I've also noticed that the Evans website states their coolant requires much higher flow rates ("theoretically approximately" 27%) through the cooling system than water-based coolants due to the Evans coolant's slightly inferior heat transfer abilities. Their follow-up claim saying that "it is possible that less flow increase can provide the same, and even increased, heat rejection" sounds rather dubious. For those using the Evans coolant, how are you boosting the water pump flow rates?

 

Pretty lengthy discussion on Evans in the Single turbo section here:

https://www.rx7club.com/forum/showth...ighlight=evans

 

Over the last 7 years and 90k miles, I have had two motor's coolant seals fail on me(no blown apex seals).

I asked Rob at Pineapple what I can do to avoid this: He installed Silicone coolant seals and recommended Evans coolant for my engine that they rebuilt for me(Malloy Reman).

Hope this helps. I'd like to get more than 45k miles out of this motor.

 

Actually, super-clean water can attack as well. I don't recall the exact reason, but I was recently dealing with piping that carried ultra-pure water - they needed stainless steel everywhere.

Dave

 

Now that's what I'm talkin' about! (although a bit more eloquently expressed.)

 

Ya know, he's (Rob) a very well respected engine builder- I don't think I have ever heard even one negative about him. That's the route I'm going to go when the time comes......

 

The chemical reaction causes "microattacks" on the rubber? What the hell are "microattacks"?

This then allows the coolant to weaken the rubber further?

Your statements are complete gobbledygook with no scientific basis whatsoever.

It's amazing that people find this to be "infomative".
Oh, I forget that these are forum memebrs.

 

You should change your forum name to Mr. *******.

I said "microcracks" not "microattacks".

I'm just relating information that has been scientifically PROVEN by ENGINEERS at Gates Rubber Company regarding hoses wearing out from the inside out.
It directly relates to O ring failure and EXPERTS like Rob at Pineapple Racing obviously agree with me since he
recommends silicone replacement and non-aqeous
coolant.

Apologize like a man you little puke or **** OFF...

 

I wonder if anyone has even thought of trying to manufacture a crush seal gasket similar to a head gasket on a piston engine. I don't remember how long they genterally last thought so maybe that's not that good of an idea. It still wouldn't prevent overheating damage as it's pretty much the equivalent of warping a cylinder head. Aluminum endplates would help that, but that would be pricey. But it may help the time/temp issue.

 

Someone asked about the how the evans was holding up. I was one of the "test subjects" of Rob@Pineapple. I'm running my car with a 0 pressure cap, and over the last 3 or so years have had no problems with it. According to the Power FC, I see around 89C with normal driving. Under 13+psi and down at the drag strip (Or any road thats wide open.) I see usually 93-94C at most. If I shut it off it'll go to around 100C, but once started it cools down almost immediatly.

Lets not forget something else about evans- It elminates the boiling assocaited around the spark plugs/exhaust vavles. Something water/coolant does'nt do. CJ

 

who all has water temp guages and monitors them?

I do...pp13b does...who else in here.

if not...thats yer problem....gotta watch those temps like a fat kid would the last ice cream sandwich...one eye on em at all times.

hehehe

j

 

Regarding the distilled water attacking the block, I'm finally starting to believe this. Mazdatrix told me the same thing, tap is actually better because all the dissolved minerals reduce electrolysis or ECR or whatever from the block itself. I was skeptical but I let them go ahead with it. Either way its not like its hard to bring a few gallons of distilled with you to the shop, but I want to do the right thing. This is an interesting discussion because it upholds their recommendation all along, 50/50 coolant/water using normal tap water, just like any other car. Ironically people who are running more and more aggressive water/coolant ratios are actually increasing corrosion inside the engine in the interest of protecting the very thing they are hurting.

 

I always assumed the o-ring failures were due to the excessive heat cycling that the rubber is subjected to. High temperature can cause the polymer to degrade (breaking of covalent bonds), thus lowering it's molecular weight and making it brittle. Also, when the polymer is heated up, molecular motion increases, allowing it to crystallize as much as possible, again making it brittle. Sort of like annealing metals.

Keep in mind that these processes occur very slowly over long periods of time.

This is my 'alternative' theory, and I'm sticking to it

 

Scientific basis, courtesy of a forum member:

http://www.gates.com/brochure.cfm?br...ocation_id=541

 

Only problem with Evan's is that it has almost HALF the thermal conductivity of water. Ouch.

Also, it is (Propylene Glycol) 100% water soluble, so don't listen to that nonsense about getting 100% of the water out of your system.

Thing is 50/50 mix of water @ 15psi only boils at 123 deg C

What is the thermal conductivity of air? You will have countless air bubbles at the hotspots in the engine- right where you need the cooling!

As for the 100% water soluble comment- Great, that is just what you want, all the the water boiling out of the system VIOLENTLY at its weak *** boiling point, just what you want....

If you look at the "hot purge" directions on Evan's you alreaddy know you don't have to have 100% of the water out of the system, but anything over 5% by volume is risky and unsafe!

 

Because of radiation, several parts per million of water is actually H3O which causes conductivity, and makes the water slightly acidic.

 

I concede

Ahh, I see that comment about 5%. That's what I meant when I said that one particular line. It should be easy to get at least 95% of the water out of the system.

 

Thank you sir.

I have not, and never will - blow smoke out my ***.

 

HAHAHA! I would NEVER argue chemistry with you lest
I get my pee-pee wacked!
:

(Read this link:

http://www.gates.com/brochure.cfm?br...ocation_id=541

suggested by JohnChabin a couple of posts above - it may change your mind about the time involved - touche.)

 

heck, you dont even need water for a chemical reaction between iron and aluminum. Just being in contact starts to corrode them.

 

OK. I misread that but what would you expect to happen? Macrocracks or big-**** cracks to occur first?

Perhaps those engineers have proven that hoses wear from inside out. What does that have to do with O-ring failure other than the fact the both the hoses and O-rings may be made of similar material?

Your logic is really skewed. Has Rob at Pineapple Racing told you that he is recommending silicone replacement and use of Evans coolant because he susbscribes to your electrochemical theory causing O-ring failure? Or is it because of some other reasons, such as higher heat tolerance of silicone and better cooling properties of the Evans coolant?

Do you know enough about electrochemical degradation to tell me that it doesn't occur with silicone and Evans coolant?

I think most would regard you as a semi-intelligent person if you backed up your points with scientific proof or sound reasoning rather than name calling and cursing, two techniques which find ignorant and stupid people resort to.

 

Thanks for the link but I had already done my research before I posted.

 

Sometimes we take things too serious cause we don't know if someones bustin our ***** or just plain sarcastic. The smilies are fun but I don't think everyone would flip everyone off in person.

Anyhow, like I said if we replace the iron side housings with Racing Beat's aluminum housings that are allready heat treated, we get rid of most of the iron. What is left? ...the end housings i think? It's twice the cost but 1/3 the weight, butif it's as tuff as RB claims it should be less susceptable to warpage!

What was that Jim Carey movie where he talks out of his ***? "lol"

 

I just love ignorant and obviously uneducated people that hang themselves with their own "words":

1) Now you've introduced "macrocracks"? Obviously
an invention of your juvenile mind and lack of
command of the English language.

2) The fact that similar materials could degrade from
a chemical reaction is more than just curious, it's
known fact. We're dealing with polymer
technology that was invented 20 years ago,
and implemented well into the late 90's.
Something the rather well educated Engineers
at Gates have studied for a long time. They have
obviously come up with some brilliant solutions to
this insidious problem. Too bad we don't have
access to O rings that have benefited from their
technology. Silicone will have to do in the meantime.

3) Yes, Mr. *******: I do have scientific education
to back up my thesis: A Masters Degree in
Chemistry, A Commercial Pilot's License and 25
years of work experience as an
Airframe and Powerplant Specialist with the Federal
Aviation Administration. When an engine fails in an
airplane I'm one of the the guys they call to come
to the crash sight to find out what went wrong.
I've also owned my FD3S since it was born 11 years
ago, have rebuilt half a dozen 13B's and countless
boingers that fly, float and **** competitors on
drag strips and road courses on a continual basis.
I do this just for fun, of course.

How many motors have you built lately?

4) Not only have you managed to admit that you
don't have a clue what you are talking about, you
have shown obvious disdain and lack of respect
for other forum members who quite frankly have
forgotten more about this stuff than you can ever
hope to learn.

5) Your lack of remorse for personally attacking me
for no obvious LOGICAL reason except your drug
induced haze has marked you forever as an
immature jerkoff punk that doesn't know **** from
shinola. How typically boring of a Kalifornian with
racing stripes...

If you don't have anything positive to contribute to this forum why don't you go hang with your Honda Ricer buddies?I'm sure they will be impressed with your lack of intellect, social grace and insight.

Like I said before junior:

 

I think Ron K has just thrown a temper tantrum.