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where do you go to learn that?!

Old 09-28-05, 09:09 AM
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where do you go to learn that?!

"
If the roll center for the front or rear wheel pair – understood in the usual way, as the intersection of the front view force lines – is below ground level and between the wheels, that implies geometric pro-roll on both wheels. The outside wheel’s linkage generates a downward jacking force in that wheel’s suspension, and the inside wheel’s linkage generates an upward jacking force. The resulting couple acts to roll the sprung mass outward, exaggerating roll. Considered in isolation, this does add load to the inside wheels, and remove load from the outside wheels." as from a sticky link in the suspention fourm..

that is just amazing i took some minor mechanical/civil engineering classes for X number of years and (i understand just about everything hes saying) we havent been able to touch base on this kind of thing specifically and it feels like we never will......(i keep getting stuck with bridges and forces moments and calculating work and such....) this guy is freaking inteligent..what degree do you need to be able to get that kind of knowledge cuz i know my local community colledges suspention systems class isnt going to nor sumthing like getting ASE certified is going to either...sounds like advanced vehicle dynamics...where would be the best place to learn this kinda stuff...so i can apply it to real life racing...i would think mechanical engineering and such...

"
Actually, it is theoretically possible to get inward load transfer, with a c.g. above ground level, at one end of the car only. I doubt that there is any real-world situation where we’d want such a setup, but it is an interesting hypothetical curiosity. If we used geometric pro-roll, combined with a wheel rate in roll of zero or nearly zero, at one end of the car only, we could achieve inward load transfer at that “soft” end. To get sufficient ride stiffness, we’d have to use a springing system that acted only in ride, such as the Z-bar at the rear of a Formula Vee or the third spring on a modern high-downforce car."

jsut the wording alone is just phenominal..reading this gets my giddy...racing is just amazing thought id just say that...too bad im stuck getting my Solo II car up..id love to just go and learn all this.....


(all quotes taken from this link: http://www.auto-ware.com/ubbthreads/...n=0&page=0#602)

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Old 09-28-05, 10:26 AM
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One place to start is to get the book "Race Car Vehicle Dynamics" by Milliken and Milliken. It is a very technical book that will give you a head start in understanding vehicle dynamics. It is a bit dated in some of the approaches taken. However, as a whole it is really the best single source on the subject that I have seen.

Vehicle dynamics is in my opinion the epitome of mechanical engineering currently. There aren't many systems that have so many variables that need to be resolved on an ongoing bassis as the the system is being used. It isn't easy to make a car go around one corner well let alone any and every corner.
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Old 09-28-05, 10:31 AM
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I'm glad to see at least one person actually reads through the sticky Mark Ortiz is very bright but even better also an excellent teacher. Everyone should read at least the Physics of Racing and then read Mark's stuff.

The Millikens' book is excellent but you have to walk before you can run. It's a text book type book and unless you are familier with many of the concepts you'll find it pretty overwhelming and useless.
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Old 09-28-05, 10:55 AM
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i have been grilled vigorously in the teachings of calculating work, moments of inertia, changes of forces in motion and such so its not totally as complex as it could be...but i belive i want to engineer race cars...and i will go and get these books asap...thank you soo much because for that sticky i have found what i truly want to do with this degree.....

im just going to get this mechanical engineering degree...get ASE certified...and hopefully continue at my local SCCA with my team/crew/friends....do our best and work our way up to pro hopefully build a timetrials FD and compete next year at redline if its around....sumthing like taht....

anyone know any perticualarly good schools taht have automotive engineering...
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Old 09-28-05, 11:07 AM
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Originally Posted by --MAstermind--
i have been grilled vigorously in the teachings of calculating work, moments of inertia, changes of forces in motion and such so its not totally as complex as it could be
You'll understand anything those books have to say. I find myself all the time reading along and saying "well of course it's that way!" but without some prompting I wouldn't have come to that conclusion so quickly. It's like watching somebody do something and thinking it ain't so bad but then when you try and do it yourself it takes 10 times longer.
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Old 09-28-05, 02:46 PM
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yea its just kinda an accomplishing feeling once u understand all that because to the average person 80-90% of that lingo and terminology and mathematics means jibberish and it feels good to know and understand those theories and formulas.....thanks ALOT for those stickies..again i honestly think its made a change in my life.....
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