This was from an argument I was having on the Bimmerforums while I was looking up information on my wife's old 325i. Thought some of you guys might enjoy it.


I'd agree from a performance standpoint that the RX7 is the best of the bunch. I disagree with the tall order part.

A stock 2nd generation Turbo RX7 runs 202 hp at the crank with a curb weight of 2800 lbs. That's about 13.8 in power to weight ratio. With a SAFC II ($300), new exhaust ($500), and a bigger fuel pump (~$200), it gets about 220 to the wheels. If we PRETEND we're only getting a 10% drivetrain loss, which would be incredible, then that's going to be 242hp at the crank, which would bring our Power to Weight Ratio down to . . . 11.47 lbs per hp. If we use a more realistic number like 15% for our drivetrain loss, we end up with a HP number of 253 at the flywheel, which ends up being a power to weight ratio of 11.06.

Now let's look at a 2005 BMW M3 coupe. Curb weight is 3781, and 333 hp at the crank. That'd make a power to weight ratio of something like 11.35?

Plus, final drive ratio of the stock RX-7 torsen differential is 4.1, while the BMW M3 coupe gets a grand old 3.64. That must be great on the highway!

Wanna talk about price next? Kelly Blue Book lists the 2005 M3 for $50,965 in excellent condition. Well, depending on options. Don't worry, we'll go with the newest 2nd gen Rx7, just to keep it close. Well, closer. I'll even add in ALL the options. Hmm, $7,400 in Excellent condition. Bump it up that extra $1,000 for the parts makes it $8,400.

Geez, I'm sorry, looks like you were right all along. According to the old calculator it would take 6.06 of my car, in excellent condition to equal a BMW. At least on the cash basis.

Richter12x2

 

thats great LMFAO!

 

Performance to money wise the rx7 wins, but in the end the BMW is still a newer, better car.

If you built a pinto up to outdrag a Ferrari, is the pinto a better car? Didnt think so.

btw, wtf is this doing in the 2nd gen section?

 

because it is 2nd gen comparison... lol

 

"better" is really a relative term.

 

yea It depends on what your after

it actually is better performance whise but luxury obviously not

and obviously they were talking about performance which was stupid on there part

but besides that even NEW the rx7 was half? the price of the beamers in those days

and was twice as good perfomance whise and i'd probobly say just as good luxury whise

 

I don't know, for the other $42,000 you could put whatever luxury you want in there. A nice set of brides and a completely fabricated custom interior, a totally rebuilt motor using all new parts, chassis reconditioning, replace all bearings and bushings and a complete suspension overhaul would still be less than $10,000 if you shopped around.

 

By that logic, why do people buy new or high end cars at all?

 

So uh..someone has 60k to spend on a new car. About 99.9% of the people who can do that, have no ability to build a car as described. And its a hassle.


But for 50k+, you could have a 26B, super nice interior, super nice exterior, suspension, etc...pull 800rwhp easily, be lighter, more comfortable...:-D

 

Because people like things that are new and shiny. They have something you don't. I mean, you *NEVER* see any BMW's on the road. (Look there's one now... and another...)

New cars also don't have as many "perks" as our old FC's do. Try explaining adding 2-stroke oil to your gas or revving to 3000 and WOT before shutting off the ignition to someone who isn't a car person.

 

Short of technological innovations, I don't see any reason for it. Honestly, if you do the work yourself little by little, you can almost always fix up an older car cheaper than you can buy a new one. If you like an older car better, don't let it stop you because it's old. It can be fixed. I drive a 2nd Gen Rx7 because I honestly, truly, like the look of that car better than anything I've seen lately. There are new cars that I like, but nothing that really screams better to me (I know it's blasphemy, but that includes the FD). I'd love to have a Lamborghini, or a Lotus, or a 350Z. But if I were given the choice between any of those cars and having my RX7 fully restored to original working order, with the interior updated and a 3 year warranty, I'd take my RX7 again any day. Well no, I'm not stupid I'd take the Lamborghini, sell it, and buy an RX7.

 

for $42,000 i could build the Ferrari of rotaries.

 

Exactly! Besides, a Ferrari is just another car! Want Ferrari seats? Ferrari seats are made by Recaro! There's no reason you can't have a Ferrari class interior in an RX7. You just have to be willing to put the time and money into it.

 

BMW = *****...period

See maybe if we were talking about an fd...maybe. BUt we're not

 

there's a thing with bmws that automatically makes their drivers huge ******** on the road who cut people off all over the place.

 

that is true and what comes around goes around, what was the power to weight ratio on a modded TII again?

 

And a lightly modded T2 at that.

1991 Mazda RX7 Turbo II in excellent condition = $7400
performance exhaust = $500
SAFC II = $300
high flow fuel pump = $200
The look on the face of the poor SOB who just spent $64,000 on a brand new BMW when a 15 year old car blows his doors off = priceless

 

Come on now.. Stop generalizing and stereotyping.

The same type of statements can be made of Rotary (rx7 owners)

BMW = ***** ??? well
you are what you eat. Or do you mean gets you *****?? stop hating..

 

People don't buy BMW"s to drag race or to be dyno queens.
When you have a Wife and Kids...
Do you want them in a 15yo car, wondering if they make it to point B or not?
Hoping it don't strand them in the middle of no where, But only cost 8K??
Or a a brand new car with a warranty?? with leather, navigation and yada yada
yada.

 

interesting discussion - im fortunate to own both a 94 rx7 and a 2002 m3. both are stock and both are awsome cars. in fact, i was going to sell the rx when i picked up the m3, but i really don't want to get rid of it.

you can compare horsepower, HP to weight ratio, cost, whatever, but the two cars are really meant for different things. they feel totally different to drive (not a big suprise) and both are equally satisfying to rip around in. haven't taken either to the track yet, but that is a matter of time.....

 

Do you want your wife and kids riding around in your car while you drive fast and carve corners? I have a car to go fast in, and a reliable car to haul groceries in. I rarely ever drive my groceries 0-60 in 6 though. That's why I have an '03 Neon SXT to haul the wife and (maybe someday) kids around in. Oh wait, I only paid 8 grand for that one, too. So now I've got a car that's got more back seat legroom than an M3, and another car that will stomp it on a road course, drag strip, or skidpad. And I've still got $36,000 to go. Anyone knows you can't fit kids in the back of an RX7 anyway. Well, maybe babies... in the luggage compartments.

The real question for most people is, would you rather lease a BMW so you can show off to your friends and the people you work with? Or would you rather have a true sports car, AND a decent late model sedan, AND spend 2 weeks a year in the Bahamas with what you saved. You can keep your high-priced German status symbol, thank you, I'll settle for having two nice cars, and a lot more extra money lying around.

Besides, if you can replace every part in an RX7 with new parts from Mazda for less than a BMW, and it would be just as reliable. You're just mad because I said I like FC's better than FD's.

 

I don't have anything against BMWs, truthfully, I think they're great cars. What I have a problem with is people telling me that an RX7 is a POS because they drive a BMW. Spending more on your car doesn't mean it's better.

Like you said, they have different uses. RX7s are for going fast around corners in. BMWs are for taking Brad and Trevor to lunch at La Rigoletto.

 

Trubo FCs > BMWs

 

haha, some guy with a powersliding S15 240sx in his signature picture jumped in the thread and said the FC was a POS. I told him I thought it was nice when Nissan finally started putting real engines in their cars so that all the 240sx drivers didn't have to import an SR20DET just to keep up with our POS fc's, but I didn't blame him for being upset. After spending all that money what he thought was a sports car for it to only come with 155 hp, a little more than a 2nd gen Miata, I'd be bitter too. I closed it by telling him I'd done better powerslides than the one in his signature by grabbing the e-brake in my Neon.