I'm happy to announce that I will now be offering nitride hardening on resurfaced irons. Please pm me in regards to pricing. Here's a pic of one of my resurfaced irons. According to the research I've done, a iron that is resurfaced but not hardened will still last approx. 100,000 kms. Therefore many will not deem the hardening necessary. I am offering it because people have asked a lot about it and if you have an expensive porting job done it is well worth the extra money.

Thank you

Brent.

 

so, they will look like THAT for 100,000km? then begin to wear out?
how long will a hardened one last for?

 

No, after a 100,000kms you would need another rebuild because the irons will be worn out. They wear over .006 dp generally and you lose compression. When there hardened they last as long as a new set.

Brent

 

what RMS is the surface lapped to after the nitriding? What is your tolerance on the surface itself after lapping?

 

Couldn't tell you what the rms is. Don't even know what that is. In Tool and Die surface finish is measured in microinches with a digital surface indicator. I don't lap them I grind them on a surface grinder. It gives a smooth enough finish. 7-9 Rq maybe even a little lower. Come check some out some time. There flat right down to .0001". That's as small a measurement as my equipment is capable of.

Brent

 

Wow. A .0001" runout is really difficult to achieve, on any machinery. What finish measurement do you get in Ra on your profilometer?

 

bet its a blanchard....................


also, what tool company do you work for?

 

Even on a Blanchard one tenthousandth of an inch of runout is EXTREMELY difficult to acheive.

 

It's not a blanchard. It's just a really new hydraulic wet grinder and I ground the table, dressed the sides and bottom of the wheel and balanced it before grinding them. You'd be amazed what you can do with some equipment and patience. I work for a Magna Plant in Bradford. We build latches and window rails not to mention a bunch of other automotive parts. Never bothered to check it for Ra. Not to sound arrogant but after 10yrs in the trade I don't need a meter to tell me what's a good enough finish. If your really interested in getting it done you'll just have to come see them for yourself. All very good questions though. Keep em comin.

Brent

 

I'm just asking questions because I like to talk shop with other machinists. Where I work we do all kinds of machining. From face milling, to CNC machining of valve bridges, even exhaust manifolds for cummins. We just use Ra as a finish measurement standard. I'm not sure what the differences between Ra and Rn are, but I was just curious.

 

Ra; heights of 4 peaks and valleys measured at a specified interval , then
you add them up and divide them by the number of divisions.

Rq; the square root of all the same #'s squared then divided by the number of
divisions just like the equation for Ra. According to my books Rq is the
better method for determining surface roughness because it emphasizes
extreme deviations.

Sorry if it's a bit unclear. It's the best way I know of explaining it.

 

Oh okay, thanks, that's really cool. Mostly for us, we just need an average roughness test, so clearly Ra is the better way for us to do it. I'll have to remember that though, thanks Brent.

 

I like the way this thread turned. Actually got me thinking and checking stuff in my old text book. It's good to brush up on stuff sometimes. We very rarely check surface finishes in die work. Generally only on some parts that require a class 1 finish, and it's generally checked by QA. I'm usually to busy with dies and only get involved in the QA end of things when there's a problem.(which come to think of it is fairly often, it's just usually dimensional issues.) Sounds like you get to do some neat stuff. I used to work on a lot of interesting stuff but now I'm semi retired.LOL. That's what I like to call die maintenance. Used to build everything from automation and cycle test fixture's to large progressive dies and prototypes.


Brent

 

I must say that looks very good.

 

Thanks. If anyone wants any irons done I'll be sending out a shipment for hardening within 2to3 wks at the latest. So if you get them done at this time I can offer a discount if I can get enough together.

Brent

 

Not having the funds now to send you my stuff but I do have a few sets of sideplates that need to be finished eventually. Not to mention the housings I have that eventually I would like RPM to get them JHB'd (they all need to be ported first)

Also, really the reason I'm posting is that I did not realize you get them hardened. What is this process?

Ian

 

... which poses another question:

To what depth (vs. that of the Mazda factory hardening process) does your hardening process go? This is critical required info because in theory, if the aftermarket process only goes half as deep as the factory process the plates will only last half as long.

As for surface-grinding, it has been almost twenty years since I've used a surface grinder. But the process really does leave a mirror-smooth finish, at least as much so as the factory lapping process (in which you can see the pattern made by the mill). I like this surface-grinding idea.

 

Yes, surface grinding can be performed within 0.0005" if the grinder is skilled on it.

 

Yes the hardening goes to the same depth as the factory, it's the exact same process. Iron nitriding hardens .006" deep I checked this with my heat treater. Also the finish is better than that of the factory. I wouldn't call it a mirror finish, however it's pretty close. Maybe Joe from RPM will chime in, he recently picked up his first set from me.

Brent
BSC Fab and Custom

 

this sounds very promising. i've been wondering where to go to get used irons redone and when the time comes it's good to know i have this option that is fairly local (within same province).
keep us updated on any new developments and customer feedback.

thanks

 

Ian - The housings wouldn't have to be ported first, that can be done after I get them back from JHB.
If you haven't seen them yet, I got a pair from JHB already and more coming this week.





I sent a set of badly worn out 12A irons to Brent to get resurfaced and hardened. They turned out great.
I already sent another set of Full bridge ported 13B RE irons to him to get the same treatment.



I'm planning on sending him my 13B RE irons too from my motor to get resurfaced and hardened. I'll be using the JHB Ceremt B housings and JHB's Thermal Coated S5 T2 rotors in my motor this year.
I'll let everyone know how all these internal mods stand up to all the abuse when I tear the motor apart next winter!

 

Thanks for the feedback Joe. And nice plug.LOL.

Brent
BSC

 

No problem Brent, any irons that need resurfacing, I'll be sending them your way.

 

I'm guessing those pics of the irons you have RPM are resurfaced, but not renitrided, right? They look dull compared to the nitrided pics brent posted.

Jon

 

What are the prices for all this? Resurfacing side housings and recoating them