Just Finished Designing My Sub Box Today
02-27-02, 02:41 AM
#1
Just Finished Designing My Sub Box Today
Hey guys, I just thought I would share that I drew up (in 3D) the subwoofer box I plan on installing in my car. It will soon be the home of two 900 watt 10" subs, one 1800 watt amp, and one 1/2 farad capacitor. I am replacing the storager bins, which I never use anyway, with a custom box. Hopefully It will turn out nice when I start full scale construction tomorrow. I already used some thick cardboard (like an inch thick) and built a full size model and set it in the car and it fits beautifully. Im hoping that the wood will work just as easily. Anyway, wish me luck.
~T.J.
~T.J.
02-27-02, 09:35 AM
#3
Damn, it did start!
what is the "all your base belong to us."?
02-27-02, 09:59 AM
#4
damn hippies
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Syracuse NY/Houston texas
Posts: 528
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
all your base belong to us..lol i know thats sogn damn funny, 1/2 fraded cap isnt ganna do the trick with 1800 watts, your ganna need 2 fraid caps to hold everything b/c 1/2 fraid cap is compaired to 500 watts, its better than nothing but with that much wattage you alternater is ganna be fried in about...all depends how high you turn the sucka up
02-27-02, 10:17 AM
#5
Administrator
iTrader: (8)
Join Date: Nov 1998
Location: So. Arlington, TX!!!
Posts: 12,974
Likes: 0
Received 59 Likes
on
36 Posts
Unless he bought Soundstream, PPI, Alpine or MTX, I doubt seriously if his amp is really capable of 1800 watts which is probably the max watt rating and not the RMS rating of the amp. Make sure you use 3/4" MDF (at LEAST 3/4", more if you can still cut and work it...) for the box and some spray sound killer in the bins before the box goes in. What is the size of wire recommended for the power lead of the amp? That is one way to gauge if the amp is truly capable of its claimed power. Anyway for you to download a quicky of what the box will look like so we can see it? I know I'm dying out of curiousity to see what you came up with, RMD (yo, yo, you know me...)...
Trending Topics
02-27-02, 05:10 PM
#11
Full Member
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Raleigh
Posts: 131
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Last edited by TheAMAZINGNorad; 02-27-02 at 05:14 PM.
02-28-02, 12:59 AM
#13
all your base belong to us..lol i know thats sogn damn funny, 1/2 fraded cap isnt ganna do the trick with 1800 watts, your ganna need 2 fraid caps to hold everything b/c 1/2 fraid cap is compaired to 500 watts, its better than nothing but with that much wattage you alternater is ganna be fried in about...all depends how high you turn the sucka up
). The amp is 600 RMS split into 300 RMS each. But the 1/2 farad is still right . Anyway, Im not taunting you, i really am building the box, i just dont own a digital camera (sad eh?) so i cant take lots of pics, but i really want to. Also, i have kinda started but i will try and take some as i go along because im gonna borrow my neighbors camera soon.~T.J.
02-28-02, 01:04 AM
#14
Ok, just realized that the sub box is no longer gonna hold the capacitor, but i will still have one, im currently devising a new place to put it...im thinking more cutom work... anyway, for all you "all your base are belong to us" curious people, heres a good link to chek out...All Your Base Are Belong To Us
~T.J.
PS - In case any of you are curious, yes, i have personally hidden this phrase in numerous places
~T.J.
PS - In case any of you are curious, yes, i have personally hidden this phrase in numerous places
02-28-02, 04:34 PM
#15
Doing the subs firing up or diagonal against the seat? I have been there.. Trust me... Lets discuss the theory of propogation vs. modulation I dont really want to get into an explanation of this. But remember after you build it, and start to wonder why you have more bass when the hatch is open. Remember mikey told ya so... 12 years of professional car stereo experience here...
I dont really want to get into an explanation of this. But remember after you build it, and start to wonder why you have more bass when the hatch is open. Remember mikey told ya so... 12 years of professional car stereo experience here...
02-28-02, 04:50 PM
#16
"By the beard of Zeus!"
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Huntsville, Alabama / Atlanta, Georgia
Posts: 867
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally posted by MIKE-P-28
Doing the subs firing up or diagonal against the seat? I have been there.. Trust me... Lets discuss the theory of propogation vs. modulation I dont really want to get into an explanation of this. But remember after you build it, and start to wonder why you have more bass when the hatch is open. Remember mikey told ya so... 12 years of professional car stereo experience here...
Doing the subs firing up or diagonal against the seat? I have been there.. Trust me... Lets discuss the theory of propogation vs. modulation
I dont really want to get into an explanation of this. But remember after you build it, and start to wonder why you have more bass when the hatch is open. Remember mikey told ya so... 12 years of professional car stereo experience here...
I plan to have the sub in the storage bin, firing towards the top of the bin... I'm not sure if that is the greatest way to do it...
I know that the sub cone needs to be pointing towards a solid surface that will reflect the sound waves back...
I need to know the optimal position in the storage bin--if you will please explain, Mikey
Last edited by FuLLsMoKe; 02-28-02 at 04:53 PM.
02-28-02, 05:20 PM
#17
Ok lets start this book...
Ok what happens is when you place subs in the middle of the car is.. some of the sound waves go to the rear of the car and some go to the front. Well when the waves that went to the rear reflect back to the front they will be later (time) than the front waves. And this will cause cancelation. This used to be very common with S-10's with snug tops and no cab wall glass. People would put subs behind the seat of the truck and wonder why is sounded a shitload better with the camper top open...Well this is the reason. What happens is when you open the hatch/camper top the waves that were canceling some of the bass now leave the vehicle. So even with it open/closed you arent getting the full potential of the sub. Same thing in the FB/SA just not to so much a degree but will be very noticeable.
Now something that I have learned over 50 million cars I have done is Try to fire a woofer in the rearmost corner or back of the car. A good rule of thumb is load the driver within at least of 1/2 the drivers diameter... So if its a 12 at least 6 inches away from the back or corner ...
Am I making any sense. I tried to find a easy way to explain this. There have been numerous books written on this subject alone and are sure to put you to sleep or leave you wondering what the F' are they talking about...
Also want to comment on wattage ratings on subs...My opinion on wattage ratings are they are a useless specification. I had a set of subs in my car that were rated 125/rms each JL Audio 12W0's. I had an old PPI Pro MOS 2100 running them at a 2 ohm bridged.. Ok lets break it down, at 2 ohm mono thats over 800 watts RMS to the speakers, had them in there 3 years. Never had a problem, actually to tell the truth I have never blown a speaker in my life. DISTORTION blows speakers not power On the other hand you can take a sub thats rated at a 1000 watts and distort the **** outta a 100 watt amp and fry it in a matter of an hour, day whatever... Ampliers put out AC voltage out the speaker outs, when the amplifier is clipped it is oscillating DC into the voice coil. Want to know what DC does to a coil of wire? Plug your cig lighter in, thats what it does...
Power ratings for speakers are devised by place the voice coil of the speaker by itself on a table and they feed power into it, until it starts to get hot. Has nothing to do with speakers suspension, or anything else that is usefull. Hope I helped
Ok what happens is when you place subs in the middle of the car is.. some of the sound waves go to the rear of the car and some go to the front. Well when the waves that went to the rear reflect back to the front they will be later (time) than the front waves. And this will cause cancelation. This used to be very common with S-10's with snug tops and no cab wall glass. People would put subs behind the seat of the truck and wonder why is sounded a shitload better with the camper top open...Well this is the reason. What happens is when you open the hatch/camper top the waves that were canceling some of the bass now leave the vehicle. So even with it open/closed you arent getting the full potential of the sub. Same thing in the FB/SA just not to so much a degree but will be very noticeable.
Now something that I have learned over 50 million cars I have done is
Try to fire a woofer in the rearmost corner or back of the car. A good rule of thumb is load the driver within at least of 1/2 the drivers diameter... So if its a 12 at least 6 inches away from the back or corner ...Am I making any sense. I tried to find a easy way to explain this. There have been numerous books written on this subject alone and are sure to put you to sleep or leave you wondering what the F' are they talking about...
Also want to comment on wattage ratings on subs...My opinion on wattage ratings are they are a useless specification. I had a set of subs in my car that were rated 125/rms each JL Audio 12W0's. I had an old PPI Pro MOS 2100 running them at a 2 ohm bridged.. Ok lets break it down, at 2 ohm mono thats over 800 watts RMS to the speakers, had them in there 3 years. Never had a problem, actually to tell the truth I have never blown a speaker in my life. DISTORTION blows speakers not power
On the other hand you can take a sub thats rated at a 1000 watts and distort the **** outta a 100 watt amp and fry it in a matter of an hour, day whatever... Ampliers put out AC voltage out the speaker outs, when the amplifier is clipped it is oscillating DC into the voice coil. Want to know what DC does to a coil of wire? Plug your cig lighter in, thats what it does... Power ratings for speakers are devised by place the voice coil of the speaker by itself on a table and they feed power into it, until it starts to get hot. Has nothing to do with speakers suspension, or anything else that is usefull. Hope I helped
Last edited by MIKE-P-28; 02-28-02 at 05:22 PM.
02-28-02, 05:30 PM
#18
By the way I had this same problem in my 88 vert. I put the sub box and sub under the spare tire compartment with the sub firing down towards the floor. Hummm sounds pretty good, open the trunk and its nite and day difference. Same thing here. So what I did was completely isolate the front of the car from the trunk area... First I duct taped any air opening into the trunk. Then I cut sticky sqaures (poo man's dynamat ) and placed them over the openings too. Then I took some speaker box carpet, rolled it up really good and shoved it back there too insulate it. Made a HUGE difference, still have a minor bit of cancelation, but its works great and I have my little trunk still
) and placed them over the openings too. Then I took some speaker box carpet, rolled it up really good and shoved it back there too insulate it. Made a HUGE difference, still have a minor bit of cancelation, but its works great and I have my little trunk still
02-28-02, 05:56 PM
#19
Anytime baby!
Ok then, this dillemma again.
So, the storage boxes are akin to a wolf in sheep's clothing, we know that. Sucks right? Hell yeah it does.
Then, what is an FB owner to do, who wants to add a sub somewhere in his car, without building an enclosure in the hatch, looking ugly and waiting for theivery. Da Mound is definitely due for a serious stereo upgrade here in the next few months. Would like to add a sub.
So where can we add a sub, stealthy, and still get good sound?
Since you got me started, I'm gonna start thread regarding what to do with the stock stereo-it looks too good to remove, but doesn't sound so hot.
Right on.
So, the storage boxes are akin to a wolf in sheep's clothing, we know that. Sucks right? Hell yeah it does.
Then, what is an FB owner to do, who wants to add a sub somewhere in his car, without building an enclosure in the hatch, looking ugly and waiting for theivery. Da Mound is definitely due for a serious stereo upgrade here in the next few months. Would like to add a sub.
So where can we add a sub, stealthy, and still get good sound?
Since you got me started, I'm gonna start thread regarding what to do with the stock stereo-it looks too good to remove, but doesn't sound so hot.
Right on.
02-28-02, 06:16 PM
#20
Admitted Sevenaholic
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Ashland, OH
Posts: 1,910
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The best location I have found, and it can rattle your teeth despite its size!
http://max7.rx-7.org/image/rear_speakers.jpg
And listen to MIKE-P-28 about the speaker placement causing cancelation.
Its not always WHAT you got, but WHERE you put it and HOW you use it.
I've spent most of my life in Car Audio, Took classes at the Installers Institute and MECP certified.
Knowledge is power
http://max7.rx-7.org/image/rear_speakers.jpg
And listen to MIKE-P-28 about the speaker placement causing cancelation.
Its not always WHAT you got, but WHERE you put it and HOW you use it.
I've spent most of my life in Car Audio, Took classes at the Installers Institute and MECP certified.
Knowledge is power
02-28-02, 06:23 PM
#21
Dont get me wrong, you still will get bass out of the storage compartment area. Just wont be PERFECT...
A if using the storage comp. then you will need to shore it up with something like 3/4" wood to make it more rigid, and you will also need it to be air tight.. You want to effectively close the back wave of the speaker from the front... (Guess thats a box's definition .. ) You have to weigh convience versus sound quality.. The storage compartments provided a moderate amount of bass and virtually no loss of space... So the choice is yours, I just wanted you to know the why and how comes when you get it installed...
Word to wise on thievery, 7 times outta 10. Someone who steals from you is someone who knows you or knows of you... And knows eaxctly where it is anyway.. Something I tell a lot of people when working on a car, is make a good tight install , dont go out of your way to make it harder to steal. This will only anger the thief and he will destroy more of your car trying to get. Rest assured he will get it anyways, no matter what...Still amazes me how they steal an amp mounted under the seat with 4 screws. I tell ya how they do it, they take a long flatblade and a hammer. Place a few rags over the screwdriver's head, and put the screwdrive under the amp right on the screws threads, one good hit and its out, repeat this 4 times and they got an amp... Also dont mount amps on sub boxes unless you got no other place to put it. You just made it easier to steal your amp, when they take a pocket knife and cut the wires...They not only get a box and subs they get a free amp.
Case in point, lady came to me today with a 93 Maxima, I put a $179 Alpine CD player in a few months back... Now this is EL CHEAPO ... $179 with a free install. Now on a maxima since you have to remove the front dash panel and then 4 screws to remove the deck (Since its iso loaded to the factory bracket) They took a long flatblade screwdriver and pryed the entire radio and factory bracket out, they got it but, they did over 900 in damage to the dash Plus the cost of the radio..
A if using the storage comp. then you will need to shore it up with something like 3/4" wood to make it more rigid, and you will also need it to be air tight.. You want to effectively close the back wave of the speaker from the front... (Guess thats a box's definition ..
) You have to weigh convience versus sound quality.. The storage compartments provided a moderate amount of bass and virtually no loss of space... So the choice is yours, I just wanted you to know the why and how comes when you get it installed...Word to wise on thievery, 7 times outta 10. Someone who steals from you is someone who knows you or knows of you... And knows eaxctly where it is anyway.. Something I tell a lot of people when working on a car, is make a good tight install , dont go out of your way to make it harder to steal. This will only anger the thief and he will destroy more of your car trying to get. Rest assured he will get it anyways, no matter what...Still amazes me how they steal an amp mounted under the seat with 4 screws. I tell ya how they do it, they take a long flatblade and a hammer. Place a few rags over the screwdriver's head, and put the screwdrive under the amp right on the screws threads, one good hit and its out, repeat this 4 times and they got an amp... Also dont mount amps on sub boxes unless you got no other place to put it. You just made it easier to steal your amp, when they take a pocket knife and cut the wires...They not only get a box and subs they get a free amp.
Case in point, lady came to me today with a 93 Maxima, I put a $179 Alpine CD player in a few months back... Now this is EL CHEAPO ... $179 with a free install. Now on a maxima since you have to remove the front dash panel and then 4 screws to remove the deck (Since its iso loaded to the factory bracket) They took a long flatblade screwdriver and pryed the entire radio and factory bracket out, they got it but, they did over 900 in damage to the dash
Plus the cost of the radio..
02-28-02, 06:30 PM
#22
Originally posted by Max7
The best location I have found, and it can rattle your teeth despite its size!
http://max7.rx-7.org/image/rear_speakers.jpg
And listen to MIKE-P-28 about the speaker placement causing cancelation.
Its not always WHAT you got, but WHERE you put it and HOW you use it.
I've spent most of my life in Car Audio, Took classes at the Installers Institute and MECP certified.
Knowledge is power
The best location I have found, and it can rattle your teeth despite its size!
http://max7.rx-7.org/image/rear_speakers.jpg
And listen to MIKE-P-28 about the speaker placement causing cancelation.
Its not always WHAT you got, but WHERE you put it and HOW you use it.
I've spent most of my life in Car Audio, Took classes at the Installers Institute and MECP certified.
Knowledge is power
@ brownmound. Im gonna devise some stealth boxes for all 3 gen's of RX-7's since no one else does, and sell them. Im thinking of a pair of 8 at the rear most of the car by the tail lights, with only the loss of the jack for 1st gen. 2nd gen, im looking at a single 10, and a 3rd gen I need someone to volunteer their car for a couple days, and i'll give them a free box
Gonna be composite fiberglass and MDF.. As soon as I get someother projects outta the way, would there be anyone interested ? I can sell them loaded or unloaded, I can get virtually any speaker you want to put in there... Havent decided on cost, but I will make them cheap since everything else is so freaking expensive for our cars...@max I was thinking the same thing as your link, but the stock cover would still be in place and I was considering horn loaded placement...
Last edited by MIKE-P-28; 02-28-02 at 06:35 PM.
02-28-02, 10:15 PM
#23
Well, for all you "stereo freaks" I dont really care about the "soundstage" or "cancelation" all that much. I am aware that I'll probably be bitting my tounge later for not doing it right, but for now, im 17 and I just want something to hadle the sound better than the stock paper speakers. So im replacing with all Kenwood speakers and just threw the sub idea in there cause I knew I wanted (at least) one sub, and I dont use the storage bins anyway. Plus I just wanted to see if I could actually do it . Basically, all im saying is that as much as i appreciate the info, and I do read it just to learn, I really couldnt care less. No insult to any of you, I just think that its my car and ill do it the way I want It just works for me. But I do have a 3D rendering from my computer of what im planing, ill post that in a few minutes...
~T.J.
. Basically, all im saying is that as much as i appreciate the info, and I do read it just to learn, I really couldnt care less. No insult to any of you, I just think that its my car and ill do it the way I want It just works for me. But I do have a 3D rendering from my computer of what im planing, ill post that in a few minutes...~T.J.
02-28-02, 10:25 PM
#24
Here ya go... I threw this together in about 15 minutes so its nothing spectacular. The original idea behind the computer was just to get "exact" measurements because its drawn exactly to scale with the exception of the amp, neon lights, and speakers (to an extent, theyre at least the right diameter). Then later I decided to just make a full out rendering of it just for fun. The blue bar looking things on either side of the amp are supposed to be blue neon lights (not sure if I will actually install them or not), and YES, I know the amp doesnt really look like that. "Artistic License" Also, the drawing doesnt include the switches for the neon (if it gets installed) or the cooling fan(s) im going to put in the front to force the air out of the amp box (which is actually covered by plexi-glass, not shown)
~T.J.
). Then later I decided to just make a full out rendering of it just for fun. The blue bar looking things on either side of the amp are supposed to be blue neon lights (not sure if I will actually install them or not), and YES, I know the amp doesnt really look like that. "Artistic License" Also, the drawing doesnt include the switches for the neon (if it gets installed) or the cooling fan(s) im going to put in the front to force the air out of the amp box (which is actually covered by plexi-glass, not shown) ~T.J.