Rx-7$4$me

Hey all, I'll keep this short and simple. Tonight I noticed that my tranny is becoming a bit more vocal with me

If I have the clutch in, it starts to make a noise that sounds like rattling nails around in a can ( not like detonation, a little bit heavier) once I engage the clutch the sound goes away immediatly.

Sometimes its more difficult to get into first too, but it never blocks me out entirely.

A bit of info.

Tranny has 88k miles on it, clutch is semi old and I changed the tranny fluid about 5k miles ago.

SpeedKing

iTrader: (4)

Sounds like a bad throwout bearing.

As for getting into gear, when taking off from a standstill, try shifting into 2nd gear, *then* 1st. This helps line up the synchros and you should be able to get into 1st gear easier.

GoRacer

iTrader: (2)

Sounds like 1st is gone. Hold the shifter while in 1st and depress the accelorator and release. Can you feel the shift lever move forward and back at all as you push and release the pedal? ...if so, bad gear. When it kicks out of gear then that gear is completely gone and the shattered parts can destroy the rest of them.

GoRacer

iTrader: (2)

I think throwout bearing is the opposite. The noise would go away when the clutch is depressed. Is that not correct? ...or am I remembering that backwards?

Rx-7$4$me

Yeah I do the 2nd first thing too, and I also thought it mighta been the throwout bearing.

The bad first gear thing? you think so?. If the shifter moves up and down it usually means a bad trans mount in most cars. My drivetrain is sloppy as helllllllllllllllll. Once the motor goes Im fixing the hell outa all of it.

maxcooper

Just to clarify, what do you mean (in terms of foot on or off the clutch pedal) by these:

clutch in (I assume foot on the pedal, pushed to floor)

engage the clutch (I assume foot off the pedal, or at least not pushing on it)

My tranny makes noise with my foot off the clutch pedal. I can put the shifter in neutral and take my foot off the clutch and the tranny makes some mechanical rumbling noises, much louder than "normal". When I press the clutch pedal to the floor the noise slows and then stops in a way that the noise seems very clearly related to the tranny input shaft turning. Something is messed up inside my transmission. So, I decided that I need a new tranny (well, a used replacement).

If you are getting noise with the clutch pedal pushed in, it might be your pilot bearing. That might cause some occasional difficulty getting the tranny into first gear, too.

-Max

Rx-7$4$me

Sorry I should have been a bit more clear.

I'm using the same terminology

IE

Clutch engaged (foot off the pedal) is when the noise stops entirely the second its fully engaged

clutch dis-engaged (foot to the floor) is when the noise.

I thought it was just drivetrain related as my drivetrain is INCREDIBLY sloppy right now. It feels like my PPF exploded and im driving around like that heh. I know my motor mounts are shot as wel.

But yeah, I'm not too familiar in the area of the tranny/clutch so try to use more lamen terms. Transmissions are my total week point. I can pull the motor, know it pretty much up and down, can do everything down to the block, but I dont really know where to start with the trans. I know the terms themselves but I know not what the items you all speak of do.

it doesnt matter if the trans is in neutral , or any gear for that matter, if the clutch isnt engaged it makes a ton of racket. But the second its engaged fully it all goes away ( aside from my drivetrain moving all over the place when Im engaging it to move the car)

Thanks for the help everyone.

GoRacer

iTrader: (2)

I had bearing problem on my Honda but I can't remember if the noise was when I pushed the cluth pedal in or out.

The movement of the lever I was refering to could have been the mount since that was broken but eventually it started to kick out of gear all the way which was a broken gear.

Rx-7$4$me

okay so we got one for pilot bearing and one for throwout bearing.

A little update. The car still drives okay aside from going into first gear, but the racket is pretty loud. It tends to shake alot when I start moving from a dead stop as well.

One new thing I noticed today is that I get the noise also when I start the car, but its not constant its more like a

Chugga... chugga.. cha chugga,.. cha chugga... its pretty hard to explain.

So how difficult is the throwout bearing and pilot bearing to replace? I dont know very much at all about transmissions.

Thanks in advance

ZeroBanger

You need to get it fixed right away. I had the same problem it was my pilot bearing. That was a cheap part, but because I kept driving it my input shaft went bad. Thats not covered in a standard rebuild. The inputshaft alone is $700.00. I ended up buying a new tranny, cause the cost to rebuilt was $2100.

Rx-7$4$me

oh man thats not good. How difficult is it to replace? Whats invovled? Are there any how to guides out there, or does the shop manual cover it?

DamonB

I've had a couple throw out bearings and a couple pilot bearings in my car which were replaced each time just because the tranny was out. In neutral with the clutch released you can hear a low growling noise that goes away the instant you depress the clutch. It's not loud enough to make you think something is going wrong but it always been there. The Mazda throwout bearings all just growl a little when there's no load on them I guess.

FYI: If the clutch is not depressed then the engine and input shaft are turning at the same speed, so the pilot bearing is not doing anything. If the clutch is depressed then the engine and input shaft are not at the same speed so the pilot bearing is spinning and at the same time the throwout bearing is under load while it spins.

Noise with the clutch depressed can be either a pilot bearing or a throw out bearing. Difference is that if it's the throwout bearing it will normally growl all the time, getting much louder when the clutch is depressed. A pilot bearing will only make noise when the clutch is depressed and shutup when the clutch is not depressed.

Regarless of which it is the tranny must come out. Replacing either isn't hard although you do need a pilot bearing puller for that one.

Rx-7$4$me

it must be the pilot bearing as the noise goes away if the clutch is engaged. Well, dropping the tranny isnt a big deal to me, I might as well check out my PPF and upgrade my clutch while its down there.

How much does a pilot bearing, and the puller required generally cost?

Would I be better off having somewhere like a-spec to do it?

Rx-7$4$me

I'm going to be pulling my motor this winter as well... but im assuming leaving it for that long is not a very good idea.

Are there any clutch kits that come with a new pilot bearing/ throwout bearing? I want to try to make this as easy as possible

What else should I do while im down there?

Mahjik

iTrader: (1)

The ACT kits come with both bearings. They don't come with the dust/oil seal for the Pilot Bearing though, so you might want to order that from Mazda. It's only a $2-3 part.

Rx-7$4$me

Ahh good to hear. That makes it less hectic.

What about the pilot bearing puller?

Mahjik

iTrader: (1)

I got my Pilot Bearing puller from RX7.com.

Your best bet is to find someone local with one to borrow. I think some of the shops around will let you borrow the tool for a week when ordering a clutch kit.

I've read that you can rent a gereric type puller from most auto shops that will work; but I don't have any experience with that so I don't know if that information is correct or not.

Rx-7$4$me

okay well im loaded with questions, so heres another.

I dont have a flywheel stopper, although I MIGHT be able to get ahold of one. If I need to use a breakerbar to get the nut off, I'm gonna need some room underneath the car, will three be enough room for me to do it? Or would I have to find a lift somewhere.

My second question is, Im going to be rebuilding my motor this winter, if I remove the clutch and flywheel then ( after I replace it now) will I be able to just put them back together? Or will I have to worry about resurfacing the flywheel? While im down there should I get an S/S clutch line, replace my fuel filter etc? What else do you reccomend I do ?

Steve

And thanks again for the help.

Toadman

Yep. I have a new OEM clutch and it still makes some noise in neutral with clutch out, although much quieter/ less pedal vibration than when the clutch and T/O bearing were hosed.

Rx-7$4$me

So whats my best bet? can I see if the T/O or the pilot bearing are shot from under the car? or do I have to drop my trans?

zUMIEz

iTrader: (2)

Sounds like you have enough miles on the thing that you should just do a clutch job. That would include the throw-out bearing automatically and then do the pilot bearing just as a good maintenance step.

Mahjik

iTrader: (1)

You can see the T/O bearing from the tranny access panel, but you won't get a good look at it unless you drop the tranny. The pilot bearing will pretty much need to be removed to see it so you may as well replace it when doing a clutch job.

Rx-7$4$me

My father thinks its the throw out bearing, he made me do some tests and thought it was that. He said the greese just probably wore out. Now if you mean depressed do you mean engaged?

My dad said there should be a bit of play in the clutch so that the throwout bearing isnt touching the pressure plate, so he says it wont make any noise untill the clutch is disengaged and the throwout bearing hits the fingers on the pressure plate.

whta do you think?

GoRacer

iTrader: (2)

I'm trying to remember mine. I'm pretty sure when idle it sounded like a bolts in a dryer spinning around. My broNlaw told me just replace the clutch with the bearings. I also replaced the flywheel with a lighter one. I ended up replacing the trans as well from nippon motors, unfortunately they are out of FD ones right now. I never fixed it and kept driving so the trans went bad. This was for the Honda but same theory, right?

You can get the tools from Mazdatrix

technonovice

You can remove the pilot bearing with a blind hole puller set rental from Auto Zone. Very cheap and works well.