bloodredgt

Ok... I'm sure you've had a lot of newbs (like myself) come through this forum and ask the same questions repeatedly over and over again. I myself am a forum surfer and get annoyed when that happens. But when the search function doesn't give you results, I have no choice but to ask.

I currently own a 1991 Toyota Celica GT. It's my second car after my first 1982 Toyota Celica GT (sold). Next year, I'm going to buy a "weekend car" and make my celica a daily driver (which it already is).

I'm a lover of the 90's Turbo decade. That's why I looked into the "big 4." Mkiv Supra, Rx7 FD3S, 3000GT VR4, and 300ZX TT. Since 3000gt VR4 is such a porker, i decided against it. 300ZX TT I've heard, you have to pull the motor every time you want to do something to the engine, even install a dp or replace turbos.

So it came down to the last 2: Mkiv Supra (NA or TT) and Rx7 FD3S.

My brother owns a MKIV Supra NA at the moment which he's gonna get a TT swap for. So cruising supraforums under his handle, I researched high and low about the supra and steps to modifying it to be faster.

Since I have about a year til I get my next car, I wanted to research and learn more about the Rx7 FD3S so I don't buy it and not know anything about it.

I've gotten Supra owners' opinions about their cars and what they think of it compared to the Rx7 FD3S. Many of the supra owners being former rx7 owners.

What do you love the most about your Rx7? How do you think it compares to the Mkiv Supra (NA or TT)? What do you hate/dislike about your Rx7?

Thanks Ahead of time.

theantirotor

iTrader: (1)

the v8, and you're welcome

MisterX

The RX7 is the only one of the four that has its own chassis. All the others share theirs with sister sedans. In this department it's a helluva lot less compromised than those other sportscar-wannabes.

As for the Mitsu being a porker, yeah, it is. But, the 300Z and Supra are no lightweights with both tipping the scales at roughly 3500 pounds.

I can't help you in the engine department (I'll leave that up to more knowledgeable members), but as far as driving dynamics and "feel" they just don't compare with the FD.

What purpose are you going to use the car for?

bloodredgt

I'm looking to modify the car for performance. Maybe the occasional highway run, drag race, track visit, canyon carving, mountain pass driving, and road racing.

kim307

iTrader: (1)

Brace yourself first for anywhere from 9 - 18mpg....on the highway.

When buying a RX-7, expect the car to have a rebuilt engine unless the car is really low mileage and in exceptional condition. The blue book/Edmunds value do reflect prices of cars with rebuilt engine since those price guides are based on market sales price and most, 99%, of RX-7 do have a rebuilt engines in them. Rebuilt engine isn't really a strong value adder unless they're just rebuilt with 0 miles on them. (Of course, rebuilt engines are more attractive than original engines. And professionally built engiens are more attractive than home-rebuilt engines, unless his name is Rob at Pineapple or something.)

When someone tells you the engine was rebuilt 3k ago, but the coolant seal is bad....walk away or negotiate the price down. They were negligent and/or abusive on the new motor. Or sometimes the owner can do everything right, but still engine goes bad within the first year of rebuild, nothing you can do - that's just part of owning a RX-7.

And please, save yourself the headache and feel free to buy a car with mods. You get them at a value. If you don't like it, just sell 'em off or if you're feeling generous, you can just post here and I'm sure that someone would be more than happy to swap with stock part for you free of charge.

And please do look at the car as a whole, not just its unique powerplant. You will see a lot of arguments how people bought their RX-7 b/c of the engine, blah blah blah, and how the Mazda engineers built the car around the engine and all other variations of that crap. Ignore it. You don't marry a girl based on her genetic materials, you evaluate them as a whole human being. (Yeah, you might dash at some girls for their unique attributes, but trust me, you don't want the drama associated this babe.) Take that approach to buying a RX-7 and feel free to knock prices off if there are parts/function missing that make the car less than whole. Don't be blinded by, "it's a true sports car." type of excuses and excuse of a buyer for not having A/C working by saying, "you don't buy this car for the comforts, it's for performance."

Can't really compare against Supra since I have never owned one myself, but I just like the looks of RX-7 much better. RX-7 feel light and nimble on the road(Mazda feel), where as Supras are stout and powerful(toyota/lexus feel). RX-7 just feels(based on shot gun impression in a Supra) and looks more spirited.

dgeesaman

iTrader: (7)

From the FAQ, the 3rd sticky thread on this forum...

Buying an RX-7 / Buyers Guide / Used Car Shopping:
http://rx7.voodoobox.net/infofaq/bguide3g/bguide3g.html
http://www.scuderiaciriani.com/rx7/buying.html
http://robrobinette/buyaused.htm
http://www.epinions.com/content_92709097092

The last one is my own opinion of the car.

ROTORhead93

A damn good one at that.

Pretty much sums up the basic in's and out's of an RX7 right there. Great job man.

bloodredgt

how would you eliminate AST?

Also, more opinions are welcome.

1QWIK7

iTrader: (33)

if you dont really care about looks, get the supra, the rewards are much better..some people will def disagree with me on this but hey, this is an rx7 forum so i expect that..

the FD is a far better looking car out of the whole bunch you mentioned, when something does go wrong, brace yourself cause it MAY cost you hundreds, maybe even thousands..not so much that the task is worth that much but finding out what the actual problem is will prob add up to that amount...

like right now, im having an idle problem..i didnt start the journey of finding it and fixing it and it depends on how well you know cars or not and your patience will def play a part but on these cars, sometimes the best of mechanics get stumped and still pay the piper..

since i have to swap out the uim/tb anyway because i have a polished one, i might as well work from there and find out what the idle problem was..

DaveW

Great review, Dave. I'd never have the patience to write anything that detailed!

dgeesaman

iTrader: (7)

My job got boring for a little while. Then I revised it a few times.

Dave

rx7n3wb

Uhh, why are you bringing a common V8 swap argument into this? It's just common sense your going to look at other parts of the car besides the condition of the motor (not what motor it is..)

Also I wouldn't always recommend buying a car that is already modded.. I'm sure many have found out the hard way what a mess it can truly turn out to be.. I bought a "stock" car that I found leftover messy jobs from the previous owner. Unless the person has all his receipts and can prove the mods were installed by a reputable mechanic, your most likely getting a DIY job that may or may not have been done right.

Bloodredgt: You can read all the reviews and opinions you want, but you should really take the time and get into all of these cars for a drive and see what it is you like.

Kento

I second DaveW, very well done. I wish more people would read that before jumping in headfirst into the deep end and then sitting on the bottom wondering why they didn't check to see if there was any water in the pool first...

coolvette

first question,how much $$ do you have to spend on a car?The same yr and mileage supra costs around 35-50% more.moded cars,maybe a little less.Do want the fastest car on the hwy, or the most hp on a dyno, get a supra.If you want one of the best looking and MOST fun to drive get a fd.If you can get a low mile stock fd you wont have all the problems that other moded and abused fds have.I know this because i am on my 2nd low mile fd and both have been very reliable.

Julian

iTrader: (14)

And some are still on their first FD with original engine, after 10 years. They are high maintenance but I have never been left stranded like I have with a '68 Triumph.

POS7

Isn't it horribly expensive to convert na 300zxs and supras to even stock spec twin turbos. People talk about doing the swap a lot, but is it really worth it? Of course you can turbo the n/a but it won't be the same as just buying a turbo supra.



I'm still on my mazda original, so maybe I'm not as experienced as you but I think the mazda original is better than the rebuilt motors. Original motors last between 80k-110k if taken care of. So I think original engines are more attractive if the car is 60k< on the odometer.

Key word is reputable mechanic. Many will not give a f-ck because its not their car. If you want something done right......


If you have the money for it, I'd say to go for a low mileage supra tt. Its probably involves less headaches. The rx7 is a bare bone sports car (I'm surprised it came with a/c ) The supra is more of a GT car. Many non-enthusiasts don't seem to like the rx7 because it doesn't have the creature comforts that many other cars do.

darkphantom

iTrader: (2)

double post

darkphantom

iTrader: (2)

Be ready for low gas mileage. & the more mods on your car the more you must be aware of your gauges which you must keep an eye on. & like coolvette. make sure what you want the car to do. otherwise you might spend on something you dont need!
below is some threads that you should read. These will let you konw what your in store for.

https://www.rx7club.com/showthread.p...ht=gas+mileage
https://www.rx7club.com/3rd-generation-specific-1993-2002-16/do-you-work-your-car-439337/
https://www.rx7club.com/showthread.p...ht=gas+mileage
https://www.rx7club.com/showthread.p...ht=maintenance

joeyz87

I'd take the rx7 over a supra. You really have to drive one to understand how good they handle. 50/50 weght makes it much quicker through turns. What good is having lots of power going into a sharp turn.

bloodredgt

I've already driven the 300ZX tt, 3000GT VR4, and a Supra NA. I've ridden in a modified 300ZX TT, 3000GT VR4, and a 800whp Supra. Still haven't gotten to ride or drive a Rx7 yet.

So far from what I'm reading, Rx7's are like high maintenance girls. If you don't take care of them, they'll screw you over. Yet if you take GREAT care of them, the rewards will be priceless. That correct?

What I don't understand is the modification side of owning a Rx7 FD3S. Basically, with the other piston driven cars, basic bolt ons like cat-back, dp, or intake don't require any tuning of the a/f ratio. Someone enlighten me on the modification side of FDs plz.

stump example (for me): getting a cat-back exhaust, intake, and dp requires an a/f ratio controller? maybe even a fuel pump?

DrunkenGimp

iTrader: (3)

I love my fd more than any other car. The supra is great too, my cousin has the turbo model (97 i believe). Both are really fast, but the supra wasn't as fun to drive, I think it has something to do with the weight. Both handle great, both have good acceleration. The supra is better for making power simply because the stock internals are good to like 800 hp. However if its not to be a drag car I would chose a rx7 for the driving fun... It just FEELS better IMO.

The thing is reliability. Supras are know for reliability, FD's are known for breaking down. Granted, it all comes down to how much you want to take care of your car, but those are the generalizations.

POS7

Correct about the high maintenance girls.

Bolt ons will require either a boost controller - stock ecu can be used, but boost should be set to 10 psi. A/F controllers (IMO) are somewhat uncommon for these cars. More common is an ecu replacement to handle/tune for the a/f ratio. the stock ecu for the rx7 doesn't correct for mods, and is programmed to handle stock parts. (dont know if that makes sense for you).

Higher boost should be accompanied by a reprogrammed ecu or an aftermarket ecu.

The mods you listed, cat back, intake, and dp are commonly accompanied by an aftermarket or reprogrammed ecu. If you decide you need to set the boost much higher than stock levels, the fuel system (injectors & pump should be upgraded as well) - requires tuning.

JConn2299

One thing about the Supra......there are damn few turbo ones with a manual transmission. Most that were sold were naturally aspirated or had automatic transmissions, or both. There may be some conversions running around, but the number of original turbos with manual transmissions is small.

bloodredgt

Pertaining to the money question: I already have 15K to spend on the car. My parents are going to help me for up to 10K on top of that, so TT supras are within reach. I'm still even considering the NA supra since they can be turbo charged and run 340 whp at just 6psi on stock compression. I've ridden in one of these cars and I've gotta say, it's FAST. The reason why I want to consider the Rx7 is to find which appeals to me more, Supra or Rx7. I mean, it would be pretty sweet to have a MKIV supra parked next to a Rx7 FD in the same garage now wouldn't it?

Since I know most of my stuff coming from a piston point of view, I just want to learn more about the rotary point of view.

I still don't know how an Rx7 feels compared to a Supra, but I have a year that it can come into play.

Most people I know that I've gained knowledge about modifying cars from don't even mention using a Power FC. Making it a mystery to me. What exactly is it used for? Most people I know (mostly Supra owners) go from S-AFC II with VPC combo to the AEM stand alone unit.

FLA94FD

The RX-7 is cooler to drive, it not an everybody car. On public roads I would give the Supra turbo edge its easier to drive especially in the rain. The suspension of the RX-7 is pretty much race ready and needs few enhancements to be race ready. For a daily drive the Supra is vastly superior. It’s faster in stock trim and handling would probably come down to the driver.

My stock RX-7 up to 70,000 was extremely reliable. The only parts that needed to be replaced were oil sending unit, water pump, and the precat. I guess you could throw in front brake rotors and lots of oil of course. The car was taken to redline multiple times daily. Change the oil every 3000 and coolant once a year and stock car will hold up.