Hmm..that's similar to the FEED type....

Wouldn't a shock absorber type...pretty much alleviate your fears on damaging the UIM, espescially since all it's doing is dampening the movement?

 

I would think so, I also would think it wouldn't last long, from the constant action, but who knows. At least this one appears to be beefier then the Feed unit.

 

It depends on what material is used to damp out the vibration inside the damper unit. I'm waiting for a response to an email I sent Chuck asking what exactly that material is, since it's shown in one of the photos, but there's no description of what that sleeve is made of. If it's polyurethane plastic, then it should last for quite a while, depending of course if it is built correctly. Not sure if any rubber types would work as well or last as long.

 

I don't think it's an elastic damper at all. The picture on the Rotary Extreme site shows that inside the aluminum case the actual damper has "Stabilus" written on it. Looking on the net, they are a German manufacturer of hydraulic dampers. I think it is probably a hydraulic damper similar to a shock absorber.

I am considering this one or the Garfinkle one and am trying to wrap my head around which one would be better. With the hydraulic damper I would be concerned that it would still allow a large amplitude movement of the engine if the damper is not stiff enough. The Garfinkle brace would also dampen vibration but not allow any large amplitude movements. Has anyone checked out the Rotary Extreme damper to see if it's worth it? There's also the Feed, which is the same price as the RE. For whoever said the RE looked beefier, if you look at the actual damper size in the aluminum case it looks like the Feed.

 

Get Garfinkles and try it out after talking to him . If you do not like it he will refund your money .Or you could resell it easily .You will notice that you have never seen one for sale used in the for sale site .

 

Damn, good eye! That's what I get for using the shitty monitor at work And my laptop's screen that I use at home isn't big enough to show that detail (although I guess I could've enlarged the photo somehow...). Looks like it may be the Garfinkle brace for me at this point....

 

That Stabilus gas spring is available for about $15.00 retail at just about any auto parts store. It's made in Mexico, even though the brand is a German name.

Unfortunately it was not designed nor ever intended to be used horizontally, only vertically. Not to mention the extreme under hood temperatures DIRECTLY above the turbos that we encounter. While it PROBABLY won't explode (unless it's involved in a fire) it sure as hell will leak past the seals within a few thousand cycles and lose it's nitrogen charge.

Add some bling machined brackets, housing and a few off the shelf fasteners and bah dah bing. For $245.00?

I think Chuck's a really good guy and a smart businessman but frankly this is

Sorry guys - I call 'em like I see 'em.......

 

Here is the torque brace I made

 

NICE!! I like the abllity of it to deflect increasing force.....
kind of a "leading link" design, simple, effective and won't ever wear out.

Very good design. We're talking "ghetto" but in a thoughful way that won't put stress on parts not designed for it.

A big thumbs up!

How much for a copy?

 

I find it pretty humorous that with all the misgivings about stress to the engine hoist bracket, the manifold, the fender, etc., people have been using these for years, and i haven't heard of one instance of any of the above failing or being damaged.

I also find it humorous that these braces seem to enjoy alot more acceptance when they are manufactured by Japanes tuners for umpteen gazilion dollars when compared to the home-brewed variety.

japanese tuner worship and couch-engineering at its greatest

 

Well, here's one guy that had a problem:

"...dont be so sure about the engine wall either..mine is cracked around the brace. I think it's from engine braking....the engine torques the other way and pulles the brace away from the wall." - FDOkinawa.

I've heard of several others cracking as well. I STILL don't think anyone has engineered the ultimate solution, but ya gotta like Resource's approach. Clever.

I think the ultimate solution would involve some sort of visco-elastic rubber that is designed for high temperatures/loading to replace the stock mounts.
There's ALL kinds of stuff out there that didn't exist in 1989.

Hmmm...... Time to dig into some aviation resources - I smell NEW GHETTO MOD!

 

Well, first off, what about Poly Urathane engine mounts !? Or I've seen solif engine mounts with a small ball mount or something to allow sort of pivoting on 1 axis... for installation ?

Dunno...

All I can tell you is I had a semi Home manufactured Tourque brace (Solid Aluminum Rod and Mounting Plates With PolyUrathane Dampeneners).
I had troubble with the alarm since the vibrations caused the Alarm to go off intermittantly when under Turbo Time... (A Concideration)

The other thing is that when I wrecked the car, going backwards into a sand dune (flipped on it's roof) the entire engine and tranny moved 1"-3" backward and the tourque brace broke a piece of the Intake Manifold / Engine Hoist off.... (The Top Bolt broke out)
So yes when you strap your engine down and apply sufficient force to it something has to give...

I'm unshure as to what I'm going to use on this go around, probhably will ivest in feed mount to circumvent alarm problem... maybe it won't make a differene... or I can turn the sensetivity down.... Dunno...

-DC

 

to all those considering the feed/hpi brace, take a look at hole the brace attaches to on the fender side bracket. it looks like there's about 2 or 3mm of metal. kind of a weak point i thought. i would like something a little more holding those 950lbs. i'm leaning toward the garfinkle brace, but resources brace looks very nice, and ron's got his thinking cap on too it seems.
great info on this thread by the way, engineers kick ***!

 

hey resource, the engine torques the other way. . .

paul

 

I had some polyurethane engine mounts made but I had the center of the mount made with a more plyable urethane than the rest so it would torque a little bit and the softer material also allows for vibration absorbsion. I am installing then this month and should be able to give some feedback later.

 

here are some pics of the garfinkle piece. . .

 

ahhhhhhhhhh, crap. . . those are tiny

 

Nah, he's got it right, but it needs some sort of heavy duty *spring* in the mix to allow the fixed rod to extend so that the engine can rotate counter clockwise and the rod to pivot around both fixed attachment points. Kind of like a shock absorber spring, but in extension instead of compression.

It's a damn good basic design, and he may have inadvertantly stumbled onto something really good.

At present it's still a rigid mount - tied into some heavy duty load bearing points - but still rigid....
The mass of the engine has got to rotate or all you'll have is problems with transient vibration. That's why I think EVERY design so far sucks. But as usual, what the **** do I know?

The "leading link" type of suspension has been around for at least 100 years. I think it was first proposed by a guy named Earles. Simple is good.

 

Ahhh, good thinking. Dampening and spring rate. That's what the solution is all about.

That, and not costing $245.00.

 

I think Resource has the best idea yet other than possibly the strut tower brace/air pump bracket design I have heard of but never seen. Resource's brace is wonderfully mounted to the engine and will see no load issues, and the opposite side is attached right to the frame rail. Can't do any better than that (other than I would still need some sort of bushing to keep my teeth from rattling).

On another topic, I think the whole JDM Movement (my words) is ridiculous. I have no problem with well designed and engineered parts, but just because it comes from Japan and requires you paying too much to an importer just to get it doesn't make the part sound. The Feed torque brace is a prime example. You have to jury rig it just to make it work with our LHD ABS in the way! But hey, you have something that says "FEED" under the hood and I am sure the guys at the local Sonic have never heard of that! Must be good, right?

JDM parts are like designer clothing labels. People just like to have them because somebody somehow determined they were cool and if you don't have them then you're not cool.

I will now get off my soapbox and go put my velcro tennis shoes back on

 

The Forum at it's finest Love these kind of threads.
Around and around the debate goes. Once a year the same thing over and over again. LOL. Hi Pete.
Crispy
- contributing nothing...this time around.

 

First off.. Nothing in the engine is made for this.. So get over that.

Second, I believe resources is the best design so far but time will tell. IDK how effective it is so low on the engine but oh well. I believe that solid engine mounts are the best way to go but what do i know.

Hope people can come to a conclusion.....

 

when the engine is under load with rpms rising it will move the other way. this will pull on resources mount. im sure that engine will have some serious power to put down so itll have its fair way with the metal its connected to on the car. on the other designs, the engine pushes against the fenderwell. does this make sense? the brace is gonna try to "pull" the engine to the drivers side while its under load, this could have some bad results down the road.

of course, everyone is skeptical about all the other mounts and their long term problems. the garfinkle unit has been in place for a while. not sure how long david has had it on his car, but ill know within a day (ill be over there tomorrow). he wouldnt have put it on there w/o thinking it out. the fender side of the brace is a large mount that helps in distributing all the load that the engine places on it. step on a nail. . . ouch, now step on a hundred nails all packed into saaaaaaaaaaay 1/2 square foot (whatever, youll get it). . . which situation will hurt worse?

ron, i wanna hear more about your spring idea. . . im not sure what you are talking about. sounds like jumble.

paul

 

haha, crispy. . . this is so true. . . its like synthetic vs. conventional!!! both the same. too many cheifs if you ask me. hahahaha.

paul

 

I posted in a different thread, and no one really responded, so I will post it here. What about Solid mounts? This is where mazda intended the engine to mount, so why not keep it there. The inner fender is not designed to take the stress of the motor, I don't care what anyone says. This doesn't mean that the Feed style brace wont work without any problems.

ZoomZoom, I would like to hear more about your motor mounts, this sounds like a good idea also. Any Pics, how much did it cost to have the made?

How hard would it be to make solid bushing?

High horsepower cars have been using solid motor mounts for years, why not put them in the rx-7. I would think this would solve the entire problem.

Just thinking outloud.