheel. Im definitely going with precision and am looking forward to chosing what size is best for my car. Oh yeah and for the record the Scuderia reference was bang on its a totally different beast then the stock 430.
03-15-09, 12:50 AM
#31
When you just look into the compressor and view the the compressor wheel you can see one major difference. Looking at the inducer, the OD is the same but the major difference would be in the area around the boss/shank where the shaft goes through. Being made of billet that area can be much smaller and still be of the same strength or even stronger. So what does the smaller dimension in that area offer? The lenght of the inducer's blade when measured from the shank or boss to the OD/tip is much greater than what would be available from a casted wheel of the same inducer size.
So basically you're getting the same performance as a wheel of greater dimensions but without the drawbacks that come along with it.
There are also a lot of other benefits that come along with using these billet wheels especially when the turbo is being pushed to the limits. Being lighter they offer greater strength with quicker spool up and they maintain their flow at very high pressure ratios. Basically they have a very wide operating region or to say they offer a very wide map for the technical ones!
With the 67mm billet turbo going by what I've experienced with the 62's I'm going to say that it is very likely that it will produce the same power as a regular casted compressor wheel in the 70-72mm range. Only time will tell.
So basically you're getting the same performance as a wheel of greater dimensions but without the drawbacks that come along with it.
There are also a lot of other benefits that come along with using these billet wheels especially when the turbo is being pushed to the limits. Being lighter they offer greater strength with quicker spool up and they maintain their flow at very high pressure ratios. Basically they have a very wide operating region or to say they offer a very wide map for the technical ones!
With the 67mm billet turbo going by what I've experienced with the 62's I'm going to say that it is very likely that it will produce the same power as a regular casted compressor wheel in the 70-72mm range. Only time will tell.
03-15-09, 02:03 AM
#32
03-28-09, 08:26 PM
#35
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I am having trouble deciding if I want to pick up a 6262s or 6265s (Or am I completely in the wrong area for something to make at least as much as my t04s is?) I doubt I will ever need more than 400 rwhp, and I like to stay under 1 bar if possible. I will be using pump gas all this season now that I need to get a new turbo instead of AI. :/
Was thinking of grabbing something like this: (I need it asap if possible so I'm looking for things that people have in stock.)http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...id=p2759.l1259
I was thinking about grabbing a PT67 but the seller isn't responding. If I can have a 62mm that flows like a 67, I will pay the extra $.
Was thinking of grabbing something like this: (I need it asap if possible so I'm looking for things that people have in stock.)http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...id=p2759.l1259
I was thinking about grabbing a PT67 but the seller isn't responding. If I can have a 62mm that flows like a 67, I will pay the extra $.
03-30-09, 08:11 PM
#36
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06-01-09, 08:55 AM
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All the early model were made with Precision Turbos parts bar the ball bearings and cartridge.
Now all their parts are made in house or especially for them. Jacked from a Supra forum.
Who makes Garrett’s bearings?
A 13B I heard of running a 72mm one. 9.1’s aren’t half bad.
http://www.blacktrackperformance.com...showpage&pid=9
06-03-09, 10:56 PM
#43
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Its been three months and still no dyno graphs, doesn't anybody tune their cars? I swear once mine is up and running i will put up my results.
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