ArchangelX

I'm not sure if the car would even function without the turbos..heh..but how much horsepower does just the stock block make?

I know on my WRX it's about 110 to 120hp...

I tried doing a search but couldn't find anything.

rynberg

Not very much. I would guess not much more than the 86-88 13B with 146. The 89-91 13B N/A has higher compression rotors. So maybe 150? I do know that on a dyno run with a boost leak (damn i/c couplers), I only hit 190 to the wheels with downpipe and cat-back exhaust.

RonKMiller

Stock FD3S with turbos off line: 180. More than enough to drive around town with.

Completey worked race engine with no turbos: 300

My golf cart, 3. But it's electric!

Average human: 1/4.

Don't you feel.....inadequate?

ArchangelX

Woah...

That's just as much as my Celica. Man...this rotory engine is impressive.

How much of a drivetrain loss is there? Hehe....it's 12% with the Celica..

reza

to run N/A, I think you need to do the following:

1. raise the compression.
2. tune the map to stock.

without these two, the car would run less HP than N/A.
I think to accomodate turbos, the engine would need to have lower compression. And now its tuned rich as well for turbos, so to run N/A you need to lean out the A/F.
I would think you can get something close to 200, for properly tuned n/a engine.
I dunno...

reza

RonKMiller

Ummm, not really. I drive around all the time during 110F ambient air temps in Tucson with the boost off- line. I've done it for 5 years. No big deal. Just cap a few vacuum lines and Badabing, n/a. Still runs great, and you hardly notice it just crusing around town or on the highway. Turbos are just "icing on the cake".

I'm a founding member of the STPS (Stock Turbo Preservation Society.) Our little HT's HATE extreme heat, and I have a really hard time keeping my foot off the floor.

maxcooper

If you removed the turbos from the car, you should get something around 150HP as others have said. Consider that the intake pressure is 24.7 psia (10 psi boost) to get 255 HP, the HP at 14.7 psia (atmospheric pressure) calculates out to be 152 HP. That formula does not account for temp differences, etc., but it seems like a reasonable estimation.

-Max

ArchangelX

Thanks guys...a fountain of knowledge.

Hmm..just outta curiosity..has anyone ever tried running N/A?

Not that I'd want to...hehehe...turbos are just too cool.

reza

RonKMiller,

Can you tell me the hoses capped to make it run N/A ?
Does oil and coolant still flow to the turbos?

Reza

RX7SpiritR

iTrader: (1)

A stock N/A FD engine comes with 190 horsepower, then with turbos of course it generates 255. My dad's first getn only had 110 or something like that. Kinda funny, but it was still fast!

RX7Elmo

Average human: 1/4hp.

Actually, the average human makes considerably more than that. I believe it's more like 4hp or so, and of course more or less depending on the person themself.
hehe..i'm random

Danny

neo_omega

is it FEED or Knightsport has a 300 NA FD? I think they have those parts for sale.

Shinobi-X

So then on average, a non-turbo charged FD is making roughly 58% of it's power.

RX7SpiritR

iTrader: (1)

if that's 190 HP then yeah!

paw140

So you are saying the average man is 4 times as strong as a HORSE? Maybe Arnold, but not me!

Horsepower is the amount of work that the average horse can do in a minute. James Watt, back in the 1700's found that an average horse could do 33,000 ft-lbs of work in a minute. He came up with this when he was using horses to pull coal out of a coal mine. I'm sure a human couldn't even come close to this.

RX7Elmo

that is the older definition. Now a horsepower is something different, something like how fast you can go up a certain distance over a certain time. Just put it this way. Do you honestly think that a 200hp engine is as powerful as 200 horses? I personally think not. Or say your lawn mower is 5hp, i no for sure it isn't as strong as 5 horses.

Danny

paw140

I just described how horsepower was derived, but it is still 33,000 lb-ft/min, or 550 lb-ft/sec, or 746 watts, whatever. There is no way a human could do 4 horsepower's worth of work. And yes, by definition, a 5hp lawnmower engine can do the work of five average horses. It just makes small amounts of torque at very high rates of speed to give it high overall power.

ArchangelX

Wow..my first 4 star thread...

I'm so cool. And thanks for the info...kinda nice knowing I can still beat a Geo Metro even if my Turbos go out.

maxcooper

Unless I am mistaken, there are no NA FDs. So there are no 190 HP NA FDs, OK?

Watt noticed that a horse could lift some amount of weight some distance in some time period. That isn't really a test of the horse's entire dynamic capability, so it is at least conceivable to me that a human might be able to produce more than 1 HP in some set of circumstances. It seems very likely that a horse can make more than 1 HP as it gallops away from a stop. A horse can take off faster than a 2 HP go-cart with enough ballast weight to equal the weight of the horse, for instance.

This whole discussion is pretty academic -- unless you literally remove the turbos, you aren't really running without them.

-Max

ArchangelX

Er...if there's no N/A FDs...what the hell's that about?

neo_omega

Let me clear that. There are Aftermarket NA FD. Those NA FD are Aftermarket tuned. I never said those NA FD are stock.

ArchangelX

Ah...that's what you meant.

Well..I knew that....

jimlab

No, this entire discussion is absolutely ridiculous.

No one in their right mind would knowingly disable the turbo system to run their engine "naturally aspirated", and anyone who did so would find out quickly how well the turbos hold up free-spooling without the backpressure of the intake system.

The car will run "naturally aspirated" well enough to move around the driveway or in the shop if you had to, but that's it. It's nothing you'd want to take out and drive around town, and if you tried to run the car hard in that configuration, you'd quickly over-rev your turbos and more than likely cause some fairly expensive damage.

Furthermore, since the rotors in the 13B-REW are 9.0:1 compression, less than that of the naturally aspirated 13Bs (9.4-9.7), it would more than likely make LESS power than an NA 13B, especially with the restriction of the turbos and exhaust manifolds in the exhaust.

The 9.4:1 NA 13B ('84-'88) was rated at 146 horsepower, and the 9.7:1 NA 13B ('89-'91) was rated at 160. 190 horsepower from an NA 13B-REW?? I don't think so.

cruser

After my car was stolen, it was returned without the ic. When I sold the car, the guys drove it home n/a. Drove it from north of Seattle all the way down past Portland without a problem. They were very careful and I am sure it didn't have quite the grunt as the last time I drove the car before it was stolen, but they had zero problems at all.

RX7SpiritR

iTrader: (1)

actually tough guy, I believe that there are stock N/A FD's that they put out! And Yes cool guy they do come with 190 HP! ^_^