Your going to hate me; but 9000rpm?!
11-14-06, 08:22 PM
#76
Originally Posted by boostedHULK
I do agree, comparing systems so far apart isn't fair. The fact that they have different injector sizes means exactly SQUAT about efficiency, or inefficiiency. Factory turbo DSM's run 440's stock. You are comparing engines that don't even use the same principles for strokes, intake/exhaust methods, or even lubrication (since we were naming awesome features). The rotary is extremely efficient, and maybe the reason it uses bigger injectors is to supply enough fuel for the added air it's capable of flowing because of it's design. And it lacks so many flaws of a piston engine: valvetrain, more rotational friction internally, or a cylinder head to hinder flow. Although, for modifying and tuning this can left a little something to be desired, less variations of engine builds i would say, and less ability for "anyone" to be an engine builder. You can't throw parts at a rotary engine in the same way...alright, i'm done.
HULK
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11-15-06, 10:52 PM
#77
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Originally Posted by boostedHULK
I do agree, comparing systems so far apart isn't fair. The fact that they have different injector sizes means exactly SQUAT about efficiency, or inefficiiency. Factory turbo DSM's run 440's stock.
Originally Posted by boostedHULK
And it lacks so many flaws of a piston engine: valvetrain, more rotational friction internally, or a cylinder head to hinder flow.
11-21-06, 12:38 PM
#79
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Originally Posted by boostedHULK
I do agree, comparing systems so far apart isn't fair. The fact that they have different injector sizes means exactly SQUAT about efficiency, or inefficiiency. Factory turbo DSM's run 440's stock. You are comparing engines that don't even use the same principles for strokes, intake/exhaust methods, or even lubrication (since we were naming awesome features). The rotary is extremely efficient, and maybe the reason it uses bigger injectors is to supply enough fuel for the added air it's capable of flowing because of it's design. And it lacks so many flaws of a piston engine: valvetrain, more rotational friction internally, or a cylinder head to hinder flow. Although, for modifying and tuning this can left a little something to be desired, less variations of engine builds i would say, and less ability for "anyone" to be an engine builder. You can't throw parts at a rotary engine in the same way...alright, i'm done.
HULK
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09-24-07, 04:14 PM
#81
I'm bastardizing my car!
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Ok, its been a long time but I think i should make an update about this project. I'm sure a lot of you that know of this project might have though that this has been scrapped... Well, you would be wrong!
This summer I made some huge progress toward completing the car. I made a new custom dashboard, had a custom drive shaft made, and sorted out all of the wiring. I actually drove the car!
There has actually been very few problems with getting everything running. Its just been a lot of little things. For instance, we (my bro and i) pretty much rewired the car. You start the car with the normal rx-7 key. we actually incorporated the s2000 harness into the rx-7 wiring.
All thats really left for this swap is to weld up the firewall and finish installing the dash. I also need to get the power steering working. Although its not really needed, i race really tight autox's and theres no way im going to be able to do them without power steering.
I'm building a small space frame out of .035" tubing over the firewall hole. I will then weld the sheet metal over this to seal off the area. When its finished, it should be stronger then stock.
The hardest part I have had so far is to get replacement parts for the ones I lost when I hit the deer!
This summer I made some huge progress toward completing the car. I made a new custom dashboard, had a custom drive shaft made, and sorted out all of the wiring. I actually drove the car!
There has actually been very few problems with getting everything running. Its just been a lot of little things. For instance, we (my bro and i) pretty much rewired the car. You start the car with the normal rx-7 key. we actually incorporated the s2000 harness into the rx-7 wiring.
All thats really left for this swap is to weld up the firewall and finish installing the dash. I also need to get the power steering working. Although its not really needed, i race really tight autox's and theres no way im going to be able to do them without power steering.
I'm building a small space frame out of .035" tubing over the firewall hole. I will then weld the sheet metal over this to seal off the area. When its finished, it should be stronger then stock.
The hardest part I have had so far is to get replacement parts for the ones I lost when I hit the deer!
09-24-07, 05:45 PM
#82
Living the Dream
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haha i cant help but laff. i read this whole thread and most of the people that have posted hate the swap and add some smartass post. really, why in the hell do you car what he does with his rx7?? it kills me when i read stupid posts like "hoooomoooo".
hey man, for what its worth... if anything? cool build. i like people that take a risk and build something diff!!! much props! id like to see more pics please
hey man, for what its worth... if anything? cool build. i like people that take a risk and build something diff!!! much props! id like to see more pics please
09-24-07, 08:34 PM
#83
I'm bastardizing my car!
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I'm currently taking the engine back out right now so it can be welded. I'll get some pic's of the welding when that starts coming along. I actually put the first tube in, but it was really hard to do since i don't have a good position on it, and its really hard to operate the foot pedal while sitting half-way in the car...
It is pretty funny how people get so upset about this. These cars are not exactly museum pieces. I can understand why people would get upset if this was a low production car that was highly sought after, but that just isn't the case. Even though my car has relatively low miles, its body is really dinged up from city use (previous owner) and the entire passenger side was terribly repainted (previous owner). This car had 160hp (probably more like 140 with the new SAE hp test) and took, what? 16 seconds to get down the quarter mile? The good thing about this car is that its chassis is in great shape, perfect for a race car!
If i did a turbo swap, im sure i would still be looking for parts which are increasingly hard to find, and they would all be in questionable condition. Instead, I got a whole bunch of new stuff that works just fine... and wow, you should feel this trans! The old rx-7 trans has nothing on this one. beh! iv said all this stuff before.
I still need a hood, front turn signals and ftp lenses. I cant find those anywhere around here! It would cost a mint to get a hood shipped. It would be nice to get a CF or even a fiberglass one, but the FG ones i found cost even more then the CF hood! BTW, pretty much all of those CF hoods really are mostly FG. Its just 1 layer of cf backed with chopped strand FG, the worst possible kind of FG....
It is pretty funny how people get so upset about this. These cars are not exactly museum pieces. I can understand why people would get upset if this was a low production car that was highly sought after, but that just isn't the case. Even though my car has relatively low miles, its body is really dinged up from city use (previous owner) and the entire passenger side was terribly repainted (previous owner). This car had 160hp (probably more like 140 with the new SAE hp test) and took, what? 16 seconds to get down the quarter mile? The good thing about this car is that its chassis is in great shape, perfect for a race car!
If i did a turbo swap, im sure i would still be looking for parts which are increasingly hard to find, and they would all be in questionable condition. Instead, I got a whole bunch of new stuff that works just fine... and wow, you should feel this trans! The old rx-7 trans has nothing on this one. beh! iv said all this stuff before.
I still need a hood, front turn signals and ftp lenses. I cant find those anywhere around here! It would cost a mint to get a hood shipped. It would be nice to get a CF or even a fiberglass one, but the FG ones i found cost even more then the CF hood! BTW, pretty much all of those CF hoods really are mostly FG. Its just 1 layer of cf backed with chopped strand FG, the worst possible kind of FG....
09-24-07, 09:37 PM
#84
This should probably be added:
But I am wondering if this includes the transmission because that could make quite a bit of difference. Are you sure the Honda engine is lighter?
Interestingly enough the Renesis engine weighs only 276 pounds, which is 100 pounds lighter than the S4 N/A engine!
But I am wondering if this includes the transmission because that could make quite a bit of difference. Are you sure the Honda engine is lighter?
Interestingly enough the Renesis engine weighs only 276 pounds, which is 100 pounds lighter than the S4 N/A engine!
Anyway, IMO this is the right kind of engine swap to do. It's not just powerful, it's light, low, and far back. s2k engine >> V8. Give the old engine a good home and I don't think there's any way I could hate you.
09-25-07, 05:53 PM
#85
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Car and Driver said the S2000 trans was the best manual transmission ever put in a production built sports car. It is AMAZING...too bad you couldnt get the S2000 steering rack and geometry as well. Those two qualities are what I admire most about it...oh yeah...and the banshee scream of an uncorked VTEC engine at 9000rpm. I had an S2000 for couple of weeks a few months ago and it saddened me to let it go back...
Props to you for doing this. I bet it turns out sweet.
I started my sportscar life with an Acura Integra Type R...no car I have ever had since, including my FD, gave the satisfaction of that car at redline...I WILL own one again!
10-14-07, 11:26 PM
#87
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Just a quick update:
I have the engine out again and am finishing the welding. Everything is being TIG welded by me. I am building a small tubular cage over the firewall hole of out .75" OD .035" wall tubing. Some of the angles on these tubes takes some time to weld in. But it will be worth it when its done. After the tubes are in, I will weld in sheet metal to actually close the hole and to further reinforce the area. I will get a pic of this mini-cage after its done, right now, theres not much to see. After welding is complete, I will paint the area to prevent rust.
I have the engine out again and am finishing the welding. Everything is being TIG welded by me. I am building a small tubular cage over the firewall hole of out .75" OD .035" wall tubing. Some of the angles on these tubes takes some time to weld in. But it will be worth it when its done. After the tubes are in, I will weld in sheet metal to actually close the hole and to further reinforce the area. I will get a pic of this mini-cage after its done, right now, theres not much to see. After welding is complete, I will paint the area to prevent rust.
10-20-07, 06:05 PM
#89
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Heres some pics of the tubes to reinforce the firewall area. I also threw in a pic of the engine for good measure.
I figured it would be best to put these tubes in to add a little extra strength. When the sheet metal closes off the area, it should be really strong. I think I might be able to incorporate this into a really fancy strut tower brace as well.
I figured it would be best to put these tubes in to add a little extra strength. When the sheet metal closes off the area, it should be really strong. I think I might be able to incorporate this into a really fancy strut tower brace as well.
10-21-07, 08:08 PM
#92
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Holy **** that's a massive firewall modification! I may have missed the part where it was necessary to move the engine back that far. Steering rack issues? Seems like every engine swap (other than the LSx ones) have them.
10-21-07, 10:10 PM
#94
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The old cost on page 2 is about right. Plus about $60-70 bucks to get a section of exhaust pipe with a doughnut flange and gasket to connect to the s2000 header. Right now, I actually have it set up to use the stock rx-7 y-pipe (yes, thats lame as hell, i know!) so i cut up my old mid-pipe (which was a 'test' pipe) and welded it back together to use the oem Y-pipe. I would like to get a new y-pipe since I think the one i have now is the factory original. Its in pretty bad shape. A good thing about the exhaust is that the s2000 uses the same diameter exhaust as the 7!
There was another cost in getting the tubes for the firewall hole. I got those tubes from a industrial supply warehouse called McMaster carr. It cost around $20 bucks after tax. McMaster is not a good supplier for things like this, it seems a little expensive, but i only needed one 6' long tube!
Theres other hidden costs, like all the tools im using. It would be hard to do this without a good welder, engine hoist, bench grinder and all the other various hand tools im using.
theres still some unknowns. I dont know if I will need to upgrade the rx-7 fuel pump. So far, the car ran fine on the rx-7 pump. I havent taken the engine though its paces yet. I do have an s2000 pump, but i know know if i can adapt that.
There was another cost in getting the tubes for the firewall hole. I got those tubes from a industrial supply warehouse called McMaster carr. It cost around $20 bucks after tax. McMaster is not a good supplier for things like this, it seems a little expensive, but i only needed one 6' long tube!
Theres other hidden costs, like all the tools im using. It would be hard to do this without a good welder, engine hoist, bench grinder and all the other various hand tools im using.
theres still some unknowns. I dont know if I will need to upgrade the rx-7 fuel pump. So far, the car ran fine on the rx-7 pump. I havent taken the engine though its paces yet. I do have an s2000 pump, but i know know if i can adapt that.
10-22-07, 05:37 PM
#95
FC Racer
Nice looking build! Don't mind all these rotor heads, I love rotaries, and RX7's, but I too am looking to build a track car, and if I had the time and money, would totally go a similar route to you. Normally aspirated is important to me, and light weight. Sounds like you will have a good compromise with both, combined with reliability and a great transmission. With the car gutted, I'm sure it'll be very quick on the track. Keep us updated. Videos too please!
10-23-07, 12:37 AM
#97
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I was thinking about using that oil cooler. I will use it if I relocate my oil filter. The filter doesn't really need to be relocated, but i may do if i feel that it will help with the clearance of the power steering pump.
