Boost Issue Part 2 (Long story, forgive me)
06-07-09, 09:55 PM
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Boost Issue Part 2 (Long story, forgive me)
Hi everyone, I need some help.
I had the turbos changed last year and then, due to a couple of mods, the car was boosting too much, so I installed a boost controller.
Because of the timing, I never tuned the EBC until I put the car back on the road about 1.5 months ago. In the meantime, I also installed a PFS intack/IC.
I had routed the EBC (it's a AEM Tru Boost) in the so-called version "sweet" way. I had problems with it, I put my "Boost Issue" thread up (hence this being part 2) and received very little response, however somebody suggested that the "sweet" way is just plain wrong, so I decided to go back and do it the version 2 way and see how things went.
I dropped down the hood this afternoon and went for a spin. I took my son with me so he could keep an eye on the gauges and I could worry about driving.
It looks like the secondary came on here and there, but most of the times it doesn't and the boost starts dropping as the RPMs climb. I based this on how the car sounded and felt in some of the pulls I did, I also glanced at the boost, but there was a lot of traffic on the highway and I didn't want to speed unsafely, nor could I really get distracted staring at the gauges.
At times, the boost will start fluctuating, almost as if the secondary comes on and dies right after.
The primary is fine, it builds boost quickly and it is hitting 10 PSI after I have played with the EBC setting to bring boost pressure up to 10.
I checked the "plumbing" I just re-did in version 2 installation of the EBC. everything is routed properly.
I checked the connections and they are all where they are supposed to be, nice and tight.
I looked at the solenoids that need to be plugged and I plugged the top side, which -based on the vacuum hose diagram- is the side that I should have plugged.
Because of the circumstances and the timing, I am quite sure I didn't push the car after I got it back from the turbos swap, so I am not sure this could be a problem with the turbos swapped in, or the installation my mechanic did.
He said everything was fine after, if there were problems, he would have told me, as I was trying to determine whether or not the used turbos were working fine, so he knew I wasn't going to pin that on him.
I would really appreciate it if you could pitch in and give me some advice. In particular, not only on what could be wrong, but also on what would be the possible places to look for trouble.
Thank you and sorry again for the long message
I had the turbos changed last year and then, due to a couple of mods, the car was boosting too much, so I installed a boost controller.
Because of the timing, I never tuned the EBC until I put the car back on the road about 1.5 months ago. In the meantime, I also installed a PFS intack/IC.
I had routed the EBC (it's a AEM Tru Boost) in the so-called version "sweet" way. I had problems with it, I put my "Boost Issue" thread up (hence this being part 2) and received very little response, however somebody suggested that the "sweet" way is just plain wrong, so I decided to go back and do it the version 2 way and see how things went.
I dropped down the hood this afternoon and went for a spin. I took my son with me so he could keep an eye on the gauges and I could worry about driving.
It looks like the secondary came on here and there, but most of the times it doesn't and the boost starts dropping as the RPMs climb. I based this on how the car sounded and felt in some of the pulls I did, I also glanced at the boost, but there was a lot of traffic on the highway and I didn't want to speed unsafely, nor could I really get distracted staring at the gauges.
At times, the boost will start fluctuating, almost as if the secondary comes on and dies right after.
The primary is fine, it builds boost quickly and it is hitting 10 PSI after I have played with the EBC setting to bring boost pressure up to 10.
I checked the "plumbing" I just re-did in version 2 installation of the EBC. everything is routed properly.
I checked the connections and they are all where they are supposed to be, nice and tight.
I looked at the solenoids that need to be plugged and I plugged the top side, which -based on the vacuum hose diagram- is the side that I should have plugged.
Because of the circumstances and the timing, I am quite sure I didn't push the car after I got it back from the turbos swap, so I am not sure this could be a problem with the turbos swapped in, or the installation my mechanic did.
He said everything was fine after, if there were problems, he would have told me, as I was trying to determine whether or not the used turbos were working fine, so he knew I wasn't going to pin that on him.
I would really appreciate it if you could pitch in and give me some advice. In particular, not only on what could be wrong, but also on what would be the possible places to look for trouble.
Thank you and sorry again for the long message
06-08-09, 08:06 AM
#3
If it were me, I would first test to see what happens with the boost controller removed and the precontrol and wastegate actuators directly running pressure. This may help you narrow down if it is a boost controller tuning issue or if something else is messed up.
Right now you should have one nipple capped on each actuator, correct? And then you have the pressure source going into the EBC and then out to the other nipple on the actuator. Run the pressure source directly to that one nipple on both actuators. What is your boost pattern now? I would think it would hit 7psi stready both before and after transition.
This is complete speculation, but you are having one EBC control two different boost controlling devices (wastegate and precontrol) and that may not work for yoursetup. The factory system (and the PFC) uses two different solenoids that are adjusted differently. A lot of people adjust boost on the primary turbo (precontrol) with an MBC and then peak boost with an EBC. I prefer using the Power FC because I can electronically control boost on both actuators. I think I may have raised this point in your other thread.
So what I would do is see how the car boosts with straight pressure to both actuators as I suggested. I'm not entirely sure what it's going to do, but it couldn't hurt to try. Then I would consider installing an MBC on the precontrol and controlling your wastegate with the AEM controller.
Right now you should have one nipple capped on each actuator, correct? And then you have the pressure source going into the EBC and then out to the other nipple on the actuator. Run the pressure source directly to that one nipple on both actuators. What is your boost pattern now? I would think it would hit 7psi stready both before and after transition.
This is complete speculation, but you are having one EBC control two different boost controlling devices (wastegate and precontrol) and that may not work for yoursetup. The factory system (and the PFC) uses two different solenoids that are adjusted differently. A lot of people adjust boost on the primary turbo (precontrol) with an MBC and then peak boost with an EBC. I prefer using the Power FC because I can electronically control boost on both actuators. I think I may have raised this point in your other thread.
So what I would do is see how the car boosts with straight pressure to both actuators as I suggested. I'm not entirely sure what it's going to do, but it couldn't hurt to try. Then I would consider installing an MBC on the precontrol and controlling your wastegate with the AEM controller.
06-08-09, 04:10 PM
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Thank you
I understand your point, and thank you for the input, I appreciate it
I did some research when I had to route the hoses and at that time there was no reason for me to think that there would be anything wrong with doing the version 2 routing.
Furthermore, if it has worked better than version 1 for all those who tried it, so my guess is that there is something going on that has nothing to do with the EBC or the routing I did.
I understand your reasoning and the suggestion, however, I would like to see if this route works for me.
Which kind of brings me to the "secondary" section of my questions, which is, what should I look at to find out whether or not the vacuum system perhaps at the turbos, or anything else dealing with the secondary is hooked up properly?
I did some research when I had to route the hoses and at that time there was no reason for me to think that there would be anything wrong with doing the version 2 routing.
Furthermore, if it has worked better than version 1 for all those who tried it, so my guess is that there is something going on that has nothing to do with the EBC or the routing I did.
I understand your reasoning and the suggestion, however, I would like to see if this route works for me.
Which kind of brings me to the "secondary" section of my questions, which is, what should I look at to find out whether or not the vacuum system perhaps at the turbos, or anything else dealing with the secondary is hooked up properly?
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