wstrohm

Well... I would have to disconnect the fuel hoses to release the main harness. Although the engine compartment connections are almost undone, there are a couple of brackets holding the harness near the firewall that look difficult to deal with. The trouble I see is threading a new harness through the firewall and dressing the leads and connectors inside the passenger cabin. It also looks like the windshield wiper motor would have to be dismounted to get to the firewall area. I see another day's work at least.

I am waiting for a price quote from Ray Crowe's folks. I have a quote of $1286 for the main harness from Huntington Beach Mazda, and $252.32 for the fuel injector. (Hopefully Ray is cheaper.)

Mazderati

iTrader: (3)

Could be either in my experience; -05ZF is likely no longer available if -05ZG is listed.

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

i'm not sure what the difference is, but if you order an ZE or ZF, you'd get a ZG. Ray will be much cheaper than $1200. last time i did one is was right around $1000, shipped to Canada

the little ignition harness usually is ok, and actually isn't too bad to change by itself, although you're in there...

wstrohm

The wire harness replacement may be moot, for me. I took a second look at the installation and decided the routing through the firewall is inaccessible, unless I remove the entire ABS assembly. Not happening! Getting air in that unit would be un-fixable with my garage equipment. Bleeding wouldn't do it.

Sgtblue

iTrader: (16)

It's not a walk in the park, especially with big hands. But you don't have to mess with the ABS system to get the harness through the firewall. Helps greatly with two people. One feeding the connectors and the other pulling gently to get it out and vice-versa.

dgeesaman

iTrader: (7)

I did it myself and my hands are large. The rats nest and fuel lines come out, ABS stays, the LIM stays too. Just take careful pictures of the harness routing.

David

wstrohm

Hadn't thought about removing the fuel rails & hoses. Thanks for that info. Will take another look. Meanwhile, I have yet to receive a price & availability response from Ray at Malloy Mazda.

Sgtblue

iTrader: (16)

Not mine, but this might help too.....

wstrohm

Sgtblue,

Thanks for the photo with connectors identified, that will help a lot! Hopefully buying it new includes the covering over the leads, not just the wires as shown in the pic.

OK, you forum wizards have convinced me that it can be done. Looks to me like I only have to remove the fuel hoses and the brackets holding the harness to get the current one out. Probably will tie a nylon rope around the passenger cabin end of the new one and feed that through the firewall. Then ask wife to gently guide connectors and harness into the cabin while I feed the harness in from the engine compartment. Hopefully that will work. It's still scary.

WAIT...WAIT...WAIT! What are the "Manual Transmission Disconnects" in your picture? Where do they go and what do they do?

DaleClark

iTrader: (55)

If you want to totally pull the engine harness out:

- Unplug connectors at ECU, make sure to unbolt the 10mm ground wire. Also there are a white and a blue connector up against the firewall, unplug them. There's a harness cover held on with 2 10mm fasteners, unbolt that.

- Unbolt the various 12mm bolts that hold the ABS pump down and wiggle out/remove the ABS heat shield. That will give you some extra working room.

- There are a few connectors that connect to the transmission - speed sensor, reverse sensor, etc. Jack up the car and unplug. The harness runs along the top of the transmission.

It sounds like a bigger project than it is. Getting it off the transmission and out of the firewall isn't hard at all. Getting all the connectors off the engine (CAS, OMP, etc.) is what takes more time IMHO.

I normally only pull and mess with harnesses when I'm pulling the engine. If I were in your shoes, I'd repair what needs to be repaired on the harness with it in the car and go on about my life.

Dale

wstrohm

Dale, I've been on again-off again about the harness, but after getting a good look at Sgtblue's pic above, I realize that I have no easy access to some of the endpoint harness locations, such as the OMP, CAS, that you mentioned. So now I think I'll let the old harness be and just replace the fuel injectors. Connectors with broken locking tabs will just have to be touched with with some red Permatex gasket maker and pushed into place. When the engine needs an overhaul, then the harness can be replaced with engine out of car.

Thanks to everyone for your help!

wstrohm

Now awaiting two new fuel injectors & seals. Ordered from Ray Crowe, price $192.23 ea. Checked price here at Huntington Beach Mazda: $252.32 ea plus 8.25% tax. Amazing.

jza80

iTrader: (32)

As far as broken connectors, I found that I had a couple on my car from a previous event when I had it apart for fuel hose replacement. I was able to get new replacements from Rywire. they are not difficult to replace using the stock connector pins, or they also sell the connectors with flying leads that can be married to the harness. They were about $10 each.

wstrohm

@ jza80,

Thanks for the tip! I'll check out "Rywire."

Orbitalmovment

iTrader: (2)

Did you ever get a quote from Ray on a new harness?

I'm almost exactly in your shoes right now, I'm leaking fuel and before I tear into it I'm wondering if I should buy a new harness or work on a used one I have.

wstrohm

Yes, his price quote was $850 for the main harness (Illustration #1) and $80.04 for the coil harness (Illustration #2). He wrote that the fuel injectors were "3-4 days out" from a warehouse somewhere in the West of the U.S.

If you are considering a new main engine harness, you might want to check out Rywire's harness ($649 on their website). You might also be interested in this video explaining their "Tefzel" wire type.

jza80

iTrader: (32)

The Rywire harness is a good product but it does not have all the plugs to retain the airpump system as I recall. That rules it out for a CA vehicle that has to undergo smog check. If they offered a complete harness then that would be a good proposition.

$850 for a brand new main harness is a lot of money but it seems like a bargain compared to nearly $400 for a couple of new injectors IMHO.

wstrohm

@jza80,

You are right; thanks for the info. Here is their list of connectors:
I don't see the three ACV connectors or the air pump signal connector.

Two separate issues for me... one of the injectors leaks fuel around its seal; the harness has connectors with a few broken locking tabs. I went for two new injectors and am waiting on delivery.

wstrohm

Pics below are of my "old" (current) fuel injectors. I measured the OD of both uncompressed O-rings on the injectors at 0.850" (21.6 mm). Then I measured the inside diameter of the fuel distributor bore at 0.863" (21.9 mm). Seems to me that the O-rings must have originally been 22 mm or so, but have been "squashed" over the last 21 years. They are also more like plastic than rubber.

So, is it possible I don't need new injectors (which I have already ordered), but just new O-rings? I can't see anything around the electrical connectors that looks bad. Also I really can't see a way for fuel to get inside the electrical portion of the injector. Although when we tested them, the fuel did seem to come up around the electrical connector on the leaking injector, so I assumed that was what was happening.

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

i see them leak around the electrical pins, and there isn't a seal for that...

when you get the new ones you'll notice that your old ones are quite badly faded, they used to be purple

wstrohm

@j9fd3s,
Thanks for the info. My approach now is to install new O-rings on the old injectors and test them under pressure. If they still leak, I will ask Ray to send the two new ones that are due to arrive at his place today. Until then, I asked him to hold them for me. If no leak, I will let him know and he can do whatever with them.

FWIW, I am having trouble seeing any way the electrical connector can leak. It looks like the plastic connector assembly contains a coil that energizes the pintle assembly by magnetic induction, although I admit that is speculation. If so, the connector assembly can never see fuel. I do admit, though, that the leak appeared to be coming from the connector area.

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

its weird, but they do it! i recall the first one i saw was at the dealership. this roachy silver/red touring came in with a fuel smell. i had seen a few dampers fail outside of the dealer shop, a friend of mine was the FD guy around here. so we had the damper in stock (or actually i think we stole it from the FD guys house or something)

tech tore the thing down, pressurized the system, sure enough, damper was bad.

replace damper, and recheck, and still fuel leak.

after some poking around, its leaking from the injector pins. replace injectors, recheck, and fixed.

wstrohm

Ray agreed to send me the O-rings and hold the new injectors until after I test. We'll see. Two upper + two lower O-rings = $47.12. Two injectors = $384.46. Obvious which way I would prefer to go. We'll see.

wstrohm

I've been marking time waiting for new O-rings from Ray Crowe. The car has been on jack stands from the beginning of this job, and since I removed the existing fuel injectors, the floor under the car has been dry... until today. Wife smelled fuel; I looked under the car and there is a gasoline drip about 1 every 5 seconds from the front suspension member (rear fork) onto the floor. I checked everything that I am aware of on the top of the engine... all fuel hoses, the FPD, the FPR, the primary and secondary rails, and where I could not see, I ran a finger underneath each part/hose connection, etc. Everything at the top of the engine is dry. The ports in the primary fuel distributor are dry all the way down, and of course there is no pressure in the system except for in the fuel tank as the result of some warmer weather recently. I did unscrew the gas cap and got a hiss for a second. But the drip is still there.

If I didn't know better, I'd say fuel is leaking from the turbos, but that's impossible... isn't it? It's definitely gasoline, not oil. From underneath, I can't see above a horizontal sheet metal piece which seems to be the highest point that is wet with fuel.

I'd really appreciate any ideas as to what the heck is going on! A real leak, coming from "nowhere?"

Tom93R1

iTrader: (2)

Fuel pressure in the tank gets the siphon going, fully remove the gas cap and make sure you don't have any fuel line ends in the engine bay that could be below the fuel level in the tank.

I suspect it's going to be your o-rings. I just had to replace mine last year. They were only about 5 years old but one suddenly started leaking. All good now!