Hey all.. I know there are a thousand threads about a flooded engine, but I'm here as much to commiserate as to get help...

background..
The section of exhaust piping that holds the second pre-converter (on my 86 GXL) had been popping loose on my drives home from work, resulting in a very loud, very smelly car. I had been patching it back into place with JB Weld (which lasted about two to four days before the heat killed it) until I could get a friend to hit it with a couple of tack welds.

Well, one morning (the day I was planning to get it welded, as it turns out), the glue from the night before didn't make a good bond, and the exhaust pipe popped out before I had even left my driveway. It was way too loud to drive into work (I thought I'd probably get a ticket), and way too early to leave the car running outside that loud (neighbors would get pitchforks and torches, maybe).. and it was early in the morning, so I wasn't thinking completely straight.

the event...
I drove it back into the garage and shut it off almost immediately after starting it.

the result..
the next day I tried to start it to take it to get welded, and the thing wouldn't start. (the sound of a non-starting rotary to me seems rather different than the sound of a non-starting piston engine.. just an observation)

the recovery efforts..
I let it sit for 2 days (no choice, was busy with other things), and tried to start it again.. no dice.

I pulled the fuse under the dash (don't think it was the right one, now) and turned it over, then put the fuse back in and tried to start it. No dice.

I pulled the fuse under the hood (egi inj, I believe), and turned it over 5 times or so for about 5 seconds at a time.. put the fuse back in and tried to start it. No dice.

I took the spark plugs out, pulled the fuse under the hood, turned it over 5 times or so for about 5 seconds at a time, put the fuse back in, cleaned the crap off the plugs, put the plugs back in, tried to start it. No dice.

I pulled the plugs again, pulled the fuse again. Turned it over a few times. Let it sit a few hours. Turned it over again. Let it sit without spark plugs for another 20 hours or so. Put the plugs back in, put the fuse back in, tried to start it. No dice.

the self-doubt...
Maybe I messed up the spark plug wire order or reinstallation.. I'm pretty darn sure I've got the leading plugs in the leading holes, and the leading wire on the leading plugs... but I wonder if maybe I have them on the wrong rotor? The coil packs are labeled Leading 1, Leading 2, Trailing 1, and Trailing 2.. but I have no certainty as to which rotor is one and which is two.. I figure 1 was most likely to be the one closest to the front bumper and assigned them that way.
(oh... and the reason I didn't label them immediately as I was taking them off is that I took off just one at first, and left the others on. then I got my wrench down there to take out the plug, and accidently knocked the other wires off in my maneuvering.. argh..)

I'm pretty sure the wires are fully on the plugs.. and I cleaned the contacts in the wires and on the plugs.
(There were several battery rechargings and jump-assisted elements to the story omitted for brevity)

the desparation...
What the heck am I gonna do now? push starting isn't really an option because my driveway is too steep to get it back up pushing by hand if the car still won't start...

Help me out here, anybody have experience with anything like this? Could I have mis-diagnosed the problem? Could I have damaged something else in my attempts to resurrect the car?

Thanks for reading, and any help you can provide..

 

I know you said pushstarting isn't a option, but try it...you can get some car to push you and get it going real easily. I had to do this once...this should get you going faster than trying to pull your hair out.

as far as the rotor numbers one (front) two (rear)... trailing is the top plugs leading the bottom!

 

Heh.. Thanks, trailing and leading are labelled on the car, so that part was no problem!

 

cool! good deal!

 

Have you tried using any atf ?

 

don't use ATF just use some OIL...try that...also get some fresh plugs and see if that helps...
to use the oil, first unflood the car by removing all plugs and egi and egi comp fuses...turn car over as many times as it takes to where u stop see fuel vapor coming out(make sure your plug wires are out of the way--fire hazard)....then use a hose and squirt about a table spoon of oil in the the leading holes-- do this for each side of the rotors(turn main pully 1/3 turn to get each face)...what u are doing is resealing the rotor housing as the oil film washes off when it becomes flooded.... next put fresh plugs in and connect everything back up...the car should start up...if not just push start it!

 

how does the ATF thing work? How would I pour it into the plug hole, it's kinda tight in there. Pour it into the leading hole? How much, a drop? a cap full? half a bottle? do I need to turn the car over some and then re-pour to get it into all three chambers of each rotor? or does it get around the seals well enough?

I'm a little bit wary of just pouring unknown amounts of incompressible fluid into my engine...

 

Ahh.. Nashman, sorry.. you posted while I was replying.. 1 tablespoon on each rotor face? I'll give that a try, I guess.. thanks! Plugs should be only 12000 miles old, or so.. hmm..

Thanks again, everyone!

 

i found though that somtimes fresh plugs help...try all the other methods first I guess before spending $30 on new plugs!

 

nashman69g - why should atf not be used ?. i've started a flooded engine a few times now using this method and it has worked fine.

 

i know it works, but the adatives (i've read here and there) are somewhat corrosive...Atf should be used to free carbon locks, not to reseal the housings...thats what the oil metering system does...it doesn't put in Atf it puts in oil!!

 

Ok... here comes the paranoia.. I was checking my Service Manual, which states that spark plug wires should have 16 kOhms of resistance per meter. As best as I can tell my wires are all about a meter long, but the resistance I measured for 3 of them is 8ish kOhms and one is 5ish kOhms...
Edit: checked again, 8ish for the longer ones (~3 ft) and 5ish for the shorter ones (~2 ft) so they all pretty much have the same Resistance/ft, but it seems to be about half of specification.. hmm...

But I thought that when spark plug wires failed, they failed on high resistance, not _LOW_ resistance..

Is there some common plug and wire combination that would be some special low-resistance setup (resistor on plug or something??)

 

The last time mine flooded I worked on it for 8 hours, ATF, new plugs , oil etc, etc.

In the end I rolled it down the hill and she fired up in just a few seconds.

For my time and energy, not to mention the danger of damaging something for all of the messing about, if it ever floods again...I'll push start it!

 

remember that the starter only turns the engine over at about 250 rpm ....push starting can get it way higher than that!

 

towing works even better...had to do both many times. It might take a few tries depending how badly flooding but guranteed to start any engine...even if it's blown... heh...found that out the hard way...

 

And the moral of this thread is...Never turn off your RX-7 before reaching normal operating temperature.

How about MMO, a lot of people use that

 

AFM loose? Idle need adjusting? Timing off? lol, unholy possession?

 

One thing to add to this thread is that 12,000 miles on a set of plug is not good. I used to change them every 8,000 or so. A visual on the plugs should show light erosion on the center electrode and the surrounding area.

I have had several situations where new plugs were the answer in addition to ATF/Oil in the plug holes. A good way to get fluid in the engine is to go to the drug store and ask for a few infant syringes (no needle attached). Suck some oil in and inject it into the leading plug holes.

 

Push start it. Trust me. Put some towels between your rear bumper and the push vehicle, and be gentle. Tow starting is dangerous.

You could **** around with it for hours, but if it's that flooded, a 10 second push start will work everytime.

As for unflooding, I prefer oil over ATF. Thicker, absorbs more gas. If you want to use ATF, go ahead. But it will create a massive smoke cloud, and fowl the plugs. Oil is DESIGNED to go into an engine, ATF is not.

 

mabey your battery is low now jump it with a good one..

are the plugs new??
charge the battery or jump it with a good one also i used a funnel with a hose attached to it from kragen to put about 300cc of atf fluis into each leading plug hole front and rear.. remember have the fuse out for the efi while turning the motor to get the atf fluid around the housings crank it about 10 seconds..then replace with new plugs and jump start it.should start if not then try to bump start it..dont push it with another car..Just get about 2-4 friends to push it and drop the clutch in with 1st gear and you should start right up..

 

Ok guys, thanks for all the help, advice, and encouragement. I finally got it started late yesterday. Unfortunately I can't report that there was a magic silver bullet.

I did try the oil thing, but it did not result in an immediate fire-off. What finally worked was plenty of alternating between turning it over with the underhood fuses pulled (about 4 or 5 times for 4 or 5 seconds each) and then putting them back in and trying it.. Eventually the car just started to try to turn over, and then it finally caught and fumigated the neighborhood.

And yes, throughout the entire latter half of the process, the 7 was jumped to another car that sat there with its engine running providing a steady 14 volts to draw from to keep my spark good and my starter motor well powered.

I never did try to push start it because the "get 4 or 5 guys" option was unavailable to me.. just me, myself, and I.

PaulyDee, as for replacing the spark plugs every 8000 miles, you realize that is more than 3 times more often than the manual recommends (every 30,000 miles)?

So I guess in summary, what worked for me: another car providing juice for my poor drained battery, and lots of attempts alternating between turning it over with the fuses out versus putting them back in and trying it (I turned off the ignition before putting the fuses back in, to be safe). I did poor in the oil, but I'm not sure it made a difference, since it was quite a while later before it started.


sa22c_Drifter-- Amen to that.. I just wasn't thinking straight in the morning..

 

Ok well heres the deal i understand the leading and trailing part wich meens thats assinment for the loop it makes with the electricity because i belive its for the high powered engine like the RX-7 because that enigine man your talking with NOS about 195mph to about 220mph twin rot. :> man your talking one hot engine unless ether you forget where the spark plug wires went or the previuos owner changes the spark plugs then gets the wires mixed up where they plug in at the engine but the but some how manages to acctually plug up the spark plug wires in reverse order to the main igniter meeing instead of pluging in wire 1 to terminal 1 and wire 2 to terminal 2 he plugs it in like this 2 to t1 and 1 to t2 lol get that so when you take off the spark plug wires to maintain or repair you put them on backwards because you see t1 and t2 and the wires are labeled 1 and 2
so if thats the corect order 1to1 and 2to2 let me know plz