Looking for clues and advice on where to turn from here with my water/meth setup. Single turbo (EFR 8374), currently running an aem pump controlled by a Snow vc-50 gauge/controller, devil's own #7 nozzle injected at Greddy elbow. Power is a little over 400 at 16psi, a little under 400 when meth is spraying. Would like to turn up the boost a couple psi if I can ever get a reliable system. Have had 2 aem controllers to fail, then went to the snow controller, which fails and locks up when it gets hot or the car is parked in direct sunlight. What is the best progressive system or controller on the market to use with a less sophisticated ecu like the powerfc? Snow sells a few different controllers but there is little info or reviews out there. Aquamist kits look interesting but seem best suited to more capable ecus with its PWM operation. Any suggestions except AEM are appreciated

 

I have heard about the AEM controller issue... You could always go old school, and activate the system through a pressure switch:

https://www.vdo-gauges.com/sensors/p...-switches.html

 

Why don't AI systems factor in RPMs? Seems silly.

Hmm this one popped up: https://www.rpmware.com/catalog/group/52458
seems legit

 

Last I looked into aquamist they kind of dropped all real rotary support with the discontinuation of their 'summer' to take into account staging. I've yet to hear about consistently failing AEM controllers and I've used a few. That sucks.

 

Just regarding the AEM controller failures, they dont like getting wet. Ive splashed mine a couple times filling the jug or washing the car or whatnot, and get fault codes straight away almost every time, but a blast of compressed air and a squirt of silicone spray fixes it everytime.
possibly not relevent. Just thought id share.
I have the older type.

 

If you switch to a pre-turbo mechanical setup, you remove multiple potential failure points and get the added benefits pre-turbo injection brings. No pump to fail, no controller to fail, so long as the turbo is making boost, the water will be pressurised proportionally. The only failures point are therefore (a) leaks; (b) nozzle (seriously, not going to happen); (c) boost-activated solenoid; or (c) empty tank (solved with low-level sensor hooked to warning light or other failsafe). Those failure points are also shared with the post turbo computer controlled systems. The only added failure point with a pre-turbo setup is impeller damage. That won't be a problem with appropriately selected nozzle and nozzle placement.

 

I noticed that. I've got an inquiry email out to Richard at aquamist right now to see what he thinks about my setup running his standard kit. It is at the top of the list even if you can't still get the summer. Yea AEM controllers are ****, tons of failures, check the AEM electronics forums, kind of funny, you call their tech support and they have "no idea about any known issues with their controllers". Just glad I didn't pop a motor, no more AEM electronics for me.

 

I've read briefly about the wannaspeed kit, and was intrigued, just not sold on preturbo and/or mechanical injection yet, would like to give an electrical progressive kit one more shot, if I can find the right one for me, and it is reliable.

 

I think there may be good applications for pre-turbo injection in very specific designs/configurations, however (and my opinion), a street car is not one of them. Saab has done studies and shown empirical data showing that pre turbo injection causes compressor erosion over time.

 

wasn't this done with older not as good nozzles and it was only after 60k miles that erosion was apparent?
a properly installed / aimed atomizing nozzle won't cause erosion "allegedly"

I have 3 kits, a coolingmist boost progressive that was installed and in use, and never installed aquamist with summer module and wannaspeed mechanical... I couldn't decide so i got one of each :/

my car has been garaged for a couple years now for different reasons and eventually when I drive it again I will be using one of these and selling the rest lol

 

it was Volvo. They did a study and yes it did show impeller pitting, but after pitting 80-100,000 miles of use. Who here is running the same turbo for that long? This wasn't using High Pressure Low Volume atomising nozzles as are used in afternarket systems either.

I remember reading the study some time ago, but can't find it now.

There is no need/benefit for WI under 8-10 psi so most system have a hobbs switch to lock off water under a specific level so avoid less than optimal atomisation.

Water hardness or salinity as well as use of methanol might be a compounding factor. Personally I'd use distilled water only and keep any methanol under 50%. I recall that the Green Brothers car, they made more power with water only in pre-tuebo configuration.

impeller damage is a risk and potential downside people need to be aware of, but a risk that can be mitigated.

 

Define time, 10 years? perhaps they measure it in mileage, if so how many miles?

 

It was enough of an impact to the point that they did it, published, and no longer do it. There is/I thought I had the paper saved somewhere, I'm sure with a little effort you could find it.

It was also enough for me to decide that I'd rather just properly size my turbo and keep tabs on a pressurized/post turbo system too.


Ah, my mistake, which is also why in my archive I can't find **** associated with Saab :P I was remembering it being far earlier than that, and I'd also suggest that it a measurement of mileage isn't very apropos and would have more to do with time under load vs shaft speed but I'm not omniscient.

 

Back from the dead. Torquebyte makes a good standalone water meth controller. Snow rebrands it as their stage 4 controller. Sirhc Labs makes a Cortex boost controller that also allows you to control water meth via PWM pump or solenoid via 3d tables. Both are excellent, the cortex is a better value, but does not have a built in failsafe.

 

^ unless you are also using it for boost control.

 

I actaully need a good ebc too. This might be something I need to look into. Currently running a simple Turbosmart boost tee for boost control. Do you personally have experience with the cortex? I just checked out the website and I am fairly interested.

 

I got a NIB coolingmist setup from a forum member last year and never installed it and was going to get an eboost street, but this looks like it could simplify that idea.

 

If you need an injection solenoid I have a BNIB Holley 1000CC AI solenoid I was going to use before I abandoned my AI plans. It's a year or two old and I'll let it go for $150 shipped.

 

I have it on my F150 although I don’t use the boost control function at all. Just the meth injection.

I have AEM on my FD but I’m going to scrap that and just run it through my Haltech.

 

there are definitely benefits to progressive control, but I find that simplicity is key. I just run an output from the haltech ecu to trigger a generic automotive relay which kicks on a pump, and spray 50/50 that targets 12-15% of overall fuel supply. Seems to only lower the AFR about 0.2 and works great. Only downside is it will naturally bring the AFR a little lower than 0.2 from target when running below your target high boost

 

Why? You have 3d mapping capability with your Haltech.

 

Im going to wire up my aem kit failsafe wire to my gfb geforce 3 boost controller scramble wire (which is also wired to the ''fog light'' button in the cabin) This scramble setting will engage wastegate spring pressure mode and should hopefully be a good safety.
Im going to tuck the aem controller behind my din mounted gauge holder so hopefully it shouldnt fail from heat or water