^Lol, how bout a high strung LS1 turbo and some giggle juice. I think that might just win the power battle.

 

Is a lt1 a good option if it is available???

 

Haha, I dont want to start a flame war, but I'll bring it up once to keep the LS-1 guys in check- The worlds fastest 20B drag car is faster than the worlds fastest Ls-1 drag car. Thats the end folks, at the top, at the end, the 20b is still on top. Not that I care a whole lot, as most of us will NEVER be that far up. Now everything between top and bottom is a whole lot of grey area, and its anyones chance.

 

keep in mind that the LS is a fairly new engine, but the developement of parts and performance for the LS1 is growing every day, still not enough time as the 20B has had.

give it the time that the 20B has had to develope to what it can do today and you'll see what i mean.

the "who has more power than who" really matters on how much innovation and money has gone into it - the 20B is older, so obvious more is available for it.

(i hope this comment doesn't get deleted as well)

 

20b No questions no second thoughts and i like Ls1 =)

 

If your going to go 20b you better go turbo and you better see over 600 rwhp, for the money go ls1. If your doing the work yourself go ls1. If you care about gas mileage... go ls1.

Your gonna have to fill us in on your budget and what you want the car to do.

 

Yes

20b is cool, but they make a complete kit to drop in a LS1.

 

Sorry, you obviously don't know what are you talking about. This time/development differences is completely irrelevant and strongly favors the Ls1. The 20b was designed for a Luxury sports sedan and not a performance sports car. There are maybe 5000 20b engines in the entire worlds existence compared to what millions of Ls1's rolling around American streets. When was the last time you were able to look at a performance catalog and order off the shelf parts for any 20b even in Japan? Good luck compared to the LS1. Bottom line the LS1 has way more R&D than the 20b can even dream about regardless it it's a slightly newer engine.


This is where the 20b really shines over the LS1 in terms of building the block to hold up to 600hp. You can open a later series 20b (C and up) and dowel the engine, then put it back together with all "factory stock" parts and new factory apex seals and the block will be more than strong enough to be reliable at that power level. For those that don't understand what doweling is, it's nothing more than enlarging he tension bolt passages to insert extra "STOCK Factory" dowel pins which keeps the block from twisting. You will never get the LS1 to be reliable at 600 hp with "factory stock internals" like a 20b. The LS1 would need to be completely overhauled with "aftermarket" parts.

 

/\/\/\/\ thats an interesting fact about the 20b.


Hey ErnieT, have you raced any big power Vettes or Camaros? I know there are a lot of 550+hp Vettes running around the states, I wondered how your car fares against them as they have a pretty nice rear end for good launches from a dig.

 

ErnieT and TVon- I wish you guys were in NorCal... it would be fun to have a weekend of racing (drag/road racing) to see which car and powerplant would be the king.

I have a buddy who bought a 20B 600rwhp FD and it has never run right.... plus has been rebuilt 2x already and his Haltech took a dump... twice. It actually blew up on the drive home from Canada to NorCal. It does sound like a Ferrari... and certainly comes with all the headaches (probably more) that a Ferrari has in the reliability department. He can't road race it because it will overheat.... he can't drag race it because of ignition problems.

The fastest LS1 powered drag car ran high 6's@205mph. Probably very close to the uber lightweight rotary powered Puerto Rico cars: http://www.w2wpowertrain.com/t-Casper-2.aspx

There are plenty of stock LS1 block/cranks with forged rods/pistons and ported factory heads/intakes making 1000rwhp. It is true the stock pistons beyond 600rwhp are on borrowed time.

There is an LS7/FD being built in TX. Should be running by the end of 2006. Drewman/Andrew is building it. JimLab in WA is doing one also but who knows when that may be done.

I'm building one also with 550-600rwhp n/a on 91 octane and 7500rpm redline and hopefully done by SevenStock. I imagine it will run 145mph n/a and 160mph with a 150hp nitrous shot. The FD is sitting with a blown 13B waiting to go under the knife.

The only weight gain from my current 346ci LS1 going to a 427 LS7 will be the oil tank (reservoir). I'm moving the battery back to the bins and imagine it will maintain its current 2800lb (wet) and 49.5% front/50.5% rear weight balance and cross weights within 1lb of each other. Should run easy mid 10's with road race suspension and 9's on the bottle. Daily driver 20mpg+ highway.

I would love to race a 20B if there were more than only a handful in the country that actually aren't in project mode... or being rebuilt.

 

What is the price comparison of the 20b and the LS1 conversions (complete)? Are these two options smog legal in California? Can you a twin/single turbo or supercharger (LS1) to each and what would reliabilty be for both if that were done, also if so, what additional costs would that be?
After owning my Fd for about 6 yrs I have been through a ton of maintenance costs not counting trouble with smog. So I'm seriously considering one of the two options.

 

Have you run one in an FD yet?

Our little "date" is coming better get that new motor with all its new tricks ready and up that boost another 10 psi..........The again I could stay all motor and give you a shot

 

I suppose so considering you've got a full blown race car!

 

That's funny, considering how many more years and millions of dollars of R&D the piston engine has over the rotary. It's not like Chevy rewrote the piston engine from scratch with the LS1. And with it being newer, you'd expect that new technology to be a big advantage. I mean, new rotaries these days have side exhaust ports, for instance.

The LS1 is a good option, but most people don't realize how ridiculous even 400whp can be on the street. Personally, I'd build a nice N/A 20B, and throw a 50-shot on top for when I want to take it to the track. 350+whp and 87 octane with that awesome 20B sound makes it really hard for me to consider dropping in an LS1.

If I wanted a turbo setup, I'd build a 4g64.

 

???? What is the difference between your car on full boost and mine?

In fact I would say YOURS is more of a full blown race car..

You have to use a higher octane fuel C12 for me C16 for you.

You have a full race tranny I have a tranny from millions and millions of 1960's GM's.

You have a roll cage with more mounting points than me.

Only difference I have in my favor is I dont have the FACTORY carpet.

My power windows work, power brakes work, I have mufflers, I have a stock driveshaft, I run on Drag radials...I could go on and on

 

I suppose we'll agree to disagree.......BTW, I have the stock transmission.

 

Stock transmission??

I didnt realize straight cut gears were "stock".

Didnt realize "stock" transmissions were $4100 either.

 

I can't get that tranny, so I had to get the $6500 one...he he...,but it looks stock!

 

Holy crap man that is almost as much as my motor!!!

 

I agree with Rarson that the 20B is a better choice simply because it sounds better.

The twin turbo diesel Audi race car that won Sebring this year is a bad choice because it was the quietest car there and one of the most fuel efficient setups..... with 800+ ft/lbs torque.....

Different strokes for different folks. Both engines are great... and both have their +'s and -'s....

I would love to drive a 12-14K RPM rotary that made 500hp+. I think that would be pretty insane.

 

Yea, I know...but I really wanted to stick to the street class and "hopefully" be some competition to the Supra's. I actually am considering the Z06 engine next year instead of the 20B. Figured a drop in 500hp motor isn't so bad...lol..

 

Holy **** is it snowing in Abington?

The man that quotes the phrase "MULLET ENGINE" on a daily basis is considering a LSX swap?

Say it aint so Ernie, that will only leave Bobby for me to talk **** to!!

BTW have you heard or talked to Bobby lately? How is his car going? He hasnt been on the boards in a long time

 

^^An LS7 is EXTREMELY expensive right now. I would do a built 402 before I would consider a stock LS7.

 

Ha ha....Bobby has been busy with school. I believe he stayed there over the summer. His car is sitting.

 

LOL!