I do like the rx8 but its no a successor to the rx7. The frs is about the same size as the FC. I wish Mazda would start making cars like that. Lotus exige, frs, caterham. All small with a basic sports car approach. Direct injection on a rotary, why it doesn't need it. A simple intake and a basic efi turbo setup is all the rx needs. The rotary is small with 3 moving parts but Mazda ruined it with a clutter of actuators vacuum lines and unessisary stuff which has always lead to reliability issues. Only 3 moving part no head, no valves, no timing belt this motor should be the most reliable engine on earth.
Mazda needs to focus on making the car simple and affordable.

Mazda needs a back to basics approach to a good looking fun and hopefully powerful car. I know what that motor is capable of, Mazda can do better.

I want a more powerful rx8 and a new compact and simple rx7.
Wish I could work with the mazda r&d team :)

New Mazda line...

RX-8 = 16X 6port N/A Hybrid (300 HP)
RX-7* = 16X Variable Geometry Turbo (400-450 HP)

*Or RX-9 if they want to keep things logical

The miata is the simple car. The RX line is supposed to be the high performance line but Mazda is scared to release a balls to the wall car.

thewird

Direct injection allows for a higher compression ratio and/or added safety for higher boost. I would bet that it would help with emissions as well. Mazda has some impressive technology with their Skyactive Gas and Diesel engines. I would like to see what it can do for the rotary.

Direct injection will raise the cost of the car and make it difficult for tuners. On the other hand U'll probably see a lot more lsx swaps lol
The point is they can easily hit these goals with old tech. I can compete with a modern ls1 with a Holley.

Mazda already had an RX-9 and it was a sedan. We don't need that logic. (I posted pics on in reply #92.)

And your holley gets amazing gas mileage and a smooth quiet consistent running engine. Your goals aren't Mazda's goals. Power is easy, fuel economy and bottom-end torque, and emissions isn't. Do you really think Mazda cares about the tuners but why would it be anymore difficult? Direction Injection is still fuel injection, its just a different injector position LOL.

Carbs are a dinosaur, why was it even brought up :lol:

thewird

My goals are no different than mazdas. Hp is not my only goal. I mentioned carbs because I can get modern results with such low tech. I have to make a lot of parts to do this but I do it at far less cost then efi. I'm just a better tuner.

"Miata is a simple car "no just a slow car. My whole point is hi tech does not = hi performance.
It normally = hi cost and new problems.
I'm working with a small good looking simple car with amazing performance. Rotarys don't need a lot to be better we already now what works :)

In terms of power, yes old technology can get it done. Will Mazda employ older technology just because they could in theory make it work? Of course not. In terms of emissions and fuel economy, both not strong suits of the rotary engine, Mazda will have to continue to refine the fuel delivery which will also in turn help make more power and clean up the exhaust. Mazda can't manufacture a car that does not meet economy and emissions standards, as much as I don't care about government involvement, it is a reality. Mazda does not care about making it easy for tuners to tinker with fuel and timing. By 2017 you'll be hard pressed to find a production auto engine without direct injection and/or a turbocharger. The economies of scale will make direct injection cheaper than it currently is and considering it's currently ending up in some very small low budget vehicles the cost of direct injection will not be an issue. It wasn't that long ago that only certain expensive european vehicles had side impact airbags, HID lights and stability control and 300hp.

cant wait but i think the original FD is always going to be the best

With regard to direct injection, it's PERFECT for a rotary. Same reason they're using it more and more in piston engine cars - you can run higher compression without fear of detonation.

Why? Instead of a fuel/air mix going into the combustion chamber, you have just air going in. At the point you're compressing the mixture, THEN you inject the fuel just when you need it. One of the Achilles' heels of the rotary has been detonation, a few pings and you break an apex seal. With direct injection, you can have FAR better control of the atmosphere in the combustion chamber.

Just imagine having an engine where you didn't have to worry about detonation at all. That would be marvelous.

Dale

Yep :nod:

BUT................Mazda has been promising another RX7 for far too long it's time to put up or shut up and in 4 or 5 years who really gives a F#CK most of us don't know what we will want in the next 4 months :)

^^^

Agreed. Honestly, a Toyota 86/Suburu BRZ competitor with direct injection sounds pretty good..... in 2012.

In 2017, it sounds pretty lame. #oldnews

The FRS is great tuner platform. I fear the new rx7 won't be.
If the rotary needs all these things meet emissions and be reliable then maybe I need to go back to pistons. Even the ls1 is an old school single cam setup. It's also one of the best all round v8s.
I've gone back to carbed rotarys to improve all aspects of my car. My last one got 20 mpg and I'm building my new to do more. I feel bad for guys with efi only getting 14 mph why? Oh yeah bad tuning :)

I love the simplicity of the rotary. The fact it's so easy to work on makes it inexpensive and a great track car.

Mazda needs to focus on the good aspects of the rotary. Instead they try to make it something it's not. My 1985 rx7 competed with modern cars that cost thousands more in comparison. And my fc will do even better:). If u guys are having engine trouble with a rotary you can only blame the mechanic. If guys want help send me a message. I'm pretty good.

^^^

Your tuning virtuosity notwithstanding, nobody is going to build a carbuerated car in 2017. Direct injection is just another advance, tuners will figure it out.

He thinks because is his car is lighter and is getting better MPG that hes some genius that the OEM's aren't. Talking about carbs is pointless there is absolutely zero advantage to them in the real world other then maybe they look retro cool lol.

The RX-8 gets bad fuel economy because the transmission was geared to take full advantage of its 7-9k powerband. If they had designed it differently, people would complain about something else. People are never happy.

thewird

Sucks they have to do the miata replacent first. Guess that's the bread an butter before a passion project such as a rx7. The successor shoul be basically the size of a brz(or roughly the size of an fd) with a 300hp rotary. It should start around 30k. Anybody that wants a super car for 50-60k should think again. The market isn't there. Mazdas us design studio is in Irvine ca. Write them a letter.
Fact of the matter is if the new rotary doesn't meet or exceed fuel economy and emissions targets for 2017 an beyond then were all just getting worked up over nothing
Sky active diesel anyone?

Carburetor basher LOL. I don't want mazda to start making carbureted cars.
I also don't want them to experiment with new technologies on the rx7.


All I'm saying is Mazda can build a very simple reliable rotary car with fantastic performance. They did good with the rx8 but there should of been a turbo model and there could of been more options to meet customer needs.

They should also be proud of the empty engine bay. Instead they seem to cover the motor making it look bigger than it really is.
Its like the saw an empty spot under the hood and had to fill it only accomplishing points of failure in a cluttered engine bay.
There is so much more to it than that. They need to keep the rx7 a champion tuning car. I buy rotarys because they win races.

Well agreed, it seems like Mazda could have made a 2700 lb 2-door coupe based on the RX8/Miata platform, with a supercharged Renesis, like yesterday, that would have been an easy B86/BRZ/370z competitor. I still can't figure out how that didn't happen.

Mazda sort of sucks now. Sorry, but SkyActive Diesel sedans don't exactly make my sphincter tingle.

The rx8 is a nice car. I watched win many races in the Rolex series using an older 20B
I'm shopping for one now because its good looking and has lots of room for the kid.
I just wish it had turbo. why Mazda why no turbo

New rx7 needs to go back to basics.
Light weight, low cost, hi power. They need to use current technologies that are affordable and reliable. IT REALLY IS THAT SIMPLE.

I for one can't wait to see the design for the new RX7. I bought mine in 1997 and thought about getting a newer version when the RX8 came out, but didn't like the 4 seat style and lack of a turbo. As well as the style. Too bad they're waiting til 2027. :(

You're not going to get (emissions and fuel economy standards legal) high power with a rotary without high tech.

What you're talking about is an LSX conversion.

You need to go back to pistons.

This number came from...... where?

I'll get right on that.

I must say after reading all your posts in this thread, I am kind of surprised that Mazda R&D hasn't approached you yet :icon_tup:

The rx7 has never been an original car design. The first gen was to compete with the 300zx, second gen Porsche 924, and third gen Mitsubishi 3000 gt. the rx8 was original and failed. It all depends who Mazda wants to compete with