Suspension
Former Moderator. RIP Icemark.
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 25,896
Likes: 24
From: Rohnert Park CA
How much do you have to spend and what are you trying to get out of the car.
Suspension is a very personal choice. Some people like a stiff suspension, some people like a softer suspension, some people are only driving on the track...
So how much and what are you trying to do?
Suspension is a very personal choice. Some people like a stiff suspension, some people like a softer suspension, some people are only driving on the track...
So how much and what are you trying to do?
Thread Starter
rotors, my anti-piston
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 39
Likes: 0
From: Hidden Valley Lake, CA
seeing as your from rohnert park, you probably know how windy the St. Helena mtn. is, i want to be able to have better control. i could throw down 1000-1500 on it, what's decent that i could get for that?
What kinda tires do you have?
That will also make a HUGE difference on how your car responds and handles.
As a personal choice I was very happy with the Racing Beat handling package with a set of their adjustable endlinks in conjuction with a set of Tokico Illuminas from www.shox.com . Plus a set of front and rear strut tower bars from Corksport for that last little bit of stability.
That will also make a HUGE difference on how your car responds and handles.
As a personal choice I was very happy with the Racing Beat handling package with a set of their adjustable endlinks in conjuction with a set of Tokico Illuminas from www.shox.com . Plus a set of front and rear strut tower bars from Corksport for that last little bit of stability.
Former Moderator. RIP Icemark.
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 25,896
Likes: 24
From: Rohnert Park CA
Yes, I would also recommend the RB system. I have used their springs in the past and been very happy with them.
Playing with shocks on the FC, I personally tend to not like the Tokico blues for shocks, as they tend to be a bit stiffly valved and the KYB's a better choice. If you have the money the Tokico Illuminas adjustables seem to be the best of the reasonably inexpensive tweakable struts for the FC.
Playing with shocks on the FC, I personally tend to not like the Tokico blues for shocks, as they tend to be a bit stiffly valved and the KYB's a better choice. If you have the money the Tokico Illuminas adjustables seem to be the best of the reasonably inexpensive tweakable struts for the FC.
As mentioned before, tires are the most important thing. Save up for some used 205/50/15 Falken Azenis RT-615 (assuming you have 15 inch wheels) and it'll show dividends right away.
As for suspension, for 1000-1500 you could get an entry-level coilover. A cheap option would be Stance. Also look up Tein Flex as an option; many members on this forum use it and rave about it, though it is more expensive. Realize also that coilovers are much stiffer than stock, so the ride will be harsher. I imagine that California roads are much smoother than New York ones, so it might be more easily tolerated.
If you're not willing to drop all that dough just yet, you can always look into aftermarket dampers paired with aftermarket stock-type street springs. This is definitely not as stiff as the coilover option. Two brands were mentioned before, KYB with their AGX struts / shocks and Tokico with their Illumina struts / shocks. Let me introduce two more brands. Bilsten has their HD struts / shocks and Koni has their Yellow struts / shocks.
I've ridden on Koni, Bilstein and KYB. I must say, out of the three, I find that Bilstein has the best damping out of the box, Koni's have the best adjustment and KYB's have the softest ride. That being said, I prefer Koni's or Bilsteins.
However, that being said, there's a problem with Koni's and Bilstein's. They are much more complicated to install than KYB's or Tokico's. You see, KYB sends you a complete replacement front strut. Bolt the old strut off, put the new one on. Koni / Bilstein, on the other hand, sends you strut inserts. How do you install strut inserts, you ask? By bolting the stock strut off, cutting the bottom of your stock strut off, taking the stock insert out, putting the new insert in and possibly tack welding it, then bolting it back up. As you can see, much more involved. Thankfully, rear shocks are the same, no matter which company you buy from.
Besides that, the downside to Koni's is that they're expensive. Beyond that, it's a good, quality option. The Koni's can take springs up to 500 lb/in (~8 kg/mm) in the front without needing a revalve. Revalving a shock means sending a shock back to the factory, having them take apart the shock and rebuild it in line with the higher rate springs that you expect to pair them with. Also, springs that high in spring rate only come as part of a coilover setup. However, converting Koni's to coilovers is an option that many FC owners have done.
The downside to Bilstein's is that they are non-adjustable, though in the performance world, that is not much of an issue since 90% of adjustable shocks on the market have adjusters that are crap and don't do what you think they're doing. Most adjusters will not give you the same force setting on the same number setting depending if you moved the adjuster to the left to get to that number or if you moved it to the right. Bilstein seems to have gotten the force damping right as well, for stock to moderately stiffer springs. You're pretty much set with these shocks, unless you decide to convert these shocks to a coilover. Then, you will most likely need a shock revalve. Thankfully, the Bilstein factory's revalve service is much cheaper than Koni's.
The downside to KYB is that their adjusters only affect daily driving ride force (i.e. low intensity forces), it doesn't stiffen up mid to high intensity forces (like high bumps in the roads, kerbs on tracks, etc.) While you would rather a shock adjust the low speed than the high speed if you could only choose one, a good adjustable shock (like a Koni) adjusts all intensities when you turn the adjuster. I believe the Tokico Illuminas are similar to the KYB's. KYB's can also be converted to a coilover, but I believe the normal spring used for a coilover setup on the FC's (7 kg/mm) is already too stiff for the KYB's. I also do not believe KYB has a revalve option.
So after all that information, here are the conclusions that I can offer you:
If you want the simplest approach to the most performance gain, and don't mind the stiffer settings, buy yourself a coilover out of the box.
If you want a cheap, non-involved setup that will mildly improve your handling, go with the KYB AGX or the Tokico Illuminas and pair them with Tanabe GF210 springs. Those are the stiffest (3 kg front, 2 kg rear, I believe) street springs available currently.
If you want a slightly more expensive, much more complicated to install setup that performs better than the cheap strut setup, but not as well as the coilover setup, go with the Koni Yellows or the Bilstein HD's and pair them with the Tanabe GF210 springs. This setup also gives you the option of converting it to a coilover setup at a future date via the Ground Control coilover springs. Remember, if you go Bilstein and want to convert to a coilover, you have to get them revalved.
I personally like the third option. It's a one-time hassle of install (two if you decide to convert it to a coilover at a later date) that provides you with better out of the box benefits than a cheap strut / spring combo. It also allows you to customize your own set of coilovers based on your car, without having to spend coilover money all at once. With this way, it'll probably end up more expensive overall, but you'll never have to drop $1500 at once. If you find that you like it paired with a street spring, then you have what you want without spending any more money.
As for suspension, for 1000-1500 you could get an entry-level coilover. A cheap option would be Stance. Also look up Tein Flex as an option; many members on this forum use it and rave about it, though it is more expensive. Realize also that coilovers are much stiffer than stock, so the ride will be harsher. I imagine that California roads are much smoother than New York ones, so it might be more easily tolerated.
If you're not willing to drop all that dough just yet, you can always look into aftermarket dampers paired with aftermarket stock-type street springs. This is definitely not as stiff as the coilover option. Two brands were mentioned before, KYB with their AGX struts / shocks and Tokico with their Illumina struts / shocks. Let me introduce two more brands. Bilsten has their HD struts / shocks and Koni has their Yellow struts / shocks.
I've ridden on Koni, Bilstein and KYB. I must say, out of the three, I find that Bilstein has the best damping out of the box, Koni's have the best adjustment and KYB's have the softest ride. That being said, I prefer Koni's or Bilsteins.
However, that being said, there's a problem with Koni's and Bilstein's. They are much more complicated to install than KYB's or Tokico's. You see, KYB sends you a complete replacement front strut. Bolt the old strut off, put the new one on. Koni / Bilstein, on the other hand, sends you strut inserts. How do you install strut inserts, you ask? By bolting the stock strut off, cutting the bottom of your stock strut off, taking the stock insert out, putting the new insert in and possibly tack welding it, then bolting it back up. As you can see, much more involved. Thankfully, rear shocks are the same, no matter which company you buy from.
Besides that, the downside to Koni's is that they're expensive. Beyond that, it's a good, quality option. The Koni's can take springs up to 500 lb/in (~8 kg/mm) in the front without needing a revalve. Revalving a shock means sending a shock back to the factory, having them take apart the shock and rebuild it in line with the higher rate springs that you expect to pair them with. Also, springs that high in spring rate only come as part of a coilover setup. However, converting Koni's to coilovers is an option that many FC owners have done.
The downside to Bilstein's is that they are non-adjustable, though in the performance world, that is not much of an issue since 90% of adjustable shocks on the market have adjusters that are crap and don't do what you think they're doing. Most adjusters will not give you the same force setting on the same number setting depending if you moved the adjuster to the left to get to that number or if you moved it to the right. Bilstein seems to have gotten the force damping right as well, for stock to moderately stiffer springs. You're pretty much set with these shocks, unless you decide to convert these shocks to a coilover. Then, you will most likely need a shock revalve. Thankfully, the Bilstein factory's revalve service is much cheaper than Koni's.
The downside to KYB is that their adjusters only affect daily driving ride force (i.e. low intensity forces), it doesn't stiffen up mid to high intensity forces (like high bumps in the roads, kerbs on tracks, etc.) While you would rather a shock adjust the low speed than the high speed if you could only choose one, a good adjustable shock (like a Koni) adjusts all intensities when you turn the adjuster. I believe the Tokico Illuminas are similar to the KYB's. KYB's can also be converted to a coilover, but I believe the normal spring used for a coilover setup on the FC's (7 kg/mm) is already too stiff for the KYB's. I also do not believe KYB has a revalve option.
So after all that information, here are the conclusions that I can offer you:
If you want the simplest approach to the most performance gain, and don't mind the stiffer settings, buy yourself a coilover out of the box.
If you want a cheap, non-involved setup that will mildly improve your handling, go with the KYB AGX or the Tokico Illuminas and pair them with Tanabe GF210 springs. Those are the stiffest (3 kg front, 2 kg rear, I believe) street springs available currently.
If you want a slightly more expensive, much more complicated to install setup that performs better than the cheap strut setup, but not as well as the coilover setup, go with the Koni Yellows or the Bilstein HD's and pair them with the Tanabe GF210 springs. This setup also gives you the option of converting it to a coilover setup at a future date via the Ground Control coilover springs. Remember, if you go Bilstein and want to convert to a coilover, you have to get them revalved.
I personally like the third option. It's a one-time hassle of install (two if you decide to convert it to a coilover at a later date) that provides you with better out of the box benefits than a cheap strut / spring combo. It also allows you to customize your own set of coilovers based on your car, without having to spend coilover money all at once. With this way, it'll probably end up more expensive overall, but you'll never have to drop $1500 at once. If you find that you like it paired with a street spring, then you have what you want without spending any more money.
