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Engine dies at WOT at any RPM

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Old 05-07-18, 05:51 PM
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Engine dies at WOT at any RPM

No idea what is going on, is there a list of settings I can check to figure out why the motor cuts out as soon as the TPS hits 100%? Doesn't matter what speed or gear, 99% fine, 100% dead.

Adaptronic 440d
13b N/A REPU
1=unused, 2=TPS

Last edited by chuyler1; 05-07-18 at 06:29 PM.
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Old 05-11-18, 12:21 AM
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Look at your ecu data window to see what flag pops up when it happens. I had a similar problem making the engine rpm go up and down. It was the settings on the power cut menu. This is settings that worked for me.
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Old 05-11-18, 12:23 AM
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77Look at your ecu data window to see what flag pops up when it happens. I had a similar problem making the engine rpm go up and down. It was the settings on the power cut menu. This is settings that worked for me.
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Old 05-11-18, 10:30 AM
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I found this panel the other day (or I should say, I just double checked it). The typical values were set correctly, soft, hard, cold, hot but the flat shift RPM was 0 or some low value. I increased it to the same as hard rev limit. At the same time I switched from TPS to MAP tune but the problem is gone now. It must have thought I was trying to flat shift or launch because I don't have a speed sensor to let it know I'm moving.

On side note, it looks like you essentially disabled your Throttle-off overrun. Were you having issues with it? I raised mine to 3500/3600 so it will only operate when I'm cruising on the highway. I only have a 4 speed so at 70 mph I'm turning about 4,000 RPMs. If I set it low, like the manual suggests the throttle becomes very lurchy at cruising speeds around town.
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Old 05-13-18, 06:24 AM
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I tried the Throttle Off Over Run 3600 and 3500 because my car was kinda"lurchy" around town. But when I would coming to a stop it would die. I would have to pop the clutch to get it started again. I never had any problems with the throttle off over run. But I didnt set up anything on that page. Danny kan from GarageLife set that page up. He said i had it all wrong. He knows his **** when it comes to rotarys and adapronic.
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Old 05-14-18, 09:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Holdfast View Post
I tried the Throttle Off Over Run 3600 and 3500 because my car was kinda"lurchy" around town. But when I would coming to a stop it would die. I would have to pop the clutch to get it started again. I never had any problems with the throttle off over run. But I didnt set up anything on that page. Danny kan from GarageLife set that page up. He said i had it all wrong. He knows his **** when it comes to rotarys and adapronic.
You can run it much lower without it being "lurchy" if you just add some delay. With 0ms delay its a pretty aggressive and touchy throttle off and can definitely induce some bucking at light throttle.

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Old 05-15-18, 11:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Skeese View Post
You can run it much lower without it being "lurchy" if you just add some delay. With 0ms delay its a pretty aggressive and touchy throttle off and can definitely induce some bucking at light throttle.

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Should I set it to be used only when it's in gear? How long of a delay would recommend. I started off with 1500 then 500. The low rpm i set at 2500 high was 3500. There was a noticeable improvement from the 16000rpm and 0 delay i had before. But still need work.
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Old 05-16-18, 07:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Holdfast View Post
Should I set it to be used only when it's in gear? How long of a delay would recommend. I started off with 1500 then 500. The low rpm i set at 2500 high was 3500. There was a noticeable improvement from the 16000rpm and 0 delay i had before. But still need work.
I always left the box setting off allowing it to cut while the rpms are dropping while out off gear. Will be fine so long as it comes back on high enough above idle to catch it before it stalls.

On my stock port that idled at 1000 rpms I found 1300 low and 1400 high with about 1/2 a second of delay made for the best ride. With my semi peripheral tho that idles around 2000ish rpms the threshold is more like 2800 low 3200 high with variable delay mapped against rpm.

Did you get the WOT issue sorted? I'd like to see the tune and some logs just out of N/A curiosity.

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Old 05-16-18, 07:37 AM
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Yes, I believe it was flat shift rpm set to 0 combined with not having any way to determine that the vehicle was in gear. The problem went away after I went through a bunch of changes including switching from 1=unused,2=TPS to 1=MAP,2=unused. The motor is a stock port but has ITBs. I get a decent MAP signal but I had switched it a while ago while chasing some other issues I have since resolved which turned out to just be the idle control settings messing with everything.
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Old 05-16-18, 12:15 PM
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Originally Posted by chuyler1 View Post
Yes, I believe it was flat shift rpm set to 0 combined with not having any way to determine that the vehicle was in gear. The problem went away after I went through a bunch of changes including switching from 1=unused,2=TPS to 1=MAP,2=unused. The motor is a stock port but has ITBs. I get a decent MAP signal but I had switched it a while ago while chasing some other issues I have since resolved which turned out to just be the idle control settings messing with everything.
How did the swap from TPS to MAP based tuning go with the ITB's? I was working a TPS load based map for a friend recently with ITBs on a similar setup and was debating making the change...any noticeable negatives?
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Old 05-16-18, 05:33 PM
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It's actually a lot smoother...took me about an hour to dial it in. The motor runs fine on open loop but I still haven't figured out the magic settings for closed loop to work. I'll drive around and the first 10 minutes are perfect, when the temps are below the threshold for closed loop, then I can immediately tell it's on because off throttle I get hesitation like it's cutting spark trying to idle the motor, then it will die at a stop sign. If i blip the throttle as it's dropping RPM it will usually settle into a nice idle. I'm gonna take it out this evening and just zero out the closed loop idle stuff. I have all the "closed loop idle conditions" unchecked but I think it still tries to do it because it doesn't know I'm in gear and moving. Maybe I just need a VSS sensor to actually utilize closed loop idle.
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Old 05-19-18, 06:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Skeese View Post
I always left the box setting off allowing it to cut while the rpms are dropping while out off gear. Will be fine so long as it comes back on high enough above idle to catch it before it stalls.

On my stock port that idled at 1000 rpms I found 1300 low and 1400 high with about 1/2 a second of delay made for the best ride. With my semi peripheral tho that idles around 2000ish rpms the threshold is more like 2800 low 3200 high with variable delay mapped against rpm.

Did you get the WOT issue sorted? I'd like to see the tune and some logs just out of N/A curiosity.

Skeese
I got the Throttle Off Over Run set up at 1800 to 2000 with a delay of 500. It runs real hard now! I can't believe how much of a difference it made. Im running 1map 2tps MAP×TPS. Works better than 1unused 2tps. Just used my tps based map for fuel2. Fuel1 is 1.000 accros the whole map. Ign1map is my tps based map and IGN2map is 10.00 accros whole map. Only thing now I have a misfire at Idle. Need to smooth it out. But other than that car is alot quicker. Not exactly sure what throttle off over run does but i like it.
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Old 05-20-18, 11:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Holdfast View Post
I got the Throttle Off Over Run set up at 1800 to 2000 with a delay of 500. It runs real hard now! I can't believe how much of a difference it made. Im running 1map 2tps MAP×TPS. Works better than 1unused 2tps. Just used my tps based map for fuel2. Fuel1 is 1.000 accros the whole map. Ign1map is my tps based map and IGN2map is 10.00 accros whole map. Only thing now I have a misfire at Idle. Need to smooth it out. But other than that car is alot quicker. Not exactly sure what throttle off over run does but i like it.
May be worth checking and cleaning your plugs after having been dumping fuel during decel. Its possible they are dirty and causing the idle misfire
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Old 05-20-18, 05:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Skeese View Post
May be worth checking and cleaning your plugs after having been dumping fuel during decel. Its possible they are dirty and causing the idle misfire
ya i checked the plugs. There clean. Been running rx8 plugs that are pricey but dont foul up like the other plugs. I think it's my fuel map too lean or the variable dwel settings with the ign-1a coils. Got the dwel settings from here. Seems like Idle smooths out when I put it to 4500 fixed. But i have more power with variable dwel.
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Old 05-20-18, 07:42 PM
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Possibly related question, what min/max map do you set for closed loop? Should closed loop be used during high vacuum decel?
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Old 05-20-18, 08:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Holdfast View Post
ya i checked the plugs. There clean. Been running rx8 plugs that are pricey but dont foul up like the other plugs. I think it's my fuel map too lean or the variable dwel settings with the ign-1a coils. Got the dwel settings from here. Seems like Idle smooths out when I put it to 4500 fixed. But i have more power with variable dwel.
Did you check the resistance on the plug wires?....With the ign-1a coils you should have no problem idling at 3000ms. You shouldn't have to be running that much dwell at idle for it to run clean
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Old 05-20-18, 08:49 PM
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Originally Posted by chuyler1 View Post
Possibly related question, what min/max map do you set for closed loop? Should closed loop be used during high vacuum decel?
Do you mean closed loop fuel control? During high vacuum decel you should be cutting fuel and just letting it spin, or if you don't use the overrun fuel and are instead still fueling why would being in closed loop matter? What significance would a afr target have there? Curious to the reasoning...

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Old 05-20-18, 09:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Skeese View Post
May be worth checking and cleaning your plugs after having been dumping fuel during decel. Its possible they are dirty and causing the idle misfire
Originally Posted by Skeese View Post
Did you check the resistance on the plug wires?....With the ign-1a coils you should have no problem idling at 3000ms. You shouldn't have to be running that much dwell at idle for it to run clean
resistances is good. That's why I was thinking its the fuel map too lean or something. This is the variable dwel I'm using. Direct fire.
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Old 05-20-18, 09:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Holdfast View Post
resistances is good. That's why I was thinking its the fuel map too lean or something. This is the variable dwel I'm using. Direct fire.
Excellency. That was my thread! I never had any issues running those in wasted spark or direct fire and I beat on both setups. My concern is that there is something else wrong that you may be masking with higher dwell values as the car should be capable of running perfectly smooth with 3000ms. I last ran 3000ms on my semi peripheral port, idling at about a 12.5afr while lighting e85 without any issues...so I doubt its the dwell is causing the issue
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Old 05-21-18, 03:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Skeese View Post
Excellency. That was my thread! I never had any issues running those in wasted spark or direct fire and I beat on both setups. My concern is that there is something else wrong that you may be masking with higher dwell values as the car should be capable of running perfectly smooth with 3000ms. I last ran 3000ms on my semi peripheral port, idling at about a 12.5afr while lighting e85 without any issues...so I doubt its the dwell is causing the issue
I figured it out. I leaned out the idle areas a little bit. Runs smooth now.
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Old 05-21-18, 05:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Holdfast View Post
I figured it out. I leaned out the idle areas a little bit. Runs smooth now.
I'm in the Bay Area (South SJ) if you need any further assistance. Didn't realize you were local until just now. Those were our dwell tables, glad you found them.
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Old 05-21-18, 10:26 AM
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Originally Posted by SirLaughsALot View Post
I'm in the Bay Area (South SJ) if you need any further assistance. Didn't realize you were local until just now. Those were our dwell tables, glad you found them.
Those were my dwell tables, but I digress.

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Old 05-21-18, 11:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Skeese
Do you mean closed loop fuel control? During high vacuum decel you should be cutting fuel and just letting it spin, or if you don't use the overrun fuel and are instead still fueling why would being in closed loop matter? What significance would a afr target have there? Curious to the reasoning...

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Well first I need the table correct before I cut fuel using throttle off overrun, I thought I was pretty close last time out so I put closed loop back on, but now it hesitates when I am going between 0 throttle and 5% throttle cruising around. Maybe i just need to turn it off and find a big hill to coast down at various speeds so I can get those values spot on for vacuum levels off throttle.

The closed loop settings let you choose min and max values for operating in closed loop, I just didn't know if the min value should be set to a value that you realistically get cruising, so it doesn't try to auto correct when you are off the throttle.
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Old 05-21-18, 05:05 PM
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Originally Posted by SirLaughsALot View Post
I'm in the Bay Area (South SJ) if you need any further assistance. Didn't realize you were local until just now. Those were our dwell tables, glad you found them.
I was trying to get a hold of you before when I didnt know what the hell I was doing. Car runs good now tho. Im glad I did it myself. Learned a lot doing it. I didnt know a damn thing about tuning before, and still have alot to learn. But everytime i play with it or go on this site i learn something new and it keeps getting better. Whoever's variable dwell table it is. It works great.
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Old 07-17-18, 01:12 PM
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Just coming back to this. In case anyone ever encounters the same issue here are some changes I made.

My flat-shift setting on the power cut tab was set to 0. Whenever the ECU detected wide open throttle, it tried to check if I was flat shifting. Since I don't have a speed sensor, it always thought I was shifting and would cut the fuel to bring the RPM down. Immediate full cut. Ouch!
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