Just wanted to post an update here, maybe get some help.

The setup:
Halfbridge S5 rotors, etc, etc. etc
Greddy TD07-25A, 720/1680 injectors, etc, etc...
BUR9EQ's all around. Brand new. Old, shitty spark plug wires that I should probably replace.
Most of the rest is unimportant
Currently running 12PSI, going for 18+ tomorrow.


Car is running GREAT now that I set the timing properly.

For everyone's refrence, no matter where you see it online it's WRONG unless it says this:

Trailing = left mark on CAS = 20 ATDC
Leading = Right mark on CAS = 5 ATDC

Before I had the timing about 10deg out PLUS I was running it as TDC = left mark, so 30 degrees retarded! No wonder the exhaust started glowing so quick. I don't know how the timing moved since me and roger set it about a month ago and the bolt was tight. *shrug*

I set the MS to have cranking timing as 5 ATDC, then timed to the right mark on the pulley. Had to restab my CAS to get it, but then they matched. Car takes a few cranks to fire but seems to start fine with that timing setting.

Did some tuning today, it's still too rich (10.5:1 AFR's at 12PSI, should probably be closer to 12:1) and not quite as even as I'd like but it's getting pretty close. I'm running around 16 deg advance at 12PSI, 11 at 16 and 10 above that.. not going to run much more than 16 on pump and probably 24-26 on racegas. Gets racegas tomorrow

I still have a bit of tach noise apparently at high RPM, above 7500 or so. It's causing a misfire and is an issue since my powerband doesn't really start till 6500. The CAS is hooked up the right way, shielded, not near anything noisy, etc and still the noise. I have the pots adjusted as far as I can adjust them before losing the cranking signal.
If I adjust the hysterisis pot any further it doubles my cranking RPM for some reason, and the voltage pot any further and there's no signal. Any ideas here?

 

Thanks for the update. I was wondering what happened to your project!

Glad you got that timing issue sorted out. Retarded timing was first thing that came to mind with the glowing turbine housing. I really think marking off some proper timing marks on the pulley is worth the few minutes effort it takes. Then you can check timing at idle, rather than trying to set it while cranking. You can also rev the engine to different operating points, and verify proper advance values that match with MegaTune, and get a warm fuzzy feeling that the timing number in MegaTune are real.

No power until 6500 rpm? Is that what was expected when you built this engine? Sounds like it'll be a beast when it gets rolling. Do you have any dyno or track events planned?

 

I'll be at ST Thomas this weekend for Windsor shootout.

It makes power below 6500, but it doesn't /really/ start to pull hard until beyond there. I was pretty sure that the engine/etc would be like this when we were building it so it's built to revv. RX8 stationaries and etc.

The car drives /so/ much nicer and sounds /so/ much better now with the timing set properly.

I have another question though, as I just realized that my timing may be out still. Doh.

I was told that the rotary ignition works like a two stroke since it fires the coils every 360 instead of 720 degrees, and therefore advance/retard will not show up correctly on a traditional 4 stroke timing light (it will double).
If that's the case, did I set my timing wrong since I was adjusting assuming that 5 ATDC = 5ATDC, when really it should show up as 10 ATDC on the CAS (in which case my timing is advanced too far by 5 degrees)... I hope I explained this clearly enough.

as far as being quick, I have some new impressions with the timing correct:
I had an intercooler hose come off and the car is faster n/a this year than it was with the turbo last year. On boost it's nutty. Blows away my Z-rated 235-45-17 tires in 3rd gear on dry pavement. At 12psi. I have slicks and skinnies for the weekend

 

I'll try to make it out to St. Thomas on Saturday night or late in the afternoon...But as I mentioned I'm planning to start my car on Sunday so unless things are 100% done I'll stay home...Don't see why not though since I just have to install intercooler piping, heat wrap the exhaust, connect the O2 sensor and bolt on the ECU cover...

 

As long as you're not using an adjustable timing gun, (IE you're using a timing light that just lights every time there's a spark) your timing should be fine. It might flash at the wrong side of the e-shaft pulley every other flash, but you should still be able to set it properly. Only adjustable timing lights should have a problem.

I'm using a regular craftsman timing light and I've never had any trouble getting the timing right on any engine with that... 4 cyl wasted, 4 cyl distributor, or rotary.

BTW, a rotary fires the leading plugs every 180 degrees... and each trailing plug is every 360 degrees...

The noise could be caused by several things... you could need more grounds for example, or better grounds (usually this is the problem when there's noise on the VR signal).

 

Hey Terrh, glad to hear your making progress. I was suprised to see your running a very simular setup to me well atleast for a turbo, Im running a TD07-18A on street ported S4 720/1000. My powerband doesn't start til around 5500 either but when it does the "oh ****" factor is high it pulls strong till 9k I've only run it breifly at 12 psi no higher since Im still tuning. I am curious what wastegate you are running ? I'd also like to know what your duty cycles are like past 12 psi with your injector setup. Im seeing dc1 73 dc2 68 @ 12 psi on my setup so I've not got much room left for more boost and will have to upgrade. I also would like to have a peek at your advance table and compare. Have you had it on a dyno yet ? I'd like to know what these turbo's are capable of, I was told 500 rwhp but until I get on a dyno its only best guess.

 

I think I might have the same timing problem too. I will have to check it again. I just upgraded to a gt45 turbo. I am also running 12psi. I agree with the later power but it is also very nutty!!!!! I need to pull my engine I just blew a coolant seal. I think it was because to much heat in the exhaust do to the wrong timing. I was only able to run 10deg of timing in megatune. Who know what it really was.

 

went up to 18PSI today. Car pulls like a bat out of hell!

25psi on racegas tomorrow.

Duty cycle was around 50% at 18PSI, AFR's are still a little on the rich side but much better than they were even yesterday.

I had a problem, it went away and I couldn't trace it down, lets hope like hell it doesn't come back, the MS is losing power or something, I kept getting "resets". I wiggled some wires, resoldered 2 others, but it still did it a few times afterwards.

car feels like it will pull forever literally, shift into 5th and the revs just keep climbing.

Can this happen from a short? I think I am going to pull my intake manifold tomorrow and look for any damaged wires.

 

yes, short circuits or loss of +12v from vibration etc.. can cause resets... as can having very extreme noise problems... like power surges and spikes and such.

 

I pulled the intake manifold and can't find anything wrong.

I'm leaving for the weekend (st. thomas dragway until sunday!) tomorrow morning but I can keep looking up there.

I didn't see any damaged wires but that doesn't mean there aren't any - how can I trace this down quickly? It is doing it far less frequently now and seems to do it much more at really high RPM (8000+).

 

It could be vibrations, or you might just want to run more grounds from the MS to the engine.

There really isn't a quick way to track it down if you ask me... I'd start by adding more grounds, and move from there.

 

ok

I'm gone as of /right now/
I'll add another ground, hopefully I can get online or something once over the weekend. I may run a power wire straight to the MS from the battery.

it actually seems to die both at WOT and at transition from closed to open throttle, I'm wondering if it's a loose wire or something again.

 

you should be able to look at your log data for signal spikes, I was having this a couple weeks ago, I added an additional ground and it went away. Good luck at the races, I am going to hit our track next weekend.

 

11.6@120mph@18psi.

Not bad!

I think i fixed the issue but I'm not sure, an intercooler pipe was grounding on my + battery block since the cover broke last week... I wrapped the thing in electrical/duct tape and the issue went away.

Time for a new cover and slight relocation for that.

 

very nice run, I am hoping to break into 11's this Friday. Where you running street tires, drag radials or slicks ? I have been able to get away with 15 psi on 94 octane so far on stock fuel pressure seeing 78% DC, Im going to bump my pressure up to 48.5 or 50 and do some logging. I am still hoping to get into the dyno this week before I race.

I think with 5 more psi of fuel it should give me enough to run 18psi. I will also be installing my egt probe before the race to keep and eye on that as well.

 

Great job! I'd bet you're the quickest rotary MS install to date. Do you have a datalog of that run to post?

 

I should have a datalog of that run but I'm not sure. Laptop isn't here, but I'll go over it tomorrow. I have quite a few datalogs but not one from every pass. I can't get MSLV to work, it can never read the logs (I always get a range check error)

Oh yeah, I have a question as well....

my boost numbers were ALL over the place according to the MS, with changes that seemed to me to be impossible.

I'm not sure offhand how far apart the intervals are in the datalog, but it seems to me to be in the 1/10th of a second range.. at WOT I was seeing, for example, 208KPA in one line, 166 the next and 212 the next!
I don't see how manifold pressure could change that much, My boost gauge was reading pretty consistantly. About the only way I could see it changing like that is if I had either a bad apex seal (because I've seen this happen in my boost gauge while driving with a bad seal) - or there's something wrong with the sensor or something.

There is also a LOT more left in this car. Another 8+ psi and probably a /whole/ lot more timing.

 

aside from the plug 'n players

But yeah, of the people who built themselves this was a pretty quick install, and sounds like tuning is going well too!

 

you can use megalogviewer. It's a more up-to-date log viewer that also has an analysis feature that'll help you tune your VE table.

I'm not sure what's going on there with that oscillation in boost... Tofuball had a smaller oscillation in boost which we got rid of by putting a restrictor in his map line.

Ken

 

I was referring to 1/4 mile time, not installation time!

 

ahh, yeah that's probably the fastest rx7 on megasquirt right now. Thanks for the clarification.

 

I'm hoping to challenge that on Friday. I will have dyno #'s on Friday as well I'm booked to dyno Friday morning and race that night.

 

I smell competition I hope to be into the same numbers. Are car seem so close. What is your timing @ 18psi

 

Let's have a competition!

at 18PSI on racegas I was running 9 degrees (226kpa)

I think there is a LOT more timing to be run, but I'm going to have to either learn some more or find a professional before I go further!

 

Yeah, I might be able to beat that as well...Big streetport TII engine in a 1st gen, big turbo, MS 2.2 running Squirt and Spark Extra...Going to be 400 RWHP at least and was at the dyno last night...waiting to hear on the numbers....