arghx

iTrader: (3)

The PFC needs a proper 0-5v signal on both the narrow and full range wires to work correctly. So hook the TPS up the way the PFC expects and don't even bother starting the car until the voltages are in spec. The car will NEVER run right unless the sensors are configured properly and the PFC is actually seeing that correct voltage. I may not have made it clear in my other thread, but the PFC still needs to see a full range TPS voltage--whether it comes from a correctly calibrated full range sensor or from a correctly calibrated narrow range sensor on the series 4 cars. The TPS is used to calculate extra fuel for quick movement of the throttle plates, as well as operation of the OMP in s5 and s6 cars. I'm betting that this is not your only problem keeping the car from running, but it needs to be taken care of before you go to a tuner or make any other adjustments. Since you have an FD TPS, wire it and calibrate it according to spec. If it won't reach the specific voltages, then your TPS is bad or you are not adjusting it in the correct manner.

So get back to us when your voltages are 0.1-0.7 on VTA1 and 0.75-1.25 on VTA2 with the throttle closed (on the commander sensor check screen), although that spec is technically with the car warmed up if you still have your fast idle cam. Personally I would set it to VTA1 .7 volts and VTA2 1.0 volts for now, then possibly readjust later when you can get the car to idle and warm up fully. And sorry about getting laid off man, times are rough everywhere.

JWteknix

iTrader: (2)

ok dispite me being a ******* idiot. i got the tps where it should be and the butterflys to fully close but every time I turn the throttle screw I have to readjust my tps. now the car will sort of idle/ run by itself. A few more adjustments i should have it running relativly well. i have to go over my alt wiring it seems like now the battery is dying causing the car to dye out seems like the alt isnt charging the battey maybe i wired it wrong ill figure it out then ill post up some more logs and see what you guys have to say. agrhx thanx for all your help
James

cewrx7r1

iTrader: (2)

He is a subscriber to my tuning notes/group. Unfortunately I do not have direct FC experience. But if I was to work on one, I know I could figure how to make it work.

JWteknix

iTrader: (2)

so whats good? im more then willing to compensate you for your services. how do i become a subscriber for this group?

JWteknix

iTrader: (2)

ok guys i got the car running a little better but still wont stay running it just cuts out after like 10 seconds still. I came to the conclusion that the battery is not causing the car to shut off . i have a log what do you guys think?
thanks
James

arghx

iTrader: (3)

Alternator voltages look better, but the TPS wiring is still screwed up. It's still pegged around 5 volts, and you've gotta take care of that man. There's no way around it. You will have to run a wire from your TPS into the car to your PFC adapter and make sure everything is hooked up properly. Does the car stay alive if you keep your foot on the gas enough? Then if you let off the throttle the car sputters and dies? That would be indicative of a tuning problem possibly (spark or fuel map). You really need to get a wideband on the car too.

Go into Settings 4 and change IGN vs WaterT cool to 0 for both "retard" boxes. You could also go into the settings 2 water temp correction table and just start increasing the numbers in the +10 and +30C rows, but without a wideband you really have no idea what exactly the engine is doing so it may just run worse. But if I could take a wild guess, it's too lean, based only on my own experiences, so it may help. If it doesn't appear to do anything, just put it back. You are only guessing now without a wideband.

Also, go into the "monitor" window and check all the boxes in the lower right corner, that will put some more information into your datalogs.

cewrx7r1

iTrader: (2)

I see the same thing, maxed out tps voltage at idle. That value should be only for full throttle. That confuses the ECU.

JWteknix

iTrader: (2)

ok tomorrow ill run the full range wire but i need to get a new 3rd gen tps connector unless i can find the same type of pin in my spare harnesses bc i cut the full range wire off at the connector for when i had the rtek in the car. ill try to go to settings 4 and set the watertemp to 0 retard other then that i dont dont wana **** with anything untill i get my wide band and i really need to get my exhaust work done my neigbors are loving the open DP lol
james

JWteknix

iTrader: (2)

ok so I hooked up the full range TPS. WOT for VTA1 is 4.44v VTA2 is 4.98v at closed throttle i get VTA1 to .7 but VTA2 is at 1.4 is the any adjustment for bringing them closer together? i also redid my throttle body as per cews notes. now i didnt get any loggs today, i will tomorrow, but the car starts right up and idles fine at 1k unassisted for the 10 seconds and shuts off. i also with in that 10seconds can very rpm accordingly to the throttle then it will die no matter the rpm at like the 10 sec mark. idk what to think until i hook up the wideband and see what the a/f ratios look like. what you guys think?
james

cewrx7r1

iTrader: (2)

(1) WOT for VTA1 is 4.44v VTA2 is 4.98v at closed throttle i get VTA1 to .7 but VTA2 is at 1.4 is the any adjustment for bringing them closer together?
(a1) You can't get them closer, but they are still high by about .2 volt.

(2) i also redid my throttle body as per cews notes. now i didnt get any loggs today, i will tomorrow, but the car starts right up and idles fine at 1k unassisted for the 10 seconds and shuts off. i also with in that 10seconds can very rpm accordingly to the throttle then it will die no matter the rpm at like the 10 sec mark. idk what to think until i hook up the wideband and see what the a/f ratios look like. what you guys think?
(a2) you are seeing the results of the cold idle system being out of tune. But the engine has to be hot idle tuned as your base point before doing cold idle tuning.
Most likely you are running too lean or other idle parms are not set up.

Post a list of all engine mods/changes needed for you PFC conversion.
The FD also has an air pump that forces air into the exhaust manifold which affect the O2 readings since this happens before the O2 sensor. Do you have something like this ot not? Load your most recent map again.

JWteknix

iTrader: (2)

For VTAs I miss read the specs, I should not have a problem bringing them down.

Well, to adapt the PFC it wasnt really any thing special. I adapted PFC throught the banzai adaptor. i hooked up the extra wires as per their instruction kmph-mph, and a trigger from the ecu. I had the fd uim on prior to redoing the car so it was easy to use the fd ait sensor. I am also using the gm 3bar map sensor using an adaptor from banzai to the stock boost sensor wiring. I also had to mod my stock trailing coils to add another ignitor so they can fire properly w/ the PFC.

My engine is simplified no emissions, a/c, p/s, or air pump. I am also not running a stock O2, I just have my bosh wideband O2 sensor in the bung. I need my friend Kevin to lend me his LM1 moniter until I get my own. I'll load my map in a couple minutes its on my other comp. Do you need any other information? The only changes I made to the original map Banzai sent me, were the PIM values as per arghx.
Thank you.
James

arghx

iTrader: (3)

Try this map, it is a modified version of what I run on my 88 T2 with 720/1680. Load it up and see if it helps any, then post a log. At this point though unless you can figure out a mechanical problem that you missed, it's going to come down to tuning of air, fuel, and spark. You will have to start playing with the screws on the TB like Chuck's notes mentions for example, and then you can use your commander's diagnostic mode (INJ/IGN L/IGN T screen under settings) to start testing different fuel and air settings. But that can't be easily done unless you have your wideband hooked up and preferably hooked into the datalogit.

The other thing you still need to do is be 100% sure you have no vacuum leaks. I pressurize my intake manifold using a pressure tester like the one at www.boostpro.net/prodtester.html , which can be made out of home depot parts. I've even seen pics of people custom fabbing testers that fit onto their LIM with the UIM removed. But given your vacuum readings, this may not be a problem--but I can't tell when you have your foot on the throttle (which can create more vacuum) or not because all the logs you've posted are with the TPS still messed up.

JWteknix

iTrader: (2)

Ok ill give that map a try later today.
I dont think at this point it has any thing to do w/ the TB or tps. I have already redid the TB as per chucks notes. The car will idle fine by itself before it dies out. I also don't believe to have any vacume leaks. i recently replaced ALL vacume lines and zip tied every single one. ALL intake gaskets are new.
I'm starting to lean towards what Chuck said about the cold idle system being out of tune.
Before I put your map in Ill take a couple logs with my map for you, now that I have the full range tps hooked up.
Thank you.
James

JWteknix

iTrader: (2)

arghx that map you sent me the inj map is blank it shows 1.000 for all values is that correct?

JWteknix

iTrader: (2)

ok so I just altered my setting 4, IGN. vs water temp to 0 retard @ 60 degrees.
Also went to setting 2, IGN vs. fueltemp 60 degrees to 1.000
this is my map right now. ill go see if the car stays running or changes behavior w/ these changed in a little bit.

JWteknix

iTrader: (2)

map im gonna try out

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

the inj map is going to be all 1.00 when you do the recalc base map.

The base map is the one that does the primary adjustments of fuel. When you change the inj map it just allows you to see how much you increase or decrease the fuel more easily then once you have it how you like you hit recalc base map to see the changes in the base map. At that point INJ is all 1.00's.

The exception to this is if you are running the stock air pump and need o2 sensor feedback on. Then you need the INJ map left alone and do not want to use recalc base map.

given your current setup i highly doubt you are running o2 sensor feedback, if you are you should probably turn it off. hope this makes sense.

JWteknix

iTrader: (2)

ok i dont have an air pump or stock O2 so, lets see if I get this, the INJ map just shows the adjustments to the base map? and its basically saying that i didnt make any adjustments to his base map yet right? if thats right it should be fine too load his map right? still didnt get a chance to even load my map its pouring outside and dont have electricty in the garage so i dont feel like running extenstion cords ill load and log when it stops raining.
james

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

Yes that is correct.

And you can also make adjustments to the base map without ever even using the INJ map.

The INJ map would just allow you to see where and how much of an adjustment you made to the base map. So if as an example if you make a change to N5 P5 in the INJ map you can see how that effects your afr's before doing the recalc. to the base map.

Or if you use excel to automatically adjust INJ based on your current and desired AFR's. the INJ map makes this handy.

JWteknix

iTrader: (2)

So, this is where im at. I put my map in w/ the altered water temp settings car started and died like before but seemed to run better. I put in agrhx's map and the car seemed to run worse and still shut off on me like every other time. I have the more advanced logs for both, but they are too large to post here.

soo i posted them on my other forum here you go.
http://www.nopistons.com/forums/inde...howtopic=72634

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

It almost seems like the fuel rails pressurize and then run out of fuel maybe? Can you check your fuel pressure to make sure the pump is still running and maintaining fuel pressure after the car is started

JWteknix

iTrader: (2)

ok will check in a little bit i have a fuel pressure gauge on my regulator im pretty sure its getting fuel

arghx

iTrader: (3)

I think you've hit a roadblock until you get a wideband installed. Every engine is different, and I'm not surprised that either my map or the other map you had didn't work.

JWteknix

iTrader: (2)

ok, I had someone moniter my fuel pressure while I started the car and it isnt getting pressure after the car is started its just starting and running off the fuel from cranking so the pressure goes up then gradually falls till the car dies. im gonna go over my wiring maybe my relay is bad. Ill be back thanx
James

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

Well then this problem should be easy to fix now. If nothing else just run a hot wire to the fuel pump with a switch. I'm sure your happy to finally have a problem you can deal with.