Bearing play?
02-04-13, 07:17 PM
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Channeling Han Solo
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Bearing play?
Just installed drilled and slotted Powerstop rotors and Hawk HPS pads on all four corners, car stops on a dime now.
No problems with install, minus a horribly stuck caliper slide.
However, a question about the wheel bearings:
Both my factory service manual and Haynes repair guide say that you are supposed to feel a little play in the wheel bearings if you rock the hub assembly back and forth. How much is a little?
My only experience with these types of bearings is on old german cars, and I was always taught that you're not supposed to have any play at all, that you lock the nut just at the point where they are starting to catch.
I went with "no play" when I installed them and they are a tad noisy at highway speeds. Obviously, I want to loosen them a bit, but any good way of knowing how much play is appropriate?
No problems with install, minus a horribly stuck caliper slide.
However, a question about the wheel bearings:
Both my factory service manual and Haynes repair guide say that you are supposed to feel a little play in the wheel bearings if you rock the hub assembly back and forth. How much is a little?
My only experience with these types of bearings is on old german cars, and I was always taught that you're not supposed to have any play at all, that you lock the nut just at the point where they are starting to catch.
I went with "no play" when I installed them and they are a tad noisy at highway speeds. Obviously, I want to loosen them a bit, but any good way of knowing how much play is appropriate?
02-04-13, 10:14 PM
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Post your Car series..
Be helpful to others and let them know in the future what car you have.You'd be amazed how fast you get answers if people know what they are Dealing with.
Be helpful to others and let them know in the future what car you have.You'd be amazed how fast you get answers if people know what they are Dealing with.
02-05-13, 09:32 PM
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Channeling Han Solo
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My apologies, for some reason I misread and thought I was in a first gen specific area.
My car is an 83 GSL, front rotors and hubs are cast as one assembly, with an inner and outer bearing
My car is an 83 GSL, front rotors and hubs are cast as one assembly, with an inner and outer bearing
02-06-13, 10:14 PM
#5
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Ok, so now I’m really worried I messed something up. Let me start from the top and explain everything that’s happened.
I explained on the first post that I changed the front rotors, freed up, cleaned, and lubed the front calipers, pressed in the new bearing races, and installed the new hub assembly with fresh bearings and grease.
In the Haynes manual they say to tighten the hub lock nut until it starts to affect the freewheeling of the hub, then back off a 6th of a turn. If I backed off a 6th of a turn, then there was noticeable (but very slight) play when rocking the hub assembly in and out.
So it was either tighten till no play, but slightly labor the freewheeling of the hub assembly, or loosen till it freewheeled, but has a little play.
I went home with it tight and no play.
When I was driving home I heard a whining bearing noise (which I always assumed was the front bearings before I changed them,) and feared that I chose the wrong option.
So today, I stopped at the auto hobby shop on base where I’m stationed, loosened them a 6th of a turn, causing a little play, put my wheels back on and drove home (about 12 miles.)
When I started getting on the highway I started hearing the same bearing whine sound, and then when I got to 65, there was a new sound, like grinding gravel, coming very unmistakably from the front wheels.
So, frustrated at my mistake, I got home, jacked the car up, and sure enough, the rear wheel bearings are gone. I measured the play, and they are waaay past the limits.
Now, here’s the question: If I tighten up the fronts again to get rid of the play, will they be alright? Is 12 miles of driving (very slightly) loose enough to ruin them? Or is the grinding gravel sound I heard evidence that I’ve shredded my new bearings?
I can inspect the outer bearings, but if I pull the oil seal to inspect the inners, my car will be grounded until I can special order new seals, even if the bearings are fine.
OR...
should I ground the car anyway because the rears are so bad..?
Sorry it’s so long winded, but I thought it better to be thorough in my description.
It is immensely frustrating to diagnose noises in a lowered 80s japanese sports car with polyurethane bushings, rotten weather stripping, and a loud transmission..
I explained on the first post that I changed the front rotors, freed up, cleaned, and lubed the front calipers, pressed in the new bearing races, and installed the new hub assembly with fresh bearings and grease.
In the Haynes manual they say to tighten the hub lock nut until it starts to affect the freewheeling of the hub, then back off a 6th of a turn. If I backed off a 6th of a turn, then there was noticeable (but very slight) play when rocking the hub assembly in and out.
So it was either tighten till no play, but slightly labor the freewheeling of the hub assembly, or loosen till it freewheeled, but has a little play.
I went home with it tight and no play.
When I was driving home I heard a whining bearing noise (which I always assumed was the front bearings before I changed them,) and feared that I chose the wrong option.
So today, I stopped at the auto hobby shop on base where I’m stationed, loosened them a 6th of a turn, causing a little play, put my wheels back on and drove home (about 12 miles.)
When I started getting on the highway I started hearing the same bearing whine sound, and then when I got to 65, there was a new sound, like grinding gravel, coming very unmistakably from the front wheels.
So, frustrated at my mistake, I got home, jacked the car up, and sure enough, the rear wheel bearings are gone. I measured the play, and they are waaay past the limits.
Now, here’s the question: If I tighten up the fronts again to get rid of the play, will they be alright? Is 12 miles of driving (very slightly) loose enough to ruin them? Or is the grinding gravel sound I heard evidence that I’ve shredded my new bearings?
I can inspect the outer bearings, but if I pull the oil seal to inspect the inners, my car will be grounded until I can special order new seals, even if the bearings are fine.
OR...
should I ground the car anyway because the rears are so bad..?
Sorry it’s so long winded, but I thought it better to be thorough in my description.
It is immensely frustrating to diagnose noises in a lowered 80s japanese sports car with polyurethane bushings, rotten weather stripping, and a loud transmission..
02-07-13, 12:09 AM
#6
Well obviously the problem is with the hub/bearing assembly and nothing else then correct?
Adjustment:
Wheel Bearing Adjustment
1) Raise and support vehicle. Remove brake caliper and hang out of the way. Remove brake caliper adapter. Remover grease cap, cotter pin and nut lock. Ticghten spindle nut to 18-22 ft. lbs. (24-30 N.m.)
2) Turn hub a few times to seat bearing. Loosen nut. Install one wheel bolt and attach spring scale. Gradually tighten spindle nut until preload reading of 1.0-1.4 lbs. (.45-.64 kg) is obtained.
Removal and Installation
Wheel Bearing
1) Raise and support vehicle. Remove wheel assembly. Remove brake caliper and hang out of way. Remove brake caliper adapter. Remover grease cap, cotter pin, nut lock and spindle nut.
2) Remove washer and outer wheel bearing. Remove hub/rotor assembly. Remove grease seal and inner wheel bearing. Remove wheel bearing outer races, if required.
Installation
1) To install, reverse removal procedure. Adjust wheel bearings. See WHEEL BEARING ADJUSTMENT in this article.
I took the above directly out of the 1983 rx7 repair manual. Bottom line is that if you're hearing noise from one bearing and not the other then something is wrong. Without being there it's a possibility that it was too tight or too loose and allowed to much play or not enough clearance. If it's out of spec then it's time to get a new one. However, was the noise present before you replaced everything and that's why you ended up doing it or was it just maintenace? In my experience that little turn back probably didn't hurt the bearing, if I had to guess it was overtightened and crushed the race/bearing. Do you have a torque wrench or could you borrow one? Tha's all the info I could find for you. Hope it helps. (I deal with more press in beaings/ hub assemblies) May want to ask in the first gen section as well if you don't have a definite answer in the next few days or so.
Adjustment:
Wheel Bearing Adjustment
1) Raise and support vehicle. Remove brake caliper and hang out of the way. Remove brake caliper adapter. Remover grease cap, cotter pin and nut lock. Ticghten spindle nut to 18-22 ft. lbs. (24-30 N.m.)
2) Turn hub a few times to seat bearing. Loosen nut. Install one wheel bolt and attach spring scale. Gradually tighten spindle nut until preload reading of 1.0-1.4 lbs. (.45-.64 kg) is obtained.
Removal and Installation
Wheel Bearing
1) Raise and support vehicle. Remove wheel assembly. Remove brake caliper and hang out of way. Remove brake caliper adapter. Remover grease cap, cotter pin, nut lock and spindle nut.
2) Remove washer and outer wheel bearing. Remove hub/rotor assembly. Remove grease seal and inner wheel bearing. Remove wheel bearing outer races, if required.
Installation
1) To install, reverse removal procedure. Adjust wheel bearings. See WHEEL BEARING ADJUSTMENT in this article.
I took the above directly out of the 1983 rx7 repair manual. Bottom line is that if you're hearing noise from one bearing and not the other then something is wrong. Without being there it's a possibility that it was too tight or too loose and allowed to much play or not enough clearance. If it's out of spec then it's time to get a new one. However, was the noise present before you replaced everything and that's why you ended up doing it or was it just maintenace? In my experience that little turn back probably didn't hurt the bearing, if I had to guess it was overtightened and crushed the race/bearing. Do you have a torque wrench or could you borrow one? Tha's all the info I could find for you. Hope it helps. (I deal with more press in beaings/ hub assemblies) May want to ask in the first gen section as well if you don't have a definite answer in the next few days or so.
02-07-13, 12:20 AM
#7
Also, as a general rule of thumb when I wheel is tightened to the hub and still raised if you can shake the wheel (one hand on top and one on bottom) in and out then the bearing is too loose (Or that's what I've been taught to follow besides torque specs at least). If worst comes to worst you may want to pay a visit to your units mechanic lot and see if anybody there is willing to lend a helping hand in return for a few beers or something. If I recall, Coronado has an abundance or helo squadrons which always have some knowledgable mechanics with cars they love. Not to mention all the Exped. units I believe you all have out that way; they usually have some pretty mechanical backgrounds too. Just a thought. Good luck.
