Made a mistake...you can increase values in WARI using the PG UP and PG DN keys...however, these shortcuts are all set in stone, where AEMTuner allows you to customize/add/delete hot-keys.

Am I kidding my self? I newer once said adaptronic is better or more powerful unit than the aem,
i also did not compare it to series 2, I can only comment on what I have used not what I hear
or read on forums, just like the thread started about pros and cons that's what I posted,

I did not change my mind for the decision I made, aem or pro efi was over my budget for this car, so was 1350 for the 440 universal with 2 meter loom i got, like I said for me was a great bang for the buck, or best bang for the budget I was in, now for my other projects like my lotuses or my twin turbo pte6262cea fd I am looking at aem, pro efi, or 1280 adaptronic,
how ever ecu's are the last Item I buy for the projects I work on, made that mistake with microwreck when I ordered long before my project was finished.
how ever I wish both adaptronic and fb great sales and success with their offers

Nothing I say is meant as a personal attack...it just isn't something I do. When I say "you are kidding yourself" and don't quote someone specifically, "you" means the reader in general, whoever that may be. Sorry if I offended you in some way.

In a perfect world, threads like these would only focus on the facts, wouldn't compare apples to oranges, and wouldn't turn into pissing matches littered with personal attacks.

EDIT: Also wanted to say that I'm not endorsing either product. I am really on the fence between the two and think the AEM is a great/proven ecu, while the Adaptronic has a lot of great features and will continually get better as it is developed.

Then what do you call these statements below?

We are comparing it to the Series II. Why did you comment on the series I when it is not relevant to the conversation?

The price difference between the the adaptronic and the Series II PnP kit is $100. the Series II is basically the e1280s for the price of the Select ecu. You cant tell me it is a better bang for the buck.

FWIW, I have already expressed to tony that I mean no personal harm to him nor do I take anything he says personally. We are just having a friendly discussion.

EB Turbo

I was incorrect. You do have the ability to set a MAX load value. This will make it so you do not loose any total resolution. You still do not have the ability to have set the load breakpoints as you need them.

EB Turbo

[QUOTE=EB Turbo;11455954]Honestly AEM Sales could care less about the RX7 application. They sell more Honda ecus in one month then they did the entire RX7 line. That is why there is no PnP FD ECU. If you go and add up all of the Honda, Nissan, Mitsubishi, Subaru, and Toyota sales it is way more than any of those other ECU companies could ever hope for. The new generation of AEM ECU will be the best in the market only rivaled by MoTeC M1 line, Pectel, and a few other one off EMS companies. and it will be done at almost half of the cost of the other ECUs.

How am I bashing the Adaptronic ECU. All I am doing is stating the fact that adaptronic and its customers claim "We offer the highest performance, most powerful ECUs in their price range.". This so far off it is not even funny. I think you just need to admit to yourself you could have had a Ferrari for your Honda price tag.



I find this amusing.. the problem as you have clearly stated is aem dont care nearly as much about their rotary customers as adaptronic do.. its pretty clear from their sales and attitude towards them you mention above. I commend you on your efforts in flying the flag for aem and the support you provide for customers however it is poor business practice to attempt to critique your opposition particularly going as far as offending andy in his own subforum section. No question the aem series 2 is a great product.. however the aem series 1 wasnt really so good perhaps thats the reason why others have opted to go another route.
Either way I went for the 440 select ecu.. do I regret it having read about the series 2.. not 1 bit. I have never had better service from a company and I know that I will continue to with andy being a rotary fan pushing development forward for us as quickly as its requested. Its simplified setup along with its tuning modes are what sold it for me along with most importantly the passion behind the product through support and listening to their customers and going to great extents to ensuring any issues are sorted(which are typically few and far between) personally. I encourage anyone who has an adaptronic to stick with it.. its the beginning of something big and 1 of the best ecus for the rotor community period.

The sad thing is as much as you sit there and bang on about how your not doing anything to bash adaptronic.. you obviously are.. you simply cant accept that forum members are buying his product over yours.. well tough buddy. Move on. Return to your support role for aem. The way you attacked Tony for his purchase was shameful he is happy with his purchase he explained why and you shot him down for it.

And as for your previous comment about why andy hasnt chimed in.. its because unlike you he wouldnt go to such poor levels as to attempt to improve sales.. he does it on the back of hardwork, honesty and integrity.

Its clear to everyone why you started this thread you will say to educate people but the sole purpose was to degrade other products and the fellow members who bought them. I agree with Tony Unprofessional indeed.

Applications dont mean a whole lot to AEM and their ECU. They all use the same inputs, outputs and software. Usually issues with the system are not application specific. Almost everything works flawlessly. The system does not need updates weekly to make it better. AEM does not sell to FD owners because they do not see enbough sales to justify the work involved. However their ecu that is not FD supported still works everything the FD needs.

I agree some of my practices are a little less than professional. I am very passionate about what I do. I want the truth to be out in the open. I do not want to see people mislead from bandwagons. not to say anything specific about any products but the FD community has an issue with bandwagons.

I think this is where you are wrong. The Series I and the Series II are very similar. The issue with the Series I was the lack of tuners ability. The Series I is a very complicated ecu compared to the PFC and equivalents of its time. It was way over most peoples heads and was deemed too complicated. It was difficult for me at first. Once I was able to grasp the concepts, apply logic and math I realized that in its class nothing could compete. Now the Series II is just an evolution of the Series I and the new features make an even better choice. I would even say the latest firmware version of the series I is a better choice than the Adaptronic.

I can understand that support is a big factor when making a decision on an ECU selection. In this comparison, Adaptronic v AEM, the support is only worth so much. AEM has am immense amount of support, here, on their site, through their tech line and even the help file. Once you look at the features and capability you can see that the Adaptronic is far less capable than the AEM equivalent.


in a market of less than 5 quality PnP ecus, yes it is one of the better ones. The AEM is above it, hands down.

I have said this before that I do not care what the sales are for the AEM are. People will buy what they want. I just want people to be informed before they make a purchase. If people are buying Adaptronics because Andy is on here then more power to them. If people want to buy something that is way more capable than almost everything else in the market then that is what they will buy.

Whatever his reason it I am fine with it. I think that I have proved enough times that the AEM is a better choice. If Andy feels he can keep his sales up without addressing these issues that is up to him. I believe in the time that I have been posting that he may have sold more select ecus than AEM FD ecus. If this really is the case why would he be concerned?

I am clearly stating what the features are between the certain ECUs. If certain ECUs clearly stand out over the others it is not my fault for saying so. Someone has to. In no way have I gone out of my way to degrade anyone who has purchased an adaptronic ECU. I have no malice towards any individuals on here. I even stated it to Tony in a PM. If someone comes on here trying to defend the Adaptronic or whatever they have I will give my 2cents. So far no one has been able to come on here and prove to me that the any other ecu on here has more ability in this price range.

If you feel like what you have is better I am more than willing to debate it with you. If you do not I wish you the best of luck. There are members on here that will confirm, as much as I down talk the Adaptronic I still give support for it. You would be suprised how much logic you can take from other ECUs to make the adaptronic work.

EB Turbo

So the AEM v2 can control the entire twin turbo system? I was under the impression that it wasn't able to.

You also mentioned that it was plug and play? I'm interested. I have two tuner friends and one dislikes the AEM, the other says he likes the S1 over the S2. Also mentioned something about timing walk on certain other brands of ECUs outside of AEM v1 and the PFC. So you have any idea why a preference might be made for the v1 over the v2? I do like the flex fuel update though.

The big attraction for me to the Adpatronic is the plug-and play factor - and I'm no ECU expert but I became to feel the squeeze of certain limitations that seemed pretty much like having to make constant tradeoffs. Their higher end ECU seems like what I should be purchasing, but the install time is something I can hardly afford on a DD with school quickly approaching. So look like it's the Adaptronic Select which I'm becoming more leery of (unfortunate because I already purchased the boost controller for it) but the OMP and twins I guess make it overly complicated. So I just sold my PFC and am now getting cold feet and exploring my options. My tuner I'm sure will tell me Haltech, but looking to learn a bit more about my options and AEM units are definitely something I'm exploring before I go find another Power FC.

What are you leery of?

Yes, It does full sequential turbo control, with all of the emissions devices and still has outputs to spare.

The Series 2 ECU is a evolution of the Series I. All of the workings are the same just in a different layout. Plus you get a lot of updates. So, for someone to prefer the Series I over the Series 2 is kind of odd.

When using the Adaptronic and sequential turbos I do not believe you have any extra outputs. Turblown can confirm this.

The AEM however can use OMP, Full sequential turbo control, A/C control, emissions controls and still have 4 0-5v inputs, 2 spare sw inputs, spare injector drivers, spare coil drivers, spare low side outputs, Flex Fuel... The basic AEM PnP kit is just the beginning.

Comparing the Series II AEM and the Adaptronic Select pnp, both have features that make each one appealing. IMO the features and the capability of the AEM are far superior to that of the adaptronic. Once you get into the tuning process and you learn the workings of the ecu and the control strategy is when you really see the major differences in the ECUs. That is where it really counts. Listing I/Os on paper really don't mean much in the grand scheme of things.

EB Turbo

To bad there isn't a plug and play to controll full emissions on a 1988 Turbo Rx7. Beginning to think i will have to build my own.

Anything is possible. You just need to talk to the right people. Plus the market for S4 Turbo IIs is very small.

EB Turbo

Series 4 Adaptronic Plug and Play will be out by the end of this month.

I thought it will not control emissions. It does not control all of the relays but regardless if it controls the acv and passes emissions then awesome.

Also if we can move some of the output pins even better.

It is very unlikely that a manufacturer of standalone engine management is going to dedicate the resources to make a PNP for something like an RX7 do to the small size of the market.
But if you are really interested in building your own and want a truly configurable platform look at megasquirt. The new MSIII has bunches of outputs and you have access to the firmware to configure it however you want. And the you would have the full support of the whole community!

Ian: Yes, that's correct. I don't know how likely it is to pass an actual emission test without driving all those functions but then the physical emissions tests vary a lot from state to state and country to country. Especially since you can put on a Euro 4 cat and run it on E85 these days, which weren't available in 1988.

Vicoor: completely correct, but it's not that the rotary market is so small, it's that the part of the market that cares about having all the factory emissions controls working is so small. You could use the 1280 and then implement any functions that you wanted to in the logic; you can implement any tables, timers, PID controllers, logic etc. I can't comment on the MS but having access to the firmware obviously gives you complete control!

They have been selling quite well actually. Especially with the new firmware release coming soon with all the advanced engine protection features. Its simply light years ahead of anything else for the S4 T2 cars...

pfc is a piece of junk?
 

Dear friend i'm just wondering about your phrase that go from one piece of junk(PFC) to the Adaptronic without actually looking at what they were buying.
Well please can you answer me this easy question?
If PFC its a piece of Junk, then why the 70% of the people in United States and about 80% of people in Japan still using this "piece of junk" in their rotary cars?
Are they "stupid or something" if there are so much better ECU units like the above you mention?
Thanks

So you are telling me if a lot of people own something, that makes it a good product? What is common in the market place is not always the best product available.

If you want to change injectors in your PFC how easy is it?

If you want to change a MAP sensor how easy is it?

If you want to run E85 how easy is it?

How comprehensive is the boost control?

Does your standard data cable allow you to change all of the parameters in the ECU?

Can you change to different and better sensors, Knock, Air temp,....

Can it take a wideband input and make corrections from it?

The PFC works well for what it was designed for. The PFC has been outdated hardware for a long time. You cant argue that.

EB Turbo

I agree in all of the above you said. And in your last phrase i dont arque at all. But exactly in that point of what you said "The PFC works well for what it was designed for" this is i believe the most important reason that so many people have it. And this is why its the most reliable unit in the market, not just now, but from lot of years before and it will remain for a lot years coming. Japanese high quality. And what its the most important thing in our cars? Reliability! And what its the most important thing according reliability on our rotary engines? Ecu and not a failure of it while driving. I know a lot of series 6-7-8 that all of them have PFC ECU. No one of those ever brake beacause of the ecu failure. You cant arque with that either.

So if you have an RX7 with stock injectors, sensors, coils the PfC isnt all that bad. How many people on here are still running stock injectors, sensors and coils? How many people want to change things like fuel type, injectors, coils, map sensors, IAT sensors, Turbos, widebands, egt sensors, fuel pressure, oil pressure, oil temp,.... the Pfc cant really do that.

Show me on here of an engine failure due to ECU failure...

EB Turbo

Actually, I think the PFC is one of the most common EMS platforms to go bad, well at least it is here in Hawaii.... must have something to do with all the grass huts..

I am

I don't, with the possible exception of wideband.

I'm in the market for a new ECU (current one is stock) and it would be good to hear pros/cons from users, not vendors.

All very confusing to say the least...

Check out the individual ecu forum sections to hear from the owners.

You should also have a read through this;

Adaptronic Engine Management Systems | TurboSource