Factory Ignition? Hks Twin Power
02-28-08, 11:11 AM
#1
Factory Ignition? Hks Twin Power
so i have a street ported, single turbo 35r, 850 primaries, 1600 secondaries, and 18psi of boost. My question is.... How much will i benefit with the hks twin power ignition? is it really necessary or can i get away with my stock coils/ignition?.....
Thanks
Thanks
02-28-08, 11:58 AM
#2
F'n Newbie...
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I would go with the Twin Power.... it lets you get MUCH more out of the stock system... better safe than sorry, especially when safe means a better, more controlled, spark.
If you decide to get the HKS Twin Power (which I would suggest) you will save yourself a bunch of hassle by going ahead and getting the extra wiring harness too.
If you decide to get the HKS Twin Power (which I would suggest) you will save yourself a bunch of hassle by going ahead and getting the extra wiring harness too.
02-28-08, 07:57 PM
#5
Original Gangster/Rotary!
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I was pleasantly surprised when I recently installed my twin power and junked my Jacobs amp. I wish I would have made the change a long time ago.
Gordon, you've got me thinking about picking up some MSD coils now......
Gordon, you've got me thinking about picking up some MSD coils now......
02-28-08, 08:41 PM
#6
Living life 9 seconds at a time
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On my last FD, I ran 10's on the stock reman, stock fuel lines, and the ignition was also stock with the exception of a turboII coil pack. Car ran fine up to 24lbs of boost. Just keep fresh plugs in the car and don't tune it pig rich. This is a band aid for tuners that dont know enough about tuning, to do it right! If your running some sort of AI, other than straight water, that will also foul your plugs a bit faster so keep that in mind too.
02-28-08, 08:49 PM
#7
Original Gangster/Rotary!
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^^I dunno Ernie, I really noticed a lot of positives when I installed the HKS.
Idle quality was smoother, I had more torque all through the rev range, throttle response seemed better. Car just revved more cleanly, and was definitely more powerful. I feel it was money well spent at this level of mods.
Idle quality was smoother, I had more torque all through the rev range, throttle response seemed better. Car just revved more cleanly, and was definitely more powerful. I feel it was money well spent at this level of mods.
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02-28-08, 08:51 PM
#8
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I wasn't knocking the HKS unit. In fact they had a demo of it at Sema one year and it was quite amazing. 3 times more powerful as the stock unit. I was just from the school, if it ain't broke, don't fix it, lol..
02-29-08, 01:13 AM
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^^I dunno Ernie, I really noticed a lot of positives when I installed the HKS.
Idle quality was smoother, I had more torque all through the rev range, throttle response seemed better. Car just revved more cleanly, and was definitely more powerful. I feel it was money well spent at this level of mods.
Idle quality was smoother, I had more torque all through the rev range, throttle response seemed better. Car just revved more cleanly, and was definitely more powerful. I feel it was money well spent at this level of mods.
Has anybody got any dyno plots showing any kind of HP or torque gains back to back with a stock ignition?
And it's my understanding that the HKS is not a true amplifier or CDI but just a re-striker.
Is that correct?
02-29-08, 08:03 AM
#11
Eats, Sleeps, Dreams Rotary
and i think the subjective part is ok and a big factor. i noticed much better response and over all feel when i installed the twin power. its worth it on that alone.
Last edited by matty; 02-29-08 at 08:10 AM.
02-29-08, 10:40 AM
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i actually made 20 more rwhp.....goodfellas was there. i am pretty sure that it was due to twin power as on my previous tune i made 340 with 11.2 afr then installed twinpower and had a new tune done which was 10.8ish that yielded 360rwhp.
and i think the subjective part is ok and a big factor. i noticed much better response and over all feel when i installed the twin power. its worth it on that alone.
and i think the subjective part is ok and a big factor. i noticed much better response and over all feel when i installed the twin power. its worth it on that alone.
02-29-08, 10:52 AM
#13
Whenever i was at Fugita Racing in japan, they had a twin power demo box setup that you could play with. You could see the spark plugs spark on a stock coil and then you could turn on the twin power. The difference is rediculous. Like Ernie said, it was literally 3 times the spark. I would definately just spend the money on a twin power.
02-29-08, 12:03 PM
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i actually made 20 more rwhp.....goodfellas was there. i am pretty sure that it was due to twin power as on my previous tune i made 340 with 11.2 afr then installed twinpower and had a new tune done which was 10.8ish that yielded 360rwhp.
and i think the subjective part is ok and a big factor. i noticed much better response and over all feel when i installed the twin power. its worth it on that alone.
and i think the subjective part is ok and a big factor. i noticed much better response and over all feel when i installed the twin power. its worth it on that alone.
And while I intend to get a Twin Power in the near future, it just gets frustating trying to tell fact from fiction with some of these systems. What with no hard data to back up their claims.
Another question, is it worth going to say, MSD Blaster coils with the Twin Power?
02-29-08, 12:28 PM
#15
are there any gains/safety to be gained from just changing the coils on the FD or are those only realized through the use of a CDI?
Also, i've heard some people mention running LS1 coils, but couldn't find anything on a search. Were they running them with CDI's? What's the advantage there?
02-29-08, 01:54 PM
#16
^^I dunno Ernie, I really noticed a lot of positives when I installed the HKS.
Idle quality was smoother, I had more torque all through the rev range, throttle response seemed better. Car just revved more cleanly, and was definitely more powerful. I feel it was money well spent at this level of mods.
Idle quality was smoother, I had more torque all through the rev range, throttle response seemed better. Car just revved more cleanly, and was definitely more powerful. I feel it was money well spent at this level of mods.
+1. a lot of noticeable difference. no more exaust popping, and everything listed above..
02-29-08, 04:00 PM
#17
Ls1 coils are supposed to be stronger and not overheat as quickly as stock fd coils. If anyones interested my friend has a dyno maybe I can set up a couple runs. Only problem is im running fc1000 on fc coils and dont know anyone with a hks. if you people are interested in dyno numbers lets set something up. no more debating lets get numbers.
02-29-08, 04:07 PM
#18
I'm probably the only RX7 guy that did not see a gain from the HKS, but an actual loss in WHP. Prior to my 3 rotor conversionfest (new word for me
), I had Pettit dyno my car before and after installing the Twin AMP. No other changes were made. The car made 10 HP LESS with the HKS. On the day we did this test, Pettit had several rotorhead engineers in the shop watching and they were pretty suprised by the results. Had stock coils on at the time. Promptly removed the unti and we had the 10 HP back. Sold the Twin Amp the next day (for more than I paid for it I might add) and never looked back.
I know many other factors could come into play here (bad electricals, coils, etc.) but this is the closest I've ever seen to doing a true test.
Maybe someone else has a before/after dyno testing the Twin Amp?
), I had Pettit dyno my car before and after installing the Twin AMP. No other changes were made. The car made 10 HP LESS with the HKS. On the day we did this test, Pettit had several rotorhead engineers in the shop watching and they were pretty suprised by the results. Had stock coils on at the time. Promptly removed the unti and we had the 10 HP back. Sold the Twin Amp the next day (for more than I paid for it I might add) and never looked back.I know many other factors could come into play here (bad electricals, coils, etc.) but this is the closest I've ever seen to doing a true test.
Maybe someone else has a before/after dyno testing the Twin Amp?
02-29-08, 04:12 PM
#19
I dont think just by adding the twin power youll get more power I think that the capability with the twin power to ampliy ignition allows you to tune a little more aggresivly in order to make more power. So you may have had it tuned a specific way and by adding the twin power and not tuning it with it I could see how the twin power might hurt you previous tune by burning more fuel maybe causing a lean condition.
Chris
Chris
02-29-08, 06:14 PM
#20
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<snip>
I remember years ago the debate about what timing splits to run and whether zero splits helped or were not much gain for the big potential risk of the trailing firing before the leadings. Today, I believe there are many many more people running zero splits without even thinking about this. I know I am running zerosplits on my 20b and have no issues with it. Again, however, the benefits of it are somewhat dependent on the rest of the system (weakest link again).
Gordon
I remember years ago the debate about what timing splits to run and whether zero splits helped or were not much gain for the big potential risk of the trailing firing before the leadings. Today, I believe there are many many more people running zero splits without even thinking about this. I know I am running zerosplits on my 20b and have no issues with it. Again, however, the benefits of it are somewhat dependent on the rest of the system (weakest link again).
Gordon
Only under pressure?
02-29-08, 07:47 PM
#21
Eats, Sleeps, Dreams Rotary
But see, you did a retune before the second dyno test. That alone could be where all the gain came from. An extra 20 rwhp from just an ignition system would be a bit of a feat. IMHO.
And while I intend to get a Twin Power in the near future, it just gets frustating trying to tell fact from fiction with some of these systems. What with no hard data to back up their claims.
Another question, is it worth going to say, MSD Blaster coils with the Twin Power?
And while I intend to get a Twin Power in the near future, it just gets frustating trying to tell fact from fiction with some of these systems. What with no hard data to back up their claims.
Another question, is it worth going to say, MSD Blaster coils with the Twin Power?
believe me i wanted to do the test in a more efficient way but it was a group dyno day and noone wanted to play along.
anyways the hks twin power is def one of the fav mods on this forum. tests or no tests. so basically what i am saying is get the f;ing thing.
03-01-08, 10:34 AM
#22
David... I tend to think your experience may not be a good example here. While Pettit is an old school player, you had Gotham redo your whole motor. Bluntly, I would question how well Pettit tuned your car in the first place, although I think well of them. What ignition system did Gotham install in your 20b? The stock OEM system that Pettit reverted to after pulling the HKS or perhaps something else?
Maybe the Pettit chip had something to do with the results. Bost was about stock (maybe 11 PSI) during the testing.
