hi all
i tried my 20b fd3s at the drag but cant even finish 400m because or constant tires spin at all gears (th350 auto). while speed grows it become harder and harder to keep car streight.
look at the photos, i tried 5 times and each time i draw black lines on the asphalt.

i use 345 BFG drag radials for the rear.
OHLINS damphers, softest on rear and hardest on fronts.

I tried with front skinnies, it adds some tracktion but rears are spinning all the way anyway, that gives bad time at the finish.

i guess all 20b equipped cars are not longer in 50/50 weight distribution, much more in the front.
does it mean i have to put big pockets with sand into the rear?
this sounds not as that good idea because we are triing to decrease weight of the car, not add it.

how do you solve it? please advice
thanks!

 

forgot photos, here it is

 

How big are your drag radials, from the looks of it you have drifting tires on your car, which is not good for drag. You might want to get some BfGoodrich on a 15" race wheels, so you would be looking at tire size 325x 26"x15", you got the tranny from Freddy brown right, I know who you are... i will be going to moscow someday with my girlfriend seeing that she is russian

 

the tires are BFG 345x30x18, i know i better use MT ET DRAG on 15s , this is that i am planing to get in the next season.. but anyway i think 345s should work much better...

welcome to moscow! contact me when you come here i'll show you around.

the tranny originally was bought from FBPeformance... that was a long story...
It broke after first race, almost everything goes down inside ,starting from planetary gears to clutches. i tried to get their help online because sending it back to them and then back here is too expensive from here and also requires a lot of time. It took almost 2 months for them to "think" about my problem because they were too busy with other customers so I just lost that time. After all they said that they cant help me remotely. So I dismounted it myself and ordered broken parts from CKPerformance. I founded that FBperf used standard BorgWarner clutches for all gears and other parts are also stock except their allum. drum.. I can not be sure here because I am not an auto tranny guru but rollerized bearings and red clutches with other high perf parts that I bought from Alex at CKPerf looked much better and hopefully it is working well now even after 20+ races. Thanks Alex! Another big trouble with FBPerf that they significantly missed with stall speed of the torque converter. I ordered 4500rpm stall but actually it handles well only after 7000RPM. So now my race RPM curve is from 7000 to 8000, ****! I am going to send converter to CKPerf as well to decrease stall speed. Season is almost over here now and I completly lost it because of FBPerf!

Btw, I do not reccomend th350 for the 20b owners because seems to be it is too weak for it. I think I will brake it anyway with 1000+HP and good torque converter.I am runing just 26PSI now but planing at least 30. Nobody makes upgraded planetary gears for it and 300M shaft and I think they are weakest parts.. Also just 5 clutches is not enough at all..
I had to buy th400 or that much better is geforce/liberty sequential, now i understand that. I just thought to make the car a little more steetable but with the converter that I have now it is crazy to drive at 6000+ RPM on the steet.

 

go w/ a 15 inch drag radial and run a pretty low air pressure. the increased sidewall will absorb some of the deflection that's making the car want to go sideways. also you should replace all your subframe bushings to solid mounts, it'll make the car less squirrely.

 

Getting your torque convertor stall speed correct should fix a lot of your problems. Looks as soon as your convertor comes on stall you are blowing the tires away.

A 345mm BFG drag radial should be able to hold the power better! Also, your "track" surface (street) does not look to be prepared with VHT.

I also wholeheartedly agree the TH400 will be a much better choice. It too will be a 3 speed, so you will need to choose appropriate final drive ratio (I hope you are not running the stock 4.10!!!).

Mike

 

yeah, we still do not have good drag prepeared roads here. maybe next season...
just standard asphalt the best that we have here for now.
do you think i better keep 345BFG?
but.. yes i am running stock 4.1... do you reccomend 3.9 from the auto? this is the lowest number for the stock dif as i figured out before...

 

perhaps change your rear end out to a Ford 8.8 and run like a 3.23 rear end, either that or switch to a powerglide.

 

i thought about ford 9 inch rear end.. but i already invested a lot into 300m axle bars,drirveshaft and tomei 2 way lsd.. its difficult for me now to throw it away and buy something different..
if there is a way how i can run well with 4.1 final gear i want to follow it.

are hks drag damphers MUCH better than my OHLINS for drag?
probably i better try with 28" MT et drag tires and hks drag damphers.
i think the main problem is because weight of the car rear is much less than front...

 

the weight distribution might be a small problem, but it shouldn't be that big a problem. as long as you're not unloading the rear suspension, the accelaration of the car should keep enough weight over the rear tires on the first half of the run. and on the second half the downforce you're generating while your at speed should help keep the rear planted.

 

there is a thread around here about a traction control unit, but I can't remember where, I was thinking about looking into the benefits of one.

 

Yea i had bad experience from FB too with a toyota supra i was racing team with, we had a Glide and it broke the smae things you just mentioned... how did you mount your setup with the 20B, and sure i will call you when i plan on going to Russia, my girl is from Penza which i think she said it was 18 hours away....lol Freakin russia has to be so damn big for...lololol

 

RaceLogic.


-Ted

 

I have internal traction control system in my EMS ( AEM ), just havnt setup it yet.
but i never heard that race cars use it...that is a power loss anyway. i better try to fix tires/road problem and save power for the race.

T88Rx7, send me a message once you will be close to a visit. You are lucky that your g/f is from Penza but not from a city like Vladivostok, that is much much more far
btw, how did you meet her, over internet?

fdracer, is it nesessary for me to get a better rear wing, how do you think?

I used FD auto bellhousing and custom made adapter plate. The one that FBperf sold me was NEW manual bellhousing from a 88 FC. there was no way to fit starter in the FBPerf setup so I rebuilt it. Full custom solid tranny and dif mounts, I do not use PPF any more.
Thus if anyone wants FBPerf parts ( manual bellhousing and adapter plate) let me know.

BTW, we also bought Acosta dog tranny for another project (600HP 13B fd3s) and it broke as well. What a tranny misluck! We havnt opened it yet so I cant tell that exactly is broken there. Its hard to believe that they use it for their drag cars...

 

HKS Drag Dampers will help, 90% of your problem is the 18" with no side wall to absorbe torq shock. Don't worry so much about your front/rear weight distribution, but more on getting the center of gravity in to the middle of the car (left/right) so the weight will transfer to the rear evenly on the launch.

 

what kind of power are you making on our setup?

i met her thru a Russian guy friend of ours, Im learning a little sooner or later you will be having some Latin Russians...lol

 

no, just work on switching to a 15" rear wheel and tire and maybe some softer rear springs. what spring rate do you have in the rear.

 

thank you very much for your advices!
definetly, I will change to 15s.
unfortunately, I will be able to test it just in the next season...
what tires and size do you reccomend? i think MT ET DRAG 11x26x15 will fit with no problem...
is it nesessary to have drag skinnies in the front or I may just use thin normal front tires, like 175/60R15? (175 is a width, around 7 inch)

OHLINS rear and front spring rate is 11 kg/cm^2

 

I dont think it's really required that you run a drag skinny up front when using slicks, it's just something to save weight.

Those spring rates are rather hard though, especially for drag racing! My Zeal coilovers are 10kg front, 11kg rear and they're set up mainly for road racing. I would imagine that if you were to switch to rear slicks, that you might want to consider dropping the rear spring rate to a 8kg-9kg to get a better launch.

Although i dont know a ton about drag racing, so i'll wait for other people to chime in...

 

The HKS Drag's have 4kg springs and a super slow rebound... basicly the *** end drops to the floor and stays there till the end of the run...

 

you have a link about these springs?

 

Anthony, if i remember correctly Albert is using HKS drag coilovers in the supra for like the last 2 years now. bought them from Paisley and had nothing but great things to say about them

 

I have to say thanks for the pics they are awsome, very nice looking car you have there. Sorry i don't have any good advise for you, just had to give you props on the car.

 

Yes we did have them on the supra, great engineering on this kit, highly recommended for any drag car with IRS, I will be using it on my 20b FD. for NOPI next season hopelfully... just have to see how the funds turn out...

but if anyone can get great link on these suspension please post, i need somemore input on them.

 

i run the HKS drags on my fd and i like them....They work good. i havent compaired them to any other type but for drag racing they do the job. Managed to get the front end off of the ground even in the first time out testing with them..
Greg