Naturally Aspirated Performance Forum Discussion of naturally-aspirated rotary performance. No Power Adders, only pure rotary power! From the "12A" to the "RENESIS" and beyond.

Big NA intake port will not start

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old Aug 31, 2009 | 09:00 PM
  #1  
Mazdanowski's Avatar
Thread Starter
Junior Member
Tenured Member 05 Years
 
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 34
Likes: 0
From: Chicago
Big NA intake port will not start

Over the last 25 years I have built over twenty motors but I have one new rebuild that will not start without starting fluid and oil down the carb. The exhaust port is a normal race exhaust port using a RB template plus another 1/16 on the close. The intake port is the largest I have even seen on a domestic NA motor. By that I mean the closing is very very gradual and adds another half inch to the normal intake closing template. There is no sharp lip on the close. I made the close very gradual thinking it would reduce turbulance. I realize that the late closing of this 12A motor is forcing air back up the runners at low RPM. I was willing to make that trade off for a race only motor. The intake close on this 12A is almost the same as the aux on a 13B. I have pulled this motor apart 3 times. The carbon seals are new and the correct length. The new ide seals are set on the tight side but float freely. The corner seals have new soft seals. At 2 or 3K RPM the motor idled the smoothest with 25 degrees of timing, maybe even a little more. I didn't want to leave it that far advanced though. I replaced the rotors and eccentric shaft on a prior rebuild. The only constant in each motor is the housings. The starter is turning fast enough. The distributor and coils are stock first gen. I have used a 48 IDA weber and super stock Nikki that ran great on other motors but neither would start well . Once started they would idle for 20 - 30 minutes easily. Dyno header is long primary with dyno max muffler.

Since 13B aux also have very late closing and guys run them without the sleeves I can't see how it can be the port timing but I have replaced eveything but the housings.

If you have had this problem or know the solution let me know.
Reply
Old Sep 1, 2009 | 11:00 AM
  #2  
j9fd3s's Avatar
Moderator
Community Builder
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
iTrader: (3)
 
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 31,857
Likes: 3,243
From: https://www2.mazda.com/en/100th/
the closing timing on a side port does seem to affect starting, all the ITS/PS1/PT cars with no sleeves take a lot of cranking to start. i'm working on a PP now, and its actually quite good, fires right up...

anyways.

i think step 1 is to check compression. step 2 you get to work on the carb.
Reply
Old Sep 5, 2009 | 11:03 PM
  #3  
Tom93R1's Avatar
gross polluter
Tenured Member: 25 Years
iTrader: (2)
 
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 1,757
Likes: 25
From: Chandler, AZ
my 6-port with no sleeves was never difficult to start with my 48DCO. Put in the next size up idle jet or richen the idle mixture screw, a lean idle is what always makes it difficult to start my REPU
Reply
Old Sep 6, 2009 | 12:09 AM
  #4  
diabolical1's Avatar
Moderator
Tenured Member: 20 Years
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
iTrader: (3)
 
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 10,999
Likes: 350
From: FL
^ i second that.

i've run a 6-port without sleeves and it never gave me starting problems until i lost a water seal. play it sounds like all the engine seals are fine, so i'd say start with the jetting.
Reply
Old Sep 9, 2009 | 01:52 AM
  #5  
ArmyOfOne's Avatar
Bridge Port Freak
Tenured Member: 20 Years
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
iTrader: (12)
 
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,032
Likes: 3
From: Alzey, Germany
I am running a very early opening aggresive streetport 12A with a 45DCOE and I had a similar problem. I stepped up the idle jet and turned the mixture screws out one more turn. It takes a bit of cranking but it idles clean at 1350 rpms.

Good luck.
Reply
Old Sep 9, 2009 | 01:57 AM
  #6  
tulok's Avatar
Retard On Two Wheels
 
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 56
Likes: 0
From: Palmdale CA
Based on my motorcycling experiences, I have to agree that your mixture at idle might be a little lean. Good luck figuring it out.
Reply
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
hotshot2014
New Member RX-7 Technical
8
Jul 18, 2017 02:30 PM
immanuel__7
2nd Generation Specific (1986-1992)
89
Sep 5, 2015 10:23 AM




All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:45 AM.