E.L. Prototypes ECU Upgrade
04-29-02, 03:32 PM
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E.L. Prototypes ECU Upgrade
I sent my '87 Turbo ecu off to ELP this morning. I should have it back by the end of the week. They do an upgrade similar to MD Race or the now dead G-Force.
The maps will be set up for downpipe, silencer, upgraded Y-Pipe, Trust mufflers, and intake.
We are going to throw it in "Turbo Dan's" car as well, so we will have 2 reference points. We will simply remove the FCD and swap the ECU. No other mods.... I'm hoping to drag him to the dyno or at a minimum make a couple of back to back runs at Sac Raceway with stock ecu / ELP ecu.
The cost for the '87-'88 Turbo is $295 + shipping.
I know they offered a group discount (10%) to the Mr2 folks, so maybe we could get something like that going here if people are interested. If so, shoot me a PM and I will compile a list.
Of course, wait for hard numbers before ordering one.
-Matt
'87 Turbo II
'93 Touring
The maps will be set up for downpipe, silencer, upgraded Y-Pipe, Trust mufflers, and intake.
We are going to throw it in "Turbo Dan's" car as well, so we will have 2 reference points. We will simply remove the FCD and swap the ECU. No other mods.... I'm hoping to drag him to the dyno or at a minimum make a couple of back to back runs at Sac Raceway with stock ecu / ELP ecu.
The cost for the '87-'88 Turbo is $295 + shipping.
I know they offered a group discount (10%) to the Mr2 folks, so maybe we could get something like that going here if people are interested. If so, shoot me a PM and I will compile a list.
Of course, wait for hard numbers before ordering one.
-Matt
'87 Turbo II
'93 Touring
04-29-02, 11:50 PM
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I'm very interested in the dyno and I'm always ready for a couple of runs. 
My car has similar mods: downpipe, midpipe, stock y-pipe and mufflers and stock intake. Should make for an interesting comparison. Might even make another sale for ELP.
Dan
My car has similar mods: downpipe, midpipe, stock y-pipe and mufflers and stock intake. Should make for an interesting comparison. Might even make another sale for ELP.
Dan
04-30-02, 06:55 AM
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Here it is
http://www.elprototypes.com/home.htm
I know everthing says Toyota but look under ECU upgrades.
Dan
http://www.elprototypes.com/home.htm
I know everthing says Toyota but look under ECU upgrades.
Dan
04-30-02, 07:28 AM
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Originally posted by Josepi
Ugh 600 for EEPROM....what a jip. All they're doing is copying onto a 50 cent chip!!
Ugh 600 for EEPROM....what a jip. All they're doing is copying onto a 50 cent chip!!
Last edited by go_speed_go; 04-30-02 at 07:30 AM.
04-30-02, 07:52 AM
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Originally posted by go_speed_go
You're paying for R & D, not a chip. However, MD does the 89-91 series for $300, so I don't understand why theirs is priced so outrageously high. NA-wise, for $600, you could buy a ITC and SAFC and still have enough left over for 2-3 hours on a dyno to tune it.
You're paying for R & D, not a chip. However, MD does the 89-91 series for $300, so I don't understand why theirs is priced so outrageously high. NA-wise, for $600, you could buy a ITC and SAFC and still have enough left over for 2-3 hours on a dyno to tune it.
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04-30-02, 09:31 AM
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Originally posted by Josepi
Ugh 600 for EEPROM....what a jip. All they're doing is copying onto a 50 cent chip!!
Ugh 600 for EEPROM....what a jip. All they're doing is copying onto a 50 cent chip!!
-Matt
04-30-02, 09:35 AM
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Originally posted by Josepi
In all likelyhood, they probably copied the majority of the info from another manufacturer, or bought rights to. If I wasn't in the states, i'd be selling copied chips for 10 bucks a piece.
In all likelyhood, they probably copied the majority of the info from another manufacturer, or bought rights to. If I wasn't in the states, i'd be selling copied chips for 10 bucks a piece.
While, I'm sure some idiots out there would buy a copied chip for 10 bucks, I sure as hell wouldn't. That guy that sells them on Ebay is a good example. You have no idea how those were programmed. Was it programmed for 93 octane? As a daily driver? Track only? etc, etc.... Good luck finding that guy when things go wrong.
-Matt
04-30-02, 09:44 AM
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Originally posted by go_speed_go
You're paying for R & D, not a chip. However, MD does the 89-91 series for $300, so I don't understand why theirs is priced so outrageously high. NA-wise, for $600, you could buy a ITC and SAFC and still have enough left over for 2-3 hours on a dyno to tune it.
You're paying for R & D, not a chip. However, MD does the 89-91 series for $300, so I don't understand why theirs is priced so outrageously high. NA-wise, for $600, you could buy a ITC and SAFC and still have enough left over for 2-3 hours on a dyno to tune it.
Have you tried to get ahold of MD? As far as I can tell, they don't return calls... I did finally get an email, although he neglected to answer most of my questions or provide a shipping address as I had requested in email.
I left a message for ELP before business hours. They called me back before 10am and talked to me for about 15 minutes answering my questions. I'm sure everyone knows this is very difficult to find in the tuner world, so I give him some points for that.
-Matt
04-30-02, 09:48 AM
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http://www.wctoyotasport.com/Parts/ELP/ecu4AGZE.htm
Here is some info on the upgrade for the Sc'ed Mr2. 18hp and 23 lbs of torque on a car that starts with only about 140hp and similar torque. This is with no changes in boost.
-Matt
Here is some info on the upgrade for the Sc'ed Mr2. 18hp and 23 lbs of torque on a car that starts with only about 140hp and similar torque. This is with no changes in boost.
-Matt
04-30-02, 09:50 AM
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And lastly, I have to request that people don't start hitting ELP with tons of phone calls and questions. Just wait until I get my ECU back and Dan and I will provide some hard numbers. If it looks promising, we will work on a group-buy.
-Matt
-Matt
04-30-02, 10:24 AM
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Originally posted by matt_ledbetter
You would still need a FCD though, which in my opinion is the worst possible band-aid ever created.
You would still need a FCD though, which in my opinion is the worst possible band-aid ever created.
If the price for the 89-91 NA and Turbo cars is indeed $300, then they'll be doing a lot of business with people who are indeed tired of constantly calling and e-mailing MD.
MD's business is a side job, not full time. He was doing it full time ~4 years ago, but was then offered a full time job in the IT world for more money than he could turn down. When you already have a full time job and a family, it's hard to spend much time doing anything else without having the job or family suffer.
I hope things do work out for the ELP for the NA and Turbo cars. The FC's have a fair amount of power waiting to be tuned into the stock ECU maps.
Last edited by go_speed_go; 04-30-02 at 10:28 AM.
04-30-02, 10:26 AM
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You still need an FCD? Yes, it is the worst thing to get. I had many probs with those in the past.
If you can find someone that can map, according to your car only...then do it.
Back in the days when ROM tuning was at the forefront, I had mine tuned at a shop in San Diego, by Hideo (he heads R&D for Trust USA). I total forgot the name of his the shop back then. He was the first to use Techtom equipment here in the US...mind you, this was over 7 years ago.
He took me though the entire process. It was too bad that the entire spectrum was in Japanese. He was willing to sell me a set, but no english version...damn.
Needed units/items
1. Emulator
2. Rom burner
3. Software
4 Eproms / add PCBs (if ness)
5. work bench w/ s.iron
(about $8K US)
I had spoke to a friend of mine that works in our Japan office. He is into the sport...like me...:@). He had told me that Techtom now has a smaller unit that replaces the emulator and burner. It hooks between your ecu and the computer. Which is done during real time tuning...damn. I want it...and again, it is completely in Japanese. F__K!
If you can find someone that can map, according to your car only...then do it.
Back in the days when ROM tuning was at the forefront, I had mine tuned at a shop in San Diego, by Hideo (he heads R&D for Trust USA). I total forgot the name of his the shop back then. He was the first to use Techtom equipment here in the US...mind you, this was over 7 years ago.
He took me though the entire process. It was too bad that the entire spectrum was in Japanese. He was willing to sell me a set, but no english version...damn.
Needed units/items
1. Emulator
2. Rom burner
3. Software
4 Eproms / add PCBs (if ness)
5. work bench w/ s.iron
(about $8K US)
I had spoke to a friend of mine that works in our Japan office. He is into the sport...like me...:@). He had told me that Techtom now has a smaller unit that replaces the emulator and burner. It hooks between your ecu and the computer. Which is done during real time tuning...damn. I want it...and again, it is completely in Japanese. F__K!
04-30-02, 10:43 AM
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Originally posted by go_speed_go
I wrote "NA-wise" meaning for the NA cars. No need for a FCD there.
If the price for the 89-91 NA and Turbo cars is indeed $300, then they'll be doing a lot of business with people who are indeed tired of constantly calling and e-mailing MD.
MD's business is a side job, not full time. He was doing it full time ~4 years ago, but was then offered a full time job in the IT world for more money than he could turn down. When you already have a full time job and a family, it's hard to spend much time doing anything else without having the job or family suffer.
I hope things do work out for the ELP for the NA and Turbo cars. The FC's have a fair amount of power waiting to be tuned into the stock ECU maps.
I wrote "NA-wise" meaning for the NA cars. No need for a FCD there.
If the price for the 89-91 NA and Turbo cars is indeed $300, then they'll be doing a lot of business with people who are indeed tired of constantly calling and e-mailing MD.
MD's business is a side job, not full time. He was doing it full time ~4 years ago, but was then offered a full time job in the IT world for more money than he could turn down. When you already have a full time job and a family, it's hard to spend much time doing anything else without having the job or family suffer.
I hope things do work out for the ELP for the NA and Turbo cars. The FC's have a fair amount of power waiting to be tuned into the stock ECU maps.
I will check the 89-92 price the next time I speak with Sergio.
-Matt
04-30-02, 10:45 AM
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Originally posted by jmseven
You still need an FCD? Yes, it is the worst thing to get. I had many probs with those in the past.
You still need an FCD? Yes, it is the worst thing to get. I had many probs with those in the past.
If you can find someone to do the Techtom upgrade local, that is the best bet. Yoshio up in Canada has done a lot of work on a Sc'ed Mr2 with good results. He did the baseline from his shop and then rides around tuning with a laptop.
-Matt
04-30-02, 11:13 AM
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Originally posted by turbo dan
I'm very interested in the dyno and I'm always ready for a couple of runs.
My car has similar mods: downpipe, midpipe, stock y-pipe and mufflers and stock intake. Should make for an interesting comparison. Might even make another sale for ELP.
Dan
I'm very interested in the dyno and I'm always ready for a couple of runs.
My car has similar mods: downpipe, midpipe, stock y-pipe and mufflers and stock intake. Should make for an interesting comparison. Might even make another sale for ELP.
Dan
Personally, I think the stock mufflers and y-pipe are almost as restrictive as the cat. I bet you would pick up at least 20hp.
-Matt
04-30-02, 11:45 AM
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I have the E.L. Prototypes ECU upgrade in my car and can honestly say that I could really feel a difference. Don't have any hard dyno or 1/4 mile numbers, but the car felt much more responsive and a bit torqueier as well. After switching back to the stock ecu for comparison, it becomes very apparent how much a difference the remapped ecu makes.
04-30-02, 11:50 AM
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Originally posted by Chance
I have the E.L. Prototypes ECU upgrade in my car and can honestly say that I could really feel a difference. Don't have any hard dyno or 1/4 mile numbers, but the car felt much more responsive and a bit torqueier as well. After switching back to the stock ecu for comparison, it becomes very apparent how much a difference the remapped ecu makes.
I have the E.L. Prototypes ECU upgrade in my car and can honestly say that I could really feel a difference. Don't have any hard dyno or 1/4 mile numbers, but the car felt much more responsive and a bit torqueier as well. After switching back to the stock ecu for comparison, it becomes very apparent how much a difference the remapped ecu makes.
-Matt
04-30-02, 01:06 PM
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corksport recommends them for ecu upgrades i was gonna have them do my 89 TII but i found a panspeed light sport tuned ecu and its basically amazing! the car GREAT. i run the car hard slo i keep going through a set of spark plugs a month! i guess 15psi is hard on the plugs 
i was gonna have them do my 89 TII but i found a panspeed light sport tuned ecu and its basically amazing! the car GREAT. i run the car hard slo i keep going through a set of spark plugs a month! i guess 15psi is hard on the plugs
05-01-02, 08:41 PM
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Good news... I just got a call from EL Prototypes and my ECU is on the way. I should have it by noon tomorrow, so I'll post some initial results early afternoon.
Check back if you are interested...
-Matt
Check back if you are interested...
-Matt
05-02-02, 12:19 PM
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Initial Results...
UPS showed up at 9am, so I threw the ecu back in and took it for a spin.
Just to refresh:
The ecu is configured for full exhaust and intake. I didn't install anything yet, so I can give people running around stock an idea on what it would do as well. I do currently have the downpipe in, but everything else is still in my garage. Stock cat, Y-pipe, mufflers. and intake are on the car.
A sticker on the ecu says it is tuned for 16psi, although I wouldn't run it without some fuel mods.
Fires up as normal and idles as normal. Idle is rock solid between 750 and 800.
On throttle it is VERY obvious that something has been done. I rolled away from a stop sign, punched it, and spun the tires all the way to 7 grand. Not the quickest way across the intersection, but it shows the difference. From a roll, it would not break the tires loose before the upgrade.
It feels quite a bit stronger below 6 grand and a little stronger above that point. I wouldn't be shocked if it takes almost a second off the 1/4 mile time. I'm guessing it adds 20hp peak, but the power band is improved greatly so it feels like more.
This afternoon I will add the MazdaTrix presilencer, Y-pipe, and a pair of Trust mufflers. I'll report back then...
Dan and I will be making runs at the track, on the dyno, or both and comparing stock vs ELP ecu. He has recently made a couple of 15.1 runs, so we will have a good baseline.
-Matt
'93 Touring
'87 Turbo II
Just to refresh:
The ecu is configured for full exhaust and intake. I didn't install anything yet, so I can give people running around stock an idea on what it would do as well. I do currently have the downpipe in, but everything else is still in my garage. Stock cat, Y-pipe, mufflers. and intake are on the car.
A sticker on the ecu says it is tuned for 16psi, although I wouldn't run it without some fuel mods.
Fires up as normal and idles as normal. Idle is rock solid between 750 and 800.
On throttle it is VERY obvious that something has been done. I rolled away from a stop sign, punched it, and spun the tires all the way to 7 grand. Not the quickest way across the intersection, but it shows the difference. From a roll, it would not break the tires loose before the upgrade.
It feels quite a bit stronger below 6 grand and a little stronger above that point. I wouldn't be shocked if it takes almost a second off the 1/4 mile time. I'm guessing it adds 20hp peak, but the power band is improved greatly so it feels like more.
This afternoon I will add the MazdaTrix presilencer, Y-pipe, and a pair of Trust mufflers. I'll report back then...
Dan and I will be making runs at the track, on the dyno, or both and comparing stock vs ELP ecu. He has recently made a couple of 15.1 runs, so we will have a good baseline.
-Matt
'93 Touring
'87 Turbo II
05-02-02, 01:05 PM
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Yes Yes, as am I. Hopefully it turns out. It's nice to see another company doing good work on RX-7's ECU's other than MD Racing.... who don't seem to like us much anymore 