So mr slide alliance, how many licks does it take to get the center of a tootsie pop? Oh, wrong question.... I mean, you're on stock knuckles still?

Hmm.

Best way to cut?

I was thinking mark both bolt hole centers, draw a line between them and then draw a 90* line, mark the line on the ball joint bracket and hack there. Free mod and impossible to fuck up unless you're a retard. Plus, there's no need to take the hub assy apart.

I want to see how your set holds up first. That seems like a high stress area (vs the tie rod end pivot point of the knuckle) and iirc the ball joint bracket is cast.

I am CHEAP. CHEEEEEEAAAAAP so if this works out for you, i'm totally going to say "yeah, i ripped that off of that guy."

You know, i've only heard "you dont need more angle" shit talk on here. Never on the 240 forums, not on my local drift forum....just on here. Makes sense though because hachi drivers are n/a, alot are making under 180whp and have mad angle.



You're right adam. That is a shitty paint drawing! That does make alot of sense. I still think that's going to feel weird as shit with a stock power rack on the street.

80* Fuck.

i looked at my lower arms tonight and have NO clue.. what part your cutting/extending to make htat extra piece??


on mine... the hub just sits on a joint thats on the LCA itself... theres no bit with two holes etc..?

You have a S5 arm with the built in ball joint. Switch to a S4 with a bolt on joint.

well keep us informed dude.. im looking to do the very same thing. In themean time im getting a shopping list together of suspension/steering goodies i need..

can anyone add to my list as i have to import it all from the states or japan.. no one in th UK does it, so i look to order it all at once..

i own:
coilovers
Uras rods
mazdatrix angle kit
JTP knuckles
Polybushed front lower arms

My shopping list:
Rear camber bar (like this: http://www.awrracing.com/store/produ...roducts_id=475 but may not that exact one)
lower arem rear bush maybe?: http://www.rhdjapan.com/jdm-low/Supe...C3S-RX-7-51440
rear camber adjuster thingies: http://www.rhdjapan.com/jdm-low/Supe...C3S-RX-7-50168


im struggling to find ANYTHING for the front.. obviously most is done through the coilovers.

I guess you need to machine the arms for those Supernow bearings? I would just get the AWR arms which have bearings on the front and rear mount and they are S4 arms. It would cost you more up front but at least you won't have a bushing and bearing on the same suspension component.

http://www.awrracing.com/store/produ...products_id=35

Also I'm assuming you are still on stock rear trailing arm bushings?

i dont think you do.. but perhaps. The arms are S4 but im not conviced by what improvement you get with those bushings etc.. especially as ill have to get them shipped to the uk which is even MORE cost.

rear trailing arm? might be called something differnt in the uk? or i could just be dumb lol

Buy a hack saw, there's like 4 feet of threads on those things.

see if you can just have someone machine you some inner spacers identical to some angle kits, and just retain the stock tie rod

I have the tie rods you need, same length as stock with maximum rack spacing possible, the FCs are $100 shipped

With his setup, if he were to just slap this shit together as is, he'd most likely have a bit too much toe in up front. Has nothing to do with max rack movement.

I had a similar problem (using your tie rods mind you.....not bagging on them, just saying) and it involved camber. When you tilt the top of the knuckle in, it pushes the tie rod end pickup point further away from the rack. I think i'm at roughly 3.5* give or take. Possibly more. It's pretty noticeable from outside the car. I had to add 2 washers per side (about 5/8") to have proper toe adjustment.

He's doing the same thing, pushing the pickup point further away from the rack. Has nothing to do with lock to lock as much as it does toe with the wheels being straight on.

Perhaps I am missing something but...


Toe-in has nothing to do with my tie rods, based on his question, they are the same length as OEM, therefore your alignment adjustment with the tie rod/ends would be the same.... Not sure what you are really getting at here, or what your setup is, obviously you are not using them as intended, sounds like you tried to space the rack out more by adding more shit like Slide Alliance... The only way to get more angle out of an FC using my tie rods is custom knuckles.

IDK it sounds like there are a number of details missing here!?!?

*sigh*....


It doesn't.

GO BACK A FEW PAGES AND LOOK AT THE COMPARISON BETWEEN EYE CANDY's RODS AND STOCK.

What gives you more angle is using a tie rod or spacer that allows the rack to move maximum distance side to side.

That's what "angle kits" and "angle tie rods" do.


Adding more spacers to that after you have MAXIMUM RACK MOVEMENT is the same as running a longer tie rod (threaded portion that is). It allows MORE TOE ADJUSTMENT AT THIS POINT. YOU WONT GET ANY MORE ANGLE BY ADDING MORE SPACERS SIMPLY BECAUSE YOU"VE ALREADY MAXED OUT RACK MOVEMENT!


Daniel, i didn't have any issues with your product. I'm running retarded camber with short-ish tie rod ends. I lined them up with stock. With zero camber, everything would have been fine. Since i'm at max camber (can go no lower and there's no more adjustment room on my upper mounts, i had to space the rack to make up for toe in that was impossible to dial out without risking stripping my tie rod ends.... Thats where spacing the rack roughly a full inch came in.



I've been trying to explain this for a while now. Nobody can seem to get it.

I've made this as clear as i possibly could. I suck at paint but aparently i suck at explaining shit too.

SlideAlliance, is your steering rack powered? You may have mentioned somewhere, sorry if i missed it.

I had a problem with my jc where although the rack had an extra 14mm of movement if i spaced out the rod ends (effectively moving the rack's 'bump stop' out) - i'd leak powersteering fluid if i tried to go anywhere near that far. I didn't notice the leak until i tried this on a car with a running engine.

Also my rack maxed out (ran out of teeth inside the rack i guess) at 14mm, i'm not sure what length you're at now with all the rack spacer's.

I think i've seen an R32 run well over 10mm of extra movement and had no problems with fluid leaks, so FC's may be fine.
Also what NoPistons! is saying makes sense, i think some others may be mis-understanding him.

1st event in new car yesterday.


JTP KNUCKLES ARE AMAZING.


Car had more angle than I could use and the deeper angle mixed with quicker steering= so much fun.

I loveeeee my FC!

pics or fail !

gangsta

*head explodes*

Very well put! I get questions all the time about them, and it seems there is only but a few that actually understand what is going on...

They do that because they are stupid and do not understand, lol. But yea, depending on how much spacing you added you are limiting your thread engagement to the rack, and you are no where near maximizing the rack.

A friend of mine did, red vert FC with a cage and gold GT-Cs, Socal. He ran the Mazdatrix bolt on spacers + washers. Bad idea. Over extended the rack and blew out the seals.

On the thread engagement, I am talking about the threading of the tie rod into the steering rack, adding spacers will decrease this, and doing so will only cause a failure of the threads ripping out of the steering rack. Plus you can over extend the rack past the seals, and fluid will be blowing by.

Good point, I would not say he blew out the seals, but rather blew past the seals, either way it is not good, it reduces the lubrication, ps fluid level, and over heats the ps fluid. If only end users would leave it to the pros and not take it upon themselves.....

*head explodes twice*

im with the exploding crowd.

all i know is..

- i have uras rods, mazdatrix angle kit and JTP knuckles.. and i get rubbing everywhere..
- My steering is harder to return once on full lock
- left lock to right lock is slower i think?
- my steering makes fuuuuuny noises when i move it at all.. but the power steering fluid level is fine...


no idea where to start to sort it lol.

so how exactly is everyone getting jtp knuckles.. they sound too awesome not to have.

sounds like your rack is going bad..
- My steering is harder to return once on full lock
- my steering makes fuuuuuny noises when i move it at all.. but the power steering fluid level is fine...

you'll need to add more camber and space out to get rid of the rubbing.. .also take the uras rods off and just use stock rods.


i can bring a set up to seattle formula d if you're interested.. anyone else just pm me to set up getting a set.

do you know when you'll be here? being with burgenholtz you'll probably be stopping by the shop when your here anyway.. just bring your jig ;)

of the people who have tig welded these, what kind of process did you use... pre-heat? post-heat? butt joint? what kind of fill rod and etc...?

also does anyone know FOR SURE what kind of metal this is. i know that its forged steel, but what kind of steel is important.

thanks

This is my favorite thread - everyone is fun. :)

Lots of good info in this thread

Just finished reading all thread, very good info here :icon_tup: Old thread, but I'll better ask here than create a new one.
What's the general consensus of what length to cut away from the spindle while using stock fenders? Someone on this thread mentioned cutting away 15mm, others a bit more. I have a local welder who's done many s13 spindles so he can do that for me since I am from Europe and shipping spindles for someone to do in the US is not very reasonable price wise. I will have Abercrombie tie rod ends, inner spacers and also will extend my lca ball joint while having 8.5j R17 front wheels under stock fenders.

Anyone? I just don't want to cut away too much and I guess many people on here have done their knuckles.

im not quite sure what having stock fenders have to do with cutting your spindles? steering angle doesnt have much to do with fender clearance.

wheel width/offset, spacers, lca length, camber, tire size, ride height, will all affect fender clearance, but not steering angle.

cut 15 to 20mm. weld see how they work. if they suck get another set then cut it different. idk. I would just pay some dude to ship you some.

I can get it done for 50-100 bucks or so in here, if I will ship it to US it will cost much more for only shipping back and forth so I will take a chance to mess up a set of knuckles if needed.

Thanks for info, I will try something in the lines of 15-20mm.

custom setup
 

Hey everyone, it's been a while.

In the time that I last posted on the site (or even lurked) I have installed custom lengthened balljoints on S4 LCAs as well as lengthened inner tie rods to match. Balljoints are 2 1/4" longer than stock. Everything was aligned recently and the car has been great even on daily driver duties for about a week now.

Only problem is that I find that the steering over centers when I'm making U turns or generally giving the steering wheel the business. Only about the last 1/4 turn of the wheel causes this. No rack spacers, stock rack and outer tie rods.

Have I just gone too wide or what?

If so, no big deal. I'll just get new stock parts and cut and TIG them up but shorter. I'd rather not have to though.

well you have 2.25" extended ball joints, they dont need to be that long...

some heim joint rod ends would help maybe

I'm aware that they don't have to be that long, but I'm wondering why I am overcentering now. How would rod ends help the issue?

I don't think I really have THAT much angle at this point... I mean I've definitely seen purpose built cars with more for sure. Do I need to look at repositioning my rack or something? It seems S chassis have the overcentering issue and that rack spacers help fix it. I know their racks are in front of the axle whereas the FC has the rack behind.
Maybe caster plays a part as well?
I may need to check ackerman at this point too.

So according to RcTek - Radio Controlled Model Car Handling - The Ackerman Steering Principle
and considering my setup (widened track and angle modded knuckles) I believe I have less ackerman simply because of lengthened arms, also because of the way my knuckles were modified.
maybe this plus a low caster number are causing the issue?
Could really use some advice from someone with experience on this.

did you even work on your car bro? your rack is in the front.

It's obviously a typo.
I just told you all I custom fabricated my own front end parts.
But hey of you're stuck on trying to call people out for being morons because of silly typos... then by all means, captain.

i have never been a fan of lengthened ball joints. over 2.000" is just too much in my opinion.

lengthening the balljoint 2.000" is going to change the geometry of the suspension and possibly make it drive funny.

i have been considering lengthening my ball joint or making a new LCA, i have a couple ideas, but either way it would only be .500" just enough so my tire doesnt rub when at full lock,




Attachment 623020

anyone know who makes angle kits for these cars (FC3S) anymore ? besides PBM

can't get ahold of abercrombie (really wanted his kit heard great things about it)

hotline racing/ jtp doesn't do knuckles anymore just emailed him.

only person i found left is teals suspension and haven't heard of anyone using them of how much angle they are getting. is that kit just bunk ?

don't mean to bump an old thread but don't want to start a new one

Have you checked with Mazdatrix/Kyle Mohan, he has knuckles listed from time to time on ebay.

i have not, i will look into that i contacted teals and the kit is very decently priced and is able to hit 65 degrees of angle with 4 degrees of spread. He also has replacement parts on hand like extended ball joints s13 tie rods etc. looking for the most angle with less than 6 degrees of spread at full lock abercrombies kit hit 72 degrees at 4 degrees spread, really want that kit :( but i guess anything is better than stock lock what ever that is, like 35 sum idk.

it would be great if someone is willing to share their experience with teals !! already read the thread on it not really helpful just bickering https://www.rx7club.com/drifting-226...stuff-1085716/

thanks, nick

If you have only stock lock right now going to threaded inner tie rods feels like a world of difference and that only gets you to around 45* of lock.

id rather just jump to the 65 degrees, less $$$ in the long run

thank you though:icon_tup: