Chicagoland shop for FD RX-7
 

Looking for routine maintenance work and perhaps some light mods for my new to me stock RX-7 R1.


Any experience with Pugi Mazda in Downers Grove or CJ Wilson Mazda in Countryside for routine work on their RX-7? I only ask because they are quite close to me in the west suburbs of Chicago.


Otherwise it sounds like
Banzai Racing in NW Indiana
Elite Rotary Shop in Des Plaines, IL (which only has a FB page, no website nor does google know about it)
Shook Motorsports in Rockford, IL (whose website is currently lacking)


Closed
A-Spec


Any experiences with the above or recs?
Thanks!

I suggest you call shops during normal business hours and find out who answers the phone. This will start the process of weeding out the "hobby" shops where your car will only get worked on after hours and weekends.

Be very careful taking the car near any Mazda dealer.

Glad you found a car Balefire.
I'd be REALLY careful with a dealership. Most techs have never opened the hood on any RX7, let alone a turbocharged rotary. And they all tend to up-sell terribly.
If practical for YOU, I'd download a copy of the Factory Service Manual and read through the Gen 3 stickys to do your own routine maintenance...or take it to a trusted local shop. Probably a lot of local owners to net-work with for tips and advice too. There is nothing really significantly different about changing oil, plugs, brake pads etc. on this car than most others. For specific preventative stuff, or anything else that might come up...if I lived as close to Banzai as you, I'd take it there. 3 hrs doesn't seem long to people like me in serious fly-over country.

Shook is still around and does great work, certainly his focus is on the work and not the website.

I, for one, can speak well of my recent and ongoing experience with the somewhat newly-established Elite Rotary Shop. I learned of Elite's proprietor, Mr. Sal Scianna, through Howard Coleman. When Howard agreed to rebuild my engine a few months ago after a number of e-mail and phone conversations, he suggested Sal for my "to do" list. Because I wanted a number of other things done at the same time (switch out twins for a single turbo with associated waste gates and BOV, AI system, IC upgrade, ABS delete, A/C delete, manual steering rack conversion, surge tank and exhaust fabrication, plus battery relocation, ECU and gauge installation) which amounted to a general resurrection of the car after years of storage and inactivity, I was willing to allow a couple of months for the car to be worked on, and it helped that I would be out of the country for work during much of that. On very short notice and with Howard's good word on my behalf, Sal agreed to take on my car.

With that background, here's where Sal stands with me. His attention to detail is considerable, and while he is unafraid to voice his opinion for various ways forward with the car, he is always willing to defer to me, the customer. He has kept in solid contact with me, providing me with updates on labor hours, parts pricing, and overall progress. What's more, he and Howard have met at the IL/WI border a couple of times to exchange my engine before and after the CPR rebuild. Howard has ordered a number of parts on my behalf and had them sent to Sal, and there have been a few items which Sal sourced himself due to time and availability constraints. Although the build, as all of them do, has taken a few steps beyond my original vision and budget, I think I have been well-informed and ultimately in control during every decision-making fork in the road.

Here's another thing: Sal is enthusiastic. If I'm not careful, I'll ring up some lengthy long-distance phone conversations with him about different ideas for the build, and he speaks both about the technical and aesthetic/emotional aspects of this car. His own RX-7 (FD) is a pretty thing to behold, and his experience gained in the years BEFORE opening this dedicated shop definitely shines through. What's more, he has arranged for interior and exterior detailing of my car as "part of the deal" prior to pickup, and I am sorely looking forward to seeing it again.

My car arrived at his shop on September 16, and it will probably be picked up before December 1, which is right in line with my relaxed timeframe. Some parts hiccups and unanticipated fabrication for the intercooler and a couple other items slowed things down, but to me, this was immaterial. His labor rates are competitive, and his attention to detail has thus far been excellent. The fact that my car was coming out of storage in Wisconsin and went to Elite Rotary for an extended pit stop (with corresponding engine work by CPR in WI) before it comes home to me in Virginia was a serendipitous turn of events. I have no reason to believe my car will be anything but extraordinary when I see it in a few weeks, and I can certainly relay my further experiences here after that. In the meantime, that's my CYM on his FB page. I know he's holding back on photos because he has told me he will post more of them after I get to see the car in person. I look forward to that, as well.

I'm giving this place a try based on your review, and so far have also had a good experience.

I guess Sal/Sam (whichever he is going by now) has finally run out of shops to try to scam. He has burned bridges with nearly every shop in the mid-west, we banned him and his buddies from our shop over a decade ago. All I can say is beware. Do your research, screen name Justanother7 currently, however the guy has started more new accounts then I can keep track of.

Here he is pushing his new shop in the third person https://www.rx7club.com/midwest-rx-7...urg-il-924464/

Interesting reading

https://www.rx7club.com/bad-fugly-bu...kills-1067173/

https://www.rx7club.com/build-thread...build-1059182/

https://www.rx7club.com/shops-part-s...ports-1032790/

https://www.rx7club.com/bad-fugly-bu...mance-1058475/

i do not refer engine clients to full service rotary shops casually.

i also have zero dollars being kicked back to me for a referral as it would be a conflict of interest.

while i have operated CPR for 6 years and over 75 BREW motors i am closer to Sal than any other engine customer. we met June 2014 when Sal delivered his motor to me. the motor had been built by someone in Rockford and was, well, it would be hard to describe how badly it was built... the builder talked a great game and clearly either didn't care or didn't know what he was doing.

so Sal and i started out w what should have been a fresh well built engine that actually was a pile of junk. during the ensuing 17 months Sal and i worked together thru a number of highly complex issues and as a result Sal's motor is running like a clock and making over the six mark at 25 psi.

while i built the motor a great deal of the credit goes to Sal and the decisions he made re fixturing the all important support systems etc.

Sal is creative, no-nonsense and has an eye for aesthetics. above all, i have found him to be trustworthy. i would never, never refer an engine client to someone whom i didn't trust.

Sal and i have worked w Mark and his project which arrived on Sep 16 will finish within a week of the target which was Thanksgiving. considering the car was a total rebuild, engine, the brand new Borg Warner S300 SXE, suspension, brakes, engine bay re-spray... i am impressed.

not surprised. knowing Sal. shortly the pictures will speak for themselves, and Sal.

Howard

I have known Sam/Sal for over 14 years, not just a few months. I have seen him scam people first hand, he stole thousands of dollars from one of my customers for services he never rendered.

Sam/Sal actually gave my personal FD to a paint shop in Chicago as payment for a paint job on his 88 AE. It took me 6 months and countless headaches to hunt it down and get it back. I clearly did not know that he never paid for his paintwork, when I agreed to allow him to take my FD to Chicago. Basically he stole my car and I had to go hunt it down and pay to get it back. He is the absolute FURTHEST FROM TRUSTWORTHY as it gets.

I still have all the emails from a decade ago.

Wow, this thread sure got interesting in a hurry.

I've been around rotaries and FDs since 1998, and if someone was a scammer/liar/thief back then---- I still consider them in the same category in 2015.

My unasked for advice..... be very very careful who you deal with, generally speaking. You'd be surprised by what you hear over the years from unhappy customers. I've also torn down numerous engines from 'reputable' shops and been astounded by what I've seen with my own two eyes. And yes, I have pictures to document and prove it.

After going on 20 years in the game, here's who I can recommend based on personal experience. Note I don't have personal experience with every single builder/shop. It's a short list indeed:

Chris Ott/Ari Yallon at Rotary Performance in Garland Texas
Chris Sanders at Banzai Racing in Indiana
Ihor Huk and *ahem* myself at IRPerformance
Ray Crowe at Malloy Mazda for OEM parts needs
Heath Friedland at Sakebomb Garage for aftermarket parts needs
Bryan Nickell at BNR Supercars for turbo-related work
John Renna, Ray Wilson (if he's still around) for tuning
Johnny Bruce at Gorilla RE and David Jerome of DJSeven fame are two other blokes I'd 100% trust to build a rotary engine for me.

I don't have much experience with the California crowd. You'll notice some northeast shops conspicuously missing from the above list......

I could list at least a dozen people/shops to avoid like the plague.

If I hurt someone's feelings, pound sand. I call it like I see it :)

Edit: being that I posted in this specific thread and mentioned one poster but not the other..... I've never torn down a HC/CPR motor so can't comment on his handiwork. Hey Howard ;)

I will jump in on this.... I met Sal/Sam a couple of years ago. From what I have experienced, Sal is a stand up guy. Yes he is very emotional and I could see how some people could be turned off by him by his personality, but I stand by him. He has never done work for me because I do my own work, but he and I have bounced numerous ideas off each other and talk on a regular basis. He also has a great hookup with a great tuner, and he and I have set up a few dyno days and tune sessions with Nelson.

I know my comments probably won't sway anybody one way or the other, but I figured I'd put my .02 out there.

Izzy

We used to get phone calls once a week from people in Chicago that Sam/Sal sold used parts to, he would then tell them that he left the parts outside our shop and they were stolen. This was in the months during the paint work incident. Not only was he trying to harm our reputation he was stealing money from unsuspecting Chicago RX-7 owners.

NOTHING is ever left outside our shop, EVERY car & part is kept inside at all times. We own 3 buildings totaling over 12,000 sq ft, including a dyno facility.

Sam/Sal is plenty "likeable" most good conmen are, however he is your all around Scammer/Lair/Thief. There are not a lot of people that have earned a lifetime ban from our shop, Sam/Sal is the top of the list.

Based on a few good recs here as well as west suburb location and availability, I also tried Elite Rotary Shop.

I had a very good experience. The owner was honest, straight forward. Very good body of knowledge. My requested repairs and maintenance were done in a timely fashion. Communication was excellent. Labor was accurately charged. I hope they are around for a long time because I plan to be back in the spring for some upgrades. Thanks!

I hope that works out for you. Leopards do not change their spots.

There is a good reason why we have so many IL customers, but some people have to figure it out for themselves. Unfortunately that lesson usually cost them an engine. I hear the same story over and over. Banzai Racing Customer Gallery

Glad to hear you had a positive experience :icon_tup:

Out of curiosity, what kind of work did you have done and what were the labor rates?

Post purchase inspection. JDM rear seat install. Other interior work. Oil change. Plugs.

They charge 100 per hour for labor. Cheaper than Porsche. More than shade tree mechanic. I thought the rate and hours billed were very reasonable.

Mazda in Country side is good if you want to do Dealer specific work. There is a tech there that is a big rotor head, building a truck at the moment. Definitely not a noob with rotaries. There is also a salesman there with a Red FD and my friend works in the parts department.

If you need aftermarket parts (oem or aftermarket) you are more then welcome to shoot me a message. Im located around the Palos area.

Just my .02

As for the rest of the "debate" going on, Im just gonna stay out of the other part of the conversation going on in this thread.

Mike

had a few conversations with sal at elite, straight up guy always trys to help, even hooked me up on a clutch kit for my FD, called 4 different shops nobody can get it, had it the next day. a+ in my books

If four different shops tell you something is on backorder and he pulls one out of his ass, then I would be concerned that it is a fake clutch kit like the ones from SR, especially if it is was an ACT you were looking for. The real FD HD & XT ACT are on backorder until 2/7, he does not have a secret supply of them.

really dont know what the beef is between the 2 and i dont care, called you guys gave the girl the part number and said unavailable, called sal he told me unavailable, tried to get me into the 6 puck kit which one of his vendors had and was going to order that one but the following day his vendor was able to track this one down.

looks legit to me... dude did me right and next till ill call him before calling youhttps://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rx7...71e72fb946.jpg

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rx7...bf9c8c1f4f.jpg

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rx7...e82834d972.jpg

https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rx7...88cf770dd1.jpg

...

You don't know what the BEEF is? The asshole STOLE my car and has scammed a dozen people that I know personally. Sal has no less then 5 screen names on this forum alone. You can do business with whoever you want, do not come on here complaining that you got scammed and were not warned. Opening a shop a couple months ago does not legitimize any of his actions.

I AM TELLING EVERYONE, DO YOUR RESEARCH. The Bad Business & Bad Guy sections of this forum are full of stories about fly-by-night shoddy shops that burn people. Don't be a victim.

Chris, please PM me any info (including multiple screen names) that you have on this member.

thanks :icon_tup:

"Sal and i have worked w Mark and his project which arrived on Sep 16 will finish within a week of the target which was Thanksgiving. considering the car was a total rebuild, engine, the brand new Borg Warner S300 SXE, suspension, brakes, engine bay grime removal... i am impressed.

not surprised. knowing Sal. shortly the pictures will speak for themselves, and Sal.

Howard".... 11/24/2016

the car was finished 11/31/2015 and the pictures, uh, speak for themselves...

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/102...910/6Ahnw8.jpg
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/102...633/q8puZb.jpg
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/102...633/namMGB.jpg
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/102...911/HBLTbL.jpg
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/102...910/rBYTn9.jpg

the conversion features my CPR spec engine, CPR turbo manifold and the new ultra efficient 550+ hp capable Borg Warner S300 SXE 62 turbo. add that to Elite's beautiful build and one more FD is transformed into a dual purpose street/roadracing terror soon to be seen at VIR.

nice going Sal!

Howard

You are correct, the pictures DO speak for themselves. Anyone can paint a UIM, that does not make it a great build with attention to detail. I see a shoddy, back-yard, amateur level build, with at least a half a dozen things that I can see just from the "UH, self speaking pictures" that I would never do.

Let's start:

1. Using no idler and stock pulleys, asking for overheating problems
2. Belt cranked all the way to top of the adjustment, because there is no idler, say goodbye to the bearings
3. Positive cable run all the way through the engine bay to the fuse box, fire hazard in the making.
4. Cheesy, loop line for the power steering delete
5. Water temp sensor mounted on the cold side of the thermostat, so it only functions after the car reaches operating temp.
6. No idea what to make of the brake booster hose.
7. Stock map sensor is not going to allow that car anywhere near 550+
8. Looks like the garbage ebay VMS plug wires were used
9. from an aesthetic standpoint I can't stand when people don't use the acorn nuts on the throttlebody

I could keep going but that is already more than half a dozen. Can't imagine what I would find if I was standing next to it.

I do not see anything remotely resembling the work from a "full service rotary shop", I see the work of a third rate parts installer that cuts corners. A full service shop knows how to rebuild an engine and tune a car, no need to farm it out since the shop is FULL SERVICE. If you aren't building and tuning, you are just installing.

Is there someone specific I can talk to at Banzai?

I have no horse in this game and don't even live near these shops. But, everyone on the internet has an opinion, and so do I.

I have heard positive and negative things over the years about Banzai and they seem to equal themselves out. The overall complaint seems to end up being their pricing. But, atleast the jobs look like they are being done right. If I was in that area and wanted stuff done right, I'd probably make them my first choice.

As for this build itself - WOW! In almost every aftermarket performance market you find customers going to shops to have work done because either they don't have the time/resources to do it themselves, or they don't have the ability.

It looks like Elite Rotary really screwed this customer! Unfortunately, being impressed with painted and clean parts is dangerous. The points that Banzai brought up are valid and concerning. If you can see those problems from a couple non-detailed pictures, I would be scared to know what you'd see upon further detailed inspection!

I like to think that the true testament to a shop's work is in the results of their labor. Has this car been taken to any track or dyno? Let's see some logs that show the performance of all the major systems on the car: HP, Air/Fuel Ratio, Cooling, Oiling, etc.

I think that if you were able to show logs of all that, it would be far more impressive than pictures of a clean engine bay.

I do not know who would be complaining about our pricing, I know it is not the customers that bring their cars to our shop. Our rebuild prices are one of the most competitive out there, we build over 100 engines each year for people all over the world. Our shop rate is $100/hr. , same as others that don't provide nearly the same quality of service. We have not raised the prices on our Banzai products in 6 years, and come to market with new products yearly.

That being said, we are a real bricks and mortar company and not a website being run out of someone's bedroom, so we are not going to be beat the prices on a every Greddy or HKS part, where there is very little margin to begin with (luckily it is not our core business). So if that is the complaint, there is nothing we can do about it. There is always going to be someone on ebay selling some part for less, those same people are not able to give any customer service or expert advise. It is amazing how often we get calls from people wanting us to tell them how to install a part they bought from some other site or ebay.

I think Rich said it best, just the other day;

You are correct that it is dangerous, when people are impressed by painted or shiny parts. We currently have a 20B RX8 in the shop, that the current owner was mesmerized by the shiny parts and did not look past them at the finer details of the car. It is a basket case with a blown (low compression) engine. We are reworking everything.


https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rx7...09edca7a5f.jpg

Well then...I answered a question on a forum based on my experience. So did a few other people. I researched and made a decision about my engine with Howard, then did the same for the car's build and where it would be done while I was deployed. Other people can do the same.
I have gotten the car back and driven it about 60 feet from where I offloaded it from the trailer into the garage. Due to the weather, my job, and old, dry-rotted tires that were on the car before it was stored in 2003, it's hard to say when I'll get new rubber and start putting break-in miles on it, although I've started it and brought it up to temperature several times in the cold snap of weather we've had. There will be no dyno sheets or other chest-thumping put up by me, and the car will not be tuned for anything beyond break-in until the spring or summer anyway. After that, if the car blows up, overheats, or suffers some other disastrous event, then some folks can laugh at me, say "I told you so" and we will all go on with our lives. Conversely, if the car performs as was my intention, then the work will speak for itself. I think each shop will go about such a build, each in their own way. What's more, if a shop has no problem working jointly with an established and respected engine builder (and that's the builder I wanted for my engine), then, to me, it strengthens the project.
I had a budget at the outset of the project. True, I exceeded that initial outlook, but I made alterations to the goal while it was ongoing with some decisions adding cost while others tried to cut it, and all of the work and parts were itemized over the course of 8 pages of invoice. The car was inspected and things that needed to be repaired or replaced were repaired or replaced, including things I hadn't anticipated. I wanted the A/C, power steering, and ABS deleted. I didn't want 550hp, but if the engine was going to all come apart and go back together making more power than before, there were ancilliary parts and systems the car needed. Howard chose a cutting-edge turbo for me, the capabilities of which far exceeded my goals. Still, I didn't want a museum piece. I wanted durability, reliability, and functionality, and I'm not impressed with flashy-shiny. I need to learn to drive this car again. If it leaves me happy, that's about all that matters, and I'll quietly tip my hat to Howard and Sal after each trouble-free drive because they will have done me right.
So, yes--I agree with Banzai. "Buyer beware." That goes in just about any walk of life. Have I gone out on a limb by going with a shop that I barely knew, but came well-recommended? Perhaps, but that's the trust I placed in Howard. If my car has any number of issues--the ones listed by you or others--then shame on me and shame on the guys I trusted (and paid) to work on this for me, and word will get out because my disappointment after the time and money spent will be tremendous. However, if that time and those disasters never arrive, then I've done OK. In the meantime, people can take my story for whatever it's worth and make their own decisions.

i referred Mark to Sal as well as another shop i work with and Mark made his decision with which i am comfortable. while lacking acorn nuts, i am delighted w the outcome and of course the real outcome remains to be determined which it will.

a reasonable observation has been made about the retention of the stock MAP sensor.

the car was purpose built to do double duty, street and track days/road racing. the FD when properly set up will wipe the floor with most cars at the 400 rwhp mark. i, as well as Fritz Flynn, and many others can back this up.

the 2016 variety of Borg Warner S300 SXE is a perfect fit, state of the art, especially when combined w my ports, turbo manifold and a 60 mm Tial wastegate.

a stock MAP sensor reliably reads boost at one pressure ratio. pls note the compressor map below. the red line is 14.7 manifold pressure. note the line extends to 67.5 pounds per minute.

67.5 pounds per minute = 977 CFM = 509 rotary rwhp. for the customer's app the MAP sensor is a fit. of course there is nothing wrong w doing a 3 BAR sensor but in this case it is not needed and just adds to the cost.

the SXE 62 may be able to make 580 at max flow but this has nothing to do w this build.

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/102...903/HXi2iF.jpg

at some point in the spring it is my expectation that Nelson Siverio (RRRdynotuning FB) will tune Mark's beast.

Nelson tuned Sal's FD last fall and made 614 SAE hp at 25/26 psi and it is running strong. i am hoping Nelson will get a wack at all my CPR motors as he is truly special. BTW, while Sal's motor is mine, i credit Sal for a great deal of the success of his car which has collected a large amount of high value scalps.

as Mark comments, it all remains to be determined and i am looking confidently forward to it.

Howard

Adracer/Mark, go grab the water pump pulley, you will be able to spin it by hand, slipping right by the belt. There is virtually zero belt contact, this is a terrible setup. It has been well covered what this will result in. There are more problems in your engine bay that I did not list. Post up some actual detailed pictures of the work and chances are I will point out a dozen or more blatant problems. Based of several PMs I have received recently, I would suggest you do a baseline compression test right now, since you have only driven it 60ft.

Howard do not try to minimalize all the issues down to acorn nuts and a map sensor. The fact that you didn't notice all the problems is very telling.

I can only guess it is a business strategy, one guy does the rebuild, a different the install, and yet another for the tuning. This way when things go bad everyone can point fingers at the other guy and accept zero blame, leaving the customer holding the bag.

Since we are actually a FULL SERVICE SHOP and build the car from start to finish, including tuning, there are no problems. We also know what works and what does not. We never send a car out of our shop without a valid break in tune that is completely drivable. I would not dream of sending someone home with a car that needs to be tuned by someone else just to break in the engine.

We have already determined that Sam/Sal is a liar, thief and scammer, now we know that he is charging professional rates for amateur level half ass installs. Just because people pay someone to do something does NOT make them good at what they have been hire to do.

Also let me say this, I have not been participating in this thread to drum up business. We currently have 15 customer cars in the shop for rebuilds and modifications, some from as far away as Florida. We are currently scheduling cars in for April/May. I have been involved to warn people, do your research.

Sal/Sam has always relied on other shops, he has no experience, which is evident from the pictures posted.

For Banzai Racing:

Do you do the dyno tuning yourself or someone at your shop does it?

Are you the actual tuner?

I personally do all the dyno tuning myself on our in-house load bearing Mustang dyno. I also personally build every engine and install them.

Dyno Gallery

Which ECU's are you familiar with?

Also, what are your observations for the Mustang Dyno vs a DynoJet?



Additionally, you mentioned you build every engine and install them. So you are building 2 x engines per week?

Just curious...

Planning of making a trip up from FL for tuning? If you look through the dyno gallery you will see I am most adept at the PFC and Microtech, but we have some Haltech & Motec customers also.

The Mustang is a far superior tuning tool, the Dynojet is only good for supplying unrealistically high number. There is a reason that the Mustang Dyno cost 3X what a Dynojet cost. The Dynojet has an optional eddy current brake, but most shops do not want to spend the extra money. If a dyno is not load bearing, it is basically useless as a tuning tool.

2/week would be an average, there are weeks where I do nothing but stack engines, we will ship out 10-15 shortblocks in that week. We obviously do not install every engine we build. We actually have a few Mazda dealers that ship us engines on a regular basis, since they can only get 13B-MSP engines from the Reman Facility. We also have several race teams that we build for. We are always super busy, but we have great scheduling.

I was impressed when you mentioned you build 2 x engines per week (100 a year) personally.

So is that an accurate statement?

Are you not reading what I am typing?

I am, but you did not directly answer my question. I did not ask if you deal with other vendors. I already know that happens as a shop, as i believe no business operation is a one man show.

Just wanted to confirm the information you posted, that's all.

I think you are confused. We build the engines for the Mazda dealers and race teams. You specifically asked if I build 2 engines every week. The answer is no, there are weeks that I do not build any, then others that I build 10-15, so 2/week would be an average, which is exactly what I said. There are weeks that I spend 5 solid days on the dyno. Banzai is not a one person operation, you can call and talk to Elaine any time during normal operational hours.

Do you tune Haltech ECU's yourself?

I personally can say thanks to chris for taking care off my car back in 2010
Banzai Racing (Balandis RX-7 FD3s SMP)

"There is virtually zero belt contact, this is a terrible setup. It has been well covered what this will result in.

1. Using no idler and stock pulleys, asking for overheating problems


say goodbye to the bearings"

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/102...907/D0If30.jpg

based on a recent thread entitled "Pineapple Racing Idler pulley Failure"

https://www.rx7club.com/new-old-prod...ilure-1085609/

the potential "bearing failure" may resemble the above picture rather than the front main bearing.

the thread is IMO a fair representation of the Pineapple idler. some have had good results and some have experienced idler bearing failure. looking carefully at the shared experiences one probably would conclude if you are going to really use your car it would be prudent to pass on it.

as shared in the thread high and perhaps sustained RPM is the culprit. hey if you are just styling in your FD by all means bolt it on.

before you do consider:

at 8500 RPM the idler pulley is spinning at over 14,000 RPM and is in a high load condition. take a close look at the (broken) bearing cage. it is blued from excessive heat. and of course part of it is missing.

Pineapple has apparently upgraded the bearing however:

"I've got the pulley... and Have Swapped the bearing twice so far. And Guess what?....I started the car yesterday with the "New" advised to use bearing and heard that Defening horrifyingly loud squeeling. I've heard people using it without issue.. And I'd like to think i pay particular attention to how much tension is on my belts and make sure that it's never too much... but I threw in the towel..."

Aaron Parker

"Yep, belt tension was fine and had .4" of defection on a new belt which should be lower than stock"

OP

in the real world, occasional manufacturing defects happen but having raced seriously and successfully all my life i know the value of not creating problems when there is no need.

let me reiterate about this specific build...

Mark's FD was built to have fun on the street and WIN on the track. road racing is the most challenging usage of an FD and HEAT is challenge number ONE.

my engines make peak torque at 6450 and are happy at 8950. given lots of sustained RPM and.. from a read of the thread the item has no place on Mark's car for Mark's app.

still not convinced?

Fritz Flynn has probably logged more road racing miles on his FD than anyone on this board..

"Yep

It's the high rpm

Drive these idlers hard and they fall apart. Fortunately it didn't happen while you were at the track etc.....

If I was you I'd get your new one from Pineapple and promptly sell it to someone who likes adding things to their car for cough cough reliability reasons LOL

Don't use them and don't recommend them. There is plenty of tension with a stock under drive. I've been tracking my car hard for 10 years with stock wp, stock underdrive and greddy style water pump/alt pulley's. When you start to hear a squeal that goes away quickly after start up there is a good chance you a need a new belt or water pump pulley is worn so replace one or both and keep on revving.

Bottomline: An aftermarket water pump or water pump idler pulley's are not parts anyone needs"

Fritz Flynn

i switched my FD to what Fritz runs in 1999. for four years i ran the Ferrari Club of North America's annual event at Brainerd Int'l Raceway in Northern Minnesota. Brainerd is a neat and unusual track as the main straight is 6000 ft long and turn one is a banked wide radius 90 degree turn that i enter at 160 mph. i was never passed in the four years. ( as background Brainerd is on the CENDIV SCCA schedule and i had the track record in GT3 and have won a bunch of races at the track)

my point is that i NEVER had any overheating problems at a very fast track. nor have i ever had any overheating during the 16 years i have ran the setup.

so Mark's car is just fine.

that all said, as in any mod you do need to understand it and pull maintenance.

i have posted somewhere in this forum that such a setup IS a maintenance item.

i have suggested that the water pump pulley be replaced when the striations show wear. probably every year or two. no big deal, they are around $30.

belt tension is important. too little you get slip.

too much you can actually pull the nose of the crank upwards which pressures the main bearing and it will eventually show copper at 11 o'clock.

FD's even properly fixtured require understanding and attention. if you are either disinterested or not capable of understanding this need buy a Buick.

just to finish, someone observed the belt adjustment is maxxed out on the car. it is not.

Howard

Do you tune Haltech ECU's yourself?

Hello Jay, how have you been?


Funny that Jay stopped into this thread, installed an idler on his car in May 2012, still no problems.



Stock water pump pulley, NOT underdrive. No belt contact, there is a reason Greddy came out with pulleys years ago.

Couple idler bearing failures out of thousands, probably due to incorrect installation or overtightened belts. I have never seen a failure in person, just that picture in one thread.

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rx7...a61db508fc.jpg


Premature bearing failure, smog pump removed vs. kept. Over-tightened belts cause bearing wear. We see this all the time.


https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rx7...c01157538d.jpg

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rx7...d5196c8609.jpg


Already asked and answered.

For: Banzai Racing

You did not answer my question about tuning Haltech ECU's. You just mentioned you had Haltech and Motec customers, that's about it.

Do you do the tuning on Haltech ECU's yourself?

Please let me know.

For: Banzai Racing

Please let me know, by posting in this thread, that you tune Haltech ECU's yourself.

Me and others would like to know.

Thank you.

^Seems like it WAS answered....
Who else besides yourself wants to know?

I just asked a simple question that can be answered with a yes or no.

If they have another tuner that works with the Haltech, that's fine, I just want to know if he does it himself or somebody else does.

That's all.

Frankly it seems like you have a motive not yet shared. Are you planning on bringing your car up from Miami to northern Indiana for a tune? If so, I'm sure you have many other questions, why not call or at least email? Just wondering. That's all.

I prefer to ask here.

Also, i can ask as many questions as i'd like. I don't need private messages from a vendor telling me to stop asking.

If my question goes unanswered, i'd like to know why.

If this is the way customers get treated when dealing with you, then i will not do any business with you.

You came on this thread bashing others, which does not look professional. I know of a few shops that actually hold quarter mile world records in the rotary community, and they don't go around doing this.

Point is, we should remain neutral about what other shops do. Let their work do the talking.

In the end, the customer makes the final decision.