Half bridge R.I.P
 

Well i just finish swapping out to a new fuel pump aeromotive 340lph, 850cc primaries and 1680cc secondaries and a FPR, now the car wont even start it turns over BARELY wants to fire up. i tried de-flooding the engine removing all spark plugs (clean them till they look out of box) removed the egi fuse and deflooded it, it should start but it still does the same thing, made sure the pump is well set and not coming off the feed line. im out of ideas guys, im so frustrated ive spent alot of money on the car and its been sitting longer then its been on the road, i bought it in july its had 10 miles (around the block) on the chasis im close to selling this =( i have some logs, at my last attempt to turn it over idk if it would help anyone to understand the cause of this problem :(

thanks for looking over this



(edit) before i swapped out the fuel stuff it started up (just the injectors where maxed)

Jump the the battery and try starter fluid.

thewird

hey thewird! thanks for the chim, yeah I have a wall plugged battery charger/starter regardless if the battery is at 12.3v the car tries and tries to turn but it doesnt fire up, before i swapped the fuel, it would turn over and id notice that the turbo would try to spin, but now turbo still (no exhaust at all)

what setup was on the car previously and did it run ok on that setup?

Check for the usual fuel/spark.

thewird

@RotaryEvolution: it was the stock fuel, not really the injectors where always over 70% and when id step on it alittle bit, the injectors would climb fast and then my fuel cut setting kicks in!!

@thewird: i quad checked the fuel pump made sure it was pushing fuel , so on the top of the feed and return i unplugged the feed and made my sister turn the key ON, starts squirting fuel like crazy, also when i tell her to turn the car to ON FPR jumps to 40 then drops down to 0, untill the car starts to turn

Check for spark, then try starter fluid. What are you using as a map right now?

thewird

double check your injector wiring. generally problems like this are related to a faulty injector clip or injector wiring solder/crimp(engine trying to start on one rotor). you can backprobe the injector wires at the ECU, they should all be near 12v with the key to on.

try the starter fluid thewird recommended and see if it responds, indicating you may have one rotor running with no fuel.

one other thing i have seen with 850 primaries is they are not sealed properly to the primary rail, the 850's are a shorter injector not designed to be used as primaries. if they are not sealed the 850's will allow fuel to push into the intake manifold through the non sealed lower portion of the injector through the rail, which would also explain why the pressure is dropping to 0 immediately after the priming sequence is completed.

when i install them i simply double up the lower injector o-ring underneath the pintle cap to seal the injector to the lower portion of the rail(another lower injector o-ring).

Pressure dropping to zero after fuel pump primes is pretty common place with the Aeromotive FPR's. Some hold pressure, some hold it for a while, others drop immediately.

thewird

yes, most aftermarket pumps don't have a check valve but most i rarely see drop to 0 within a few seconds, generally they bleed off slowly within a few minutes time. still suggests to me that the fuel may be getting dumped.

hey guys i appreciate the help everytime i refresh and read what you guys have to say i go outside and do as followed, sparks there tried it and i see it sparking, so thats not the issue, now ima see if they are seated properly.

@thewird uhm im using an OLD BDC map idk if i can upload it here but i can get u a mediafire link
BaseMap_8501680_HBPFD3S_ZS_010709.dat

Take a picture of the voltages menu on the commander. If you have starter fluid onhand try it.

Ah, I forgot about the pump side. I always assumed it was the regulator since 99% of rx-7's all use the same regulator. That actually makes more sense.

thewird

ok checked the primaries clips for voltage with the key ON, both read 12v's ,
i checked every single fuse on the car all work. =(

@Rotary, how would i be able to check that heres a shitty picture drawn by the one and only (me) on how i set up the fuel lines, idk if it has anything to do with my issue but here it is http://i47.tinypic.com/144sut.png

UPDATE

well i did an old WD40 trick to it, i stick some WD40 on both of the boost guage and B.O.V nipples on the UIM, the car started ran for like 10 seconds (prob wd40 ran out) then turned off, so atleast now i got an idea, its FUEL RELATED

i want to thank you guys sincerely for chiming in it means alot guys

Probably just needs more fuel in the tune. Try running the car with the vacuum line disconnected for the fpr.

thewird

that is true, you might have a point alright ill give that a shot right now, did you see the basemap i found for it? i have it linked on one of the post, let me know what you think criticize the poop out of it

I'd rather not comment on BDC's maps. Just grab the whole vacuum part of the fuel map and add 10% of fuel and see if that helps.

thewird

hes a great guy!, i found em on some really really really old post! and i tried pulling the vacuum line from the FPR still nothing, the wd40 does someone the trick till it burns off! but hey did you see the picture i sorta drew does is it set up right?

The fuel hookup looks fine. Try adding 10% of fuel to the whole fuel map, then try 20% etc.

thewird

you got it! ill try it tomorrow! i gota do other stuff, thewird it was a pleasure man, you have a great night! ill let you know how it goes tomorrow

UPDATE

been doing some hard thinking! when the fuel pump primes i have a 340lph aeromotive fuel pump, i connected it straight to the stock fuel pump feed adapter, i been thinking that maybe when it prines and pushes the fuel threw the lines and makes it to the FPR, by any chance would the fuel be pressured backwards threw the fuel lines and out the adapter? im not sure if the aeromotive comes with a check valve but ima check tomorrow!

Lack of a check valve is not related to your problem. That only has to do with when you shut the car off, it continues to hold pressure which isn't important.

thewird

how about the conjunction with the metal feed tube and the aeromotive feed side? wouldnt a leak cause that to fail ?

Your getting a steady 40 PSi when you flick the key and the fuel pump is on aren't you?

thewird

Swapping to 850 primaries was a big no-no. And then 1680 secondaries.
So far behind the current use of better injectors.
You did not do your homework.
Pull out those 850 and install IDs 725s or 1000s.

Since all went bad doing the injector swap, that proves the error area is just that.

@thewird naw when i turn the key on the pump primes but when it shuts off the fuel pressure drops to 0, im not sure if i stated that but i think i did =/ while the key still on the ON position

@cewrx7r1 yeah i did my homework got the 1680 with resistors i know they are low imp but hey its all i got =(, and do you think its better if id go 550/1680, cause im really just trying to hit anything in the 400-500 range, nothing more , and safely drive it to a good rotary tuner

But when the fuel pump is "priming" (which really just means its on), the fuel pressure is a steady 40 psi correct? If so then its working fine.

On a side note, you do know your 850 primaries are low impedance as well correct? Or did you use the stock 850's.

thewird

@thewird: when i turn the key ON fuel pressure guage reads 40 then drops to 0, i leave the key ON, it doesnt hold the constant pressure

sorry about the bold just it was weird and confusing typing that lol!

and yeah i used the stock 850 from the secondaries

Yes, that is normal. When you flick the key, the fuel pump comes on for 2-3 seconds then shuts off. When it is on, the fuel pressure is stable at 40 psi. That is what i ment.

thewird

Ill take you a video just incase

Tow the car over to my house and I will get it running for you.

Where are you near text me 7863463501

sounds like one of the primary injectors is not firing, bad wiring or bad injector clip. could be a stuck injector also. were the injectors serviced while they were out?

No they where not ima take them.out to see

I'm sub-500hp with a BW S366 with all bolt-ons, and I'm using Injector Dynamics 725 primaries and 2000 secondaries. With my VERY conservative tune, I'm still reaching high duty cycles.

UPDATE 11/3

ok i got the fuel pressure to stay at 40 and i clean and flushed the engine, the engine just doesnt want to start i even have the original 550cc primaries idk what to do anymore =(

Did you change the map to a 550cc one? Try the stock base map.

thewird

yup changed to the 550cc, and tomorrow ill try the stock base map, but its weird it all happened after fuel swap!

the plugs got cleaned they look new
deflooded procedure just incase
made sure fuel pump was good

I'm going to get flamed for this, but throw the apexi in the garbage. hahaha hate that thing.

your problem is in the map, go on your desktop and look closely at any basemap and compare it to the map you have in the apexi.(I assume you have datalogit?)

A friend had similar problem, make sure the map was uploaded properly.

Something I just realized. That BDC base map you posted is set to use the GM 3 bar map sensor. If your using the stock one, you would have to change it back.

thewird

and sometimes it's best to just save your $ and pay a shop to do the work.

put the 550's in, intialize the pfc and replace your spark plugs(i do not care if the old ones are sparking or not) and try to start the car. the 850's will flood a borderline engine, and i semi recall your engine being on its last legs.

Agreed ^

thewird

hey @rotaryevo , Ill give it a shot tomorrow if that doesnt work ima just take it to the shop and no I bought this.new engine lol it was half bridge ported

indio: im sure to load the map its , open it with fc edit and aftrr it loads up hit write all, also what ive noticed is the fc.commander doesnt go past the APEXI loading screen it.just stays herre anyone thinks.my ecu is fried, I should of went aem instead

LOL, blames ECU instead of realizing this is beyond his comprehension.

thewird

just forget it , ill fix this without your help,i already fixed the pump,always got act all kool
and make fun of the new guys. "thanks for the help rotaryevolution"

The answer to fix your problem is already in this thread and yet your blaming ECU's instead of just making your car work. You keep ignoring what people are telling you and doing your own thing.

thewird

Ive done what exactly all rotaryevo has told me and that helped me on figuring out the problem back to the pump, now be quite with your worthless remarks nothing you've said has done any good