Azriel_Strife

iTrader: (5)

Bought a powerFC from him for $520, It was described and shown in photos as being in perfect shape, it arrived in a timely manner, good comms, ect. No issues with him as a seller.

Sales thread HERE: https://www.rx7club.com/3rd-generation-rx-7-1993-2002-parts-99/power-fc-computer-550%24-shipped-899951/

The problem is that it was packaged in a crappy USPS bubble wrap envelope. I requested USPS to avoid retarded brokerage fee's. I've had items like my IC damaged by UPS, so they don't have a good record with me. Anyway, I payed him for the item, and a day or so later I got a PM stating that it had been sent out with a customs number.

I received my item on friday last week, I saw the paper USPS bubble wrap bag and knew it was bad news, opened it, and not to my surprise it had be crushed somehow, and the plastic that the harness plugs into was broken. It still seems to work fine, however the harness now needs to be held in with tape, and if I was to try and resell the computer I would never get close to $500 because it is broken.

Even this isn't the issue though, to make a long story short, he didn't insure the PFC. So it arrived broken, and now he is refusing to give me a partial refund, even though I had no control over how he shipped it. The deal was $520USD shipped. his reason was "it was expensive to insure it, so I didn't think it was worth it."

Very annoyed, I hope he makes good on this deal, but as it is now, it looks like I got screwed. I have opened a dispute with paypal, this is what he said so far.


From Buyer - Azriel_Strife

Hey, I received my item on friday. It was crushed during shipping and the plastic inputs where the harness goes are damaged. I need you to contact me so I can show you the damage, I know it wasn't damaged when you sen it because of the pics in the thread.

The only issue I have is that you decided not to insure a computer valued at $700. I don't want to return the item since it works well, but I would like a partial refund as I payed for a unit in good condition, and did not receive one.

If I was to try and resell this I would not be able to get even close to what I payed for it. So I am requesting a refund of $200, you should be able to claim some of that $200 back from USPS because they damaged the package.

thanks.

shawn edginton denied Dale Broeckx's request for a $200.00 USD refund.

5/15/2010 20:38 PDT

From Seller - stevensimon

5/15/2010 20:38 PDT

i have never had good luck with usps thats why i wanted to go ups. you requested usps, they damaged it. i shipped a good working unit the way you requested. id like to work this out but i dont feel this is fair since i followed your request.

From Buyer - Azriel_Strife

5/16/2010 00:08 PDT

You didn't insure the unit. I would have payed the extra for insurance but you never asked, you just shipped it "you didn't think it was worth it" You don't just pop a $700 piece of computer equipment in a bag and hope it makes it ok. Especially since it only had 1 layer of bubble wrap to keep it safe. You essentially took my property and sent it through the mail with no insurance. Now I'm left with a computer that has no resale value, and I payed the going rate for it.

I want this to be settled fairly, I MAY be able to sell that ECU how it is for $300, but no way could i get 500 for it. you said 520 USD shipped. With an item that expensive, you ALWAYS insure it.

fredox19

iTrader: (8)

Damn that suck, Steven should of put insurance, imagine if it got lost or stolen? Then what? Seller is responsible to have the item get to the buyer in the same condition he sold it for. The insurance is to protect the seller not the buyer. If I were you, I would ask for a full refund and sent it back, you have every right to since that's not condition you agree to buy the item in. That's why I alway asked for tracking and insurance anything over $150, because guys like him don't think it worth it.

Also on the whole request on the buyer to ship it threw usps and you didn't feel comfortable and that's your excuse of why your not responsible. It's not valid since you agree to it, that doesn't waver your responsibility as a seller. What you should of as done is charge a little extra for buyer request, especially if insurance is really expensive would of been cheaper to send it threw ups.

Gurew

iTrader: (4)

welllll did he package it the way you requested it be shipped? if so then thats on you buddy...if not..why not send it out for repair and have the seller pay for the damages....thats the only route thats fair imo

Azriel_Strife

iTrader: (5)

I didn't ask him to package it like that, I asked him to ship it to me USPS. He took to them and they put it in that stupid envelope and said "it should be fine". Who in their right mind puts a sensitive piece of equipment in a paper envelope and ships it off? It's totally not not my fault.

cone_crushr

iTrader: (18)

Agreed that the packaging job seems inadequate for an ECU, however the buyer is ultimately responsible for arranging the insurance and packaging agreement since the cost of them must be negotiated into the purchase price. Fredox19 has it all wrong (except for the suck part) , the buyer is the one who has to live with the damaged/missing product, therefore it's in his best interest to pay for insurance and decent packaging to minimize the risk.

I don't think the seller gets off free though. Sending an ECU in a bubble envelope is irresponsible to the point of negligence. The value of that negligence is debatable, but it's probably $40-80 worth of fail. In this ebay/internet age, these issues happens a lot, protect yourself during the sale negotiation.

Gurew

iTrader: (4)

i would say that the damage is around $200 at worst for repair. seller in this case seems to be the responsible one and in my opinion should refund a portion

Azriel_Strife

iTrader: (5)

I'd be happy with $150 back, I payed for it in good condition, the thread shows it in good condition. He never contacted me about shipping methods, I just payed him and he decided insurance wasn't worth it, even though it was my ECU.

I'll see if he'll do $150, if not then he's definitely not taking responsibility. I had no idea that anyone sending something worth $1300 new and at least $600 used would ship it in such a manner, it was unthinkable to me. I would never package ANYTHING not even a letter to my grandma, in something that crappy.

GoodfellaFD3S

iTrader: (213)

Wow, that packaging job is UNSAT. Also, 520 'shipped' to me implies that insurance will be paid by the seller, it is the seller's responsibility to get you the part in as-advertised condition.

Stevensimon has his selling/buying priveleges revoked until he settles this matter.

Azriel_Strife

iTrader: (5)

Thanks Goodfella, I really thought it was pretty lame to expect anything to get through the mail in that crappy little bag. I've packaged axle stubs in 2" of bubble wrap and put them in a box. This was unacceptable packaging.

Here's a screen shot of him saying it wasn't worth it.

Azriel_Strife

iTrader: (5)

UPDATE

he just messaged me on paypal, here is what was said.

From Seller - stevensimon

5/16/2010 18:08 PDT

it wouldnt have been a problem if i used ups. i have never had a problem with them. you requested usps so i went your route. i should have paid insurance but 20$ for 60$ worth of coverage would have cost almost 200$ just for insurance.

From Buyer - Azriel_Strife

5/16/2010 18:14 PDT

I got an intercooler Shipped by UPS that was packaged very well just a couple weeks ago, it was damaged badly. They obviously threw the package, or threw something heavy on top of it because it bent the 15 guage aluminum core almost 1/2 an inch. But that's neither here nor there.

You should have AT LEAST packaged the computer in 2 inches of bubble wrap or packing peanuts, or even newspaper, then it would have been fine. The reason it was damaged is because it had no protection, you might as well have stuck the postage right on the casing itself and sent it off.

stevensimon

iTrader: (11)

wow. what a great thread.

im glad you have to go smear this all over the internet instead of being a grown up and just talking about it to me. i do not normally sell or ship this stuff because it is such a pain. i have only shipped a few other things and nothing damageable and always ups. i sent one thing usps and have received a few things usps always messed up. i should have known that they would break it. but i still hold to my statement that 20$ for 60$ worth of coverage is not worth it.

if you would like, you can mail it back to me and if it gets here in the same condition then i will just refund your 520$ and split the shipping, get it fixed and sell it for the going rate, making sure to pay attention to the shipping.

but seriously, i get a pm, paypal dispute and this thread all within 2 days. should give people a chance to settle before throwing them in the fire like this.

Azriel_Strife

iTrader: (5)

I pm'd you on friday when I got it, I got no response, and you can't let stuff like this "wait" cause if you wait too long Paypal won't do anything. I really don't think I should have to ship it back to you at my expense, since it wasn't in my power to prevent the damage.

If you give me $150 USD back, I'll drop the dispute. I'm not being a ***** here, I just want things to be fair. I bought a good condition PFC, I got a broken PFC, and it's broken because you didn't package it even remotely safe.

GoodfellaFD3S

iTrader: (213)

USPS insurance is definitely not that expensive, you're getting some bad info somehow. It's like two bucks per $100 of insurance IIRC.

Azriel_Strife

iTrader: (5)

I was going to say that, to ship my HKS downpipe it cost 23 bucks to california from Vancouver. with $200 insurance. And it weighs like 18 pounds and is 4 feet long.

stevensimon

iTrader: (11)

thats what the guy at the counter said. "would you like insurance? its 20$ and we will cover up to 60$ worth of damage."

why the hell would i say no to 2$-100$ of service?

and why would you want to keep such a piece of **** computer anyway? i recall you saying that it is so damaged that you dont even want to use it in your car.

edit**
i didnt say ship it back at your expense. i said half.

Azriel_Strife

iTrader: (5)

It works fine, but it holds no resale value. From my point of view, my offer is way better than you refunding me and being stuck with a broken Power FC that you cant sell for more than $300. I don't care a whole lot about the broken harness adaptors, it's going in my car and staying there. the pins were bent but I was able to straighten them and plug it in. I'm using a piece of duct tape to hold the harness in the ECU plug.

I just want to know if you are going to refund me the $150 USD or not. If not you get negative trader score. If you make this right I'll give you positive and thank you for manning up.

GoodfellaFD3S

iTrader: (213)

It's your decision, but personally I would *not* want an ecu in my car that has connections held in with duct tape. Not safe at all.

Azriel_Strife

iTrader: (5)

its in the socket solid, just the clip that holds the harness plug in is broken off. its not literally held in position with duct tape. I'm certain it wont come out. And it;s just the one large plug, see the photo at the top, the rest of the socket is in tact.

stevensimon

iTrader: (11)

i will give you 75$ or i will split the shipping back to me and refund you for the computer.

Azriel_Strife

iTrader: (5)

Are you joking? 75 bucks for damage that makes the unit I payed $500 for worth less than than 300? If I wanted to take the ECU to a professional and have a new connector bridge resoldered into it that would even come close to covering the repair. Never mind getting the connector block to do so.

Instead I have to ship this thing back to you, have my DD off the road for god knows how long until I find another one for a good price and get it here?

You made the mistake, I'm failing to see why I should have to end up with no ECU, and be out half the shipping to give it back to you. Let alone not having my car to go to work for however long it takes to find and ship another properly. Ohh and lets not forget I bought it when the Canadian dollar was higher, I wouldn't even get back what I payed.

I don't feel like I''m getting any co-operation here. Instead you're just insulting me with $75, or telling me to take transit to work because of your mistake.

Azriel_Strife

iTrader: (5)

Resolution pending, he's going to give me $125 back, I'll report back once I get the payment, and give him positive feedback.

SmogSUX

iTrader: (12)

Just throwing this out there....insurance does NOT cover shitty packaging. When filing an insurance claim through a courier service you must show evidence of excellent packaging.

And when you settle for a price, that final price is for the item delivered to your hands in the condition it is presented in on the for sale thread.

stevensimon

iTrader: (11)

partial refund sent.

everything should be squared away.

nice doing business.

84stock

iTrader: (5)

Wow! Packaging is a big factor here. Anytime I get parts sent from Atkins they always go into overkill with the bubble wrap, then box it up and use a half a roll of tape. Clearly packaging could have been better!

On the other hand, I bought a supercharger from a forum member in Atlanta and I specified how I wanted it packaged and decided on the insurance.

Soooooo, as an outside party I say the responsibility is 50/50. If the unit is depreciated by 50% than buyer/seller share in the loss.

Seeing as the seller offered a refund that shows good character, and agreeing on half of the depreciation seems fair too.

Azriel_Strife

iTrader: (5)

Received $125 USD from stevensimon, issue resolved.