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Sounds like electrical gremlins? The battery is clearly strong, but I wonder if there isn't a weak link somewhere beyond the starting circuit... You should see your oil pressure gauge move slightly while cranking.
If it's not, you either aren't getting oil pressure, or you have an electrical issue. Make sure the gauge sensor connector is connected. A weak spark could also cause the engine to sound like that.
Flashing lights can, on some cars, be a sign of a bad alternator. This happened to me once back in the day with my MR2... You didn't forgot to hook yours up, I assume.
You don't need to do a smoke test. Do a boost leak test, it's easier and more useful.
Throw your intercooler elbow onto the throttle body and clamp some sturdy plastic bags (doubled-up or folded) over the end using the hose clamp.
Apply compressed air to an unused nipple using a length of vacuum hose and an air blow gun.
If you don't hear any leaks, spray soapy water all of the place and look for bubbles.
I'm not even talking about just the vacuum lines, but something bigger, like the intake manifold.
it looks like I need something here I can find a picture or remember what it is
To be clear trailing plugs have two blue lines on them, correct?
IIRC, pressed metal bracket with plastic clip to hold oil level sensor wire.......that tends to slice your wrist changing plugs.
I wouldn't base plug lead connection on a colour, looks like two different brands of lead there.
There's probably F/R leading/trailing tags on them somewhere - and one pair probably wouldn't reach leading. To be safest, you'd check coil connections, both leading share a coil, whereas trailing have individual.
With the dash light show, how cooked is your harness insulation?
There is/was some issue with a front bearing falling out of place when working on the front of the motor.
Some particular caution being needed.
[I looked through my binders for a copy of the service bulletin, but could not find it.}
******
I don't know how much of your stock set up remains.
There is a tube that feeds oil pan vapour out of the oil filler neck down to the intake elbow in front of the front turbo. If the engine is overfilled with oil, oil will migrate down this tube into the front turbo. If there is enough oil you might get smoke. Often that tube is routed to a catch can instead and the nipple to the intake elbow blocked off. If you have oil in the cross over pipe before the intercooler this might be evidence of the overfilling issue and might be a cause of your smoke.
Last edited by Redbul; 05-24-23 at 01:51 AM.
Reason: added info.
IIRC, pressed metal bracket with plastic clip to hold oil level sensor wire.......that tends to slice your wrist changing plugs.
I wouldn't base plug lead connection on a colour, looks like two different brands of lead there.
There's probably F/R leading/trailing tags on them somewhere - and one pair probably wouldn't reach leading. To be safest, you'd check coil connections, both leading share a coil, whereas trailing have individual.
With the dash light show, how cooked is your harness insulation?
It looks like two stock leads and two NGK replacements. I'd go ahead and get another full set to just be sure.
Edit: Wait, no, the NGK leading wires also black, too, but this still looks like one stock leading wire...
The engine only needs four things to run: Compression, Air, Fuel, and a correctly-timed Spark. You've already checked compression. To check for air, make sure there aren't any rags blocking the intake manifold or intercooler or charge piping. A quick and dirty check for fuel might be to pull a spark plug after cranking and smell if it smells like gasoline, more thorough test would be to add a fuel pressure gauge or fuel pressure sensor to the feed line. To check for spark, the very basic is usually called the 'screwdriver check for spark' where you move the spark plug wire to a screwdriver and hold that near chassis ground to see if any spark is happening at all. Careful not to zap yourself. The more in-depth spark check needs a timing light like is common in communities that use distributors such as old-school hot rods. Ideally you want a timing light without the dialback function, just a strobe that flashes when the spark event occurs. The service manual shows there is a small notch on the CAS trigger wheel, the spark for the front trailing coil should flash within 1 or 2 teeth of that small notch. If the front trailing fires 6 teeth away from that notch you have the trailing coil wires switched around. The factory leading setup is hard to get wrong, fortunately. The timing light is mostly confirming there is a spark, you don't have the ability to change much besides maybe swapping the two CAS connectors in the wiring harness.
And make sure the battery is fully charged in case you need to spin the engine on the starter for a long time. I would swap in fresh spark plugs in case yours are fouled from assembly lube. And I would check that you've got oil pressure before giving the engine fuel or spark, since insufficient oiling is the quickest way to hurt an engine. You also may need to hold the throttle around 10-20% to keep the engine running if it sounds like it's trying but not quite starting or staying running.
I'm wondering if he shouldn't just try unplugging the trailing plugs, or even the trailing coils. It should make a difference whether he's got them backwards, or whether he's getting a weak spark because of electrical gremlins. They're mostly for cleaning up the combustion, anyway.
Given the lengths of the pigtails, I don't suppose there's a possibility the primary and secondary injector plugs got switched and the fuel is reaching the combustion chamber too late...
Is there a way to check the injectors without sending them to a shop? I am going to try to pop the injectors out of the galleries and crank. so I can be Sure fuel is not an issue, as I only checked psi of the feed line
Is there a way to check the injectors without sending them to a shop? I am going to try to pop the injectors out of the galleries and crank. so I can be Sure fuel is not an issue, as I only checked psi of the feed line
Yes. I was about to suggest that you pull the fuel rail off the engine, strap the injectors to the rail, and point their business ends into some plastic bottles.
Don’t forget to release the fuel pressure first
Then prime the system and check that they aren’t leaking. Then turn the engine over and see how or if they are firing.
Make sure to have a fire extinguisher nearby and maybe wear some thick gloves in case you need to snuff a small conflagration…
Edit: And get your oil pressure gauge working! You didn't forget to install the key on the oil pump or something, did you? I almost did this the first time I put my FC's engine back together.
Is the pesky fuel pulsation damper still there? If the little rubber stopper is rotted away the diaphram inside may also be shot. Hope there is not fuel leaking out of there.
Is the fuel pressure regulator getting vacuum? It will restrict fuel which backs up pressure into the injectors if it is not getting vacuum. Vacuum regulates the valve and keeps it open in most situtations.
An appropriate screwdriver may help tell you if they're clicking away....or a proper stethoscope.....if you have a helper and can reach the primaries in the depths! A noid light or test light or a meter would tell if bad wiring or ecu issues are present if they aren't doing anything - and not simply gummed up.
Back a bit
Originally Posted by AZ fd
I did remove harness from fire wall
The harness earth eyelet on the interior side of the rubber plug was reattached?
Edit: oil pressure light goes out, cranking rpm unlikely to generate a needle rise
Is the pesky fuel pulsation damper still there? If the little rubber stopper is rotted away the diaphram inside may also be shot. Hope there is not fuel leaking out of there.
Is the fuel pressure regulator getting vacuum? It will restrict fuel which backs up pressure into the injectors if it is not getting vacuum. Vacuum regulates the valve and keeps it open in most situtations.
Wouldn't it actually increase fuel if it wasn't getting vacuum? Vacuum is pulling fuel out of the injectors, so the FPR uses vacuum to reduce fuel pressure so that you get a constant amount of actual fuel coming out.
The bigger problem is that you wouldn't get enough fuel if the engine was seeing boost.
Edit: Point taken about the stock FD OP gauge not moving. I just remember it moving when I primed my FC engine. I don't even look at the stock OP gauge on my FD, since I have an aftermarket gauge.
Do you happen to have a photo of this? my fresh motor is sounding like a lawnmower and im assuming something is wrong with my grounds or lack thereof.
It sounded almost exactly like AZ FD's second video (Edit: specifically, it sounded like his car right as the engine is about start) except I think my car actually started and sort of idled.
This was like eight years ago, so it was at least one phone back.
Also, my car wasn't a rebuild, it had just had been partially dismantled and sat around for like five years.
Edit: I second using a screwdriver to listen to if the injectors are even clicking, as a first step. I think I did this, too, when I was trying to get my car started.
The whole car is stock, expect for the cooling system. With the complete rest nest, i couldn't get a screw driver in the right place. so i took off the UIM and the coils to remove the rats nest and lift up the injectors. I did not mess/play with the FPR before i started taking things off. Tomorrow i will lift the rats nest then injectors!
Yea ive got my rebuild to idle, just sounds like a damn lawnmower/running on 1 rotor. was just wondering if it would be because of missing grounds, Thanks for the info.
Yea ive got my rebuild to idle, just sounds like a damn lawnmower/running on 1 rotor. was just wondering if it would be because of missing grounds, Thanks for the info.
If you think it sounds like its running on one rotor, make it run on one rotor and see if it makes a difference.
Then switch rotors and see if it makes a difference. Process of elimination!
Actually, come to think of it, my car idled OK, it just HATED to be revved.
I tried a million things only to finally notice that big fat ground wasn't bolted down properly. That's what you get for buying a parts car! Hahah.
FWIW, I had already had my injectors professionally cleaned and dynoed at this point.
Try using a ohm meter on the leads and the coils yet?
Is there a way to check the injectors without sending them to a shop? I am going to try to pop the injectors out of the galleries and crank. so I can be Sure fuel is not an issue, as I only checked psi of the feed line
Oh yeah, this is WITHOUT starter fluid, right?
Edit: On another note, did you paint your irons? If so, just to be 100% sure the main ground is good, remove any paint on the surface of ground and in the bolt hole, degrease every part of the ground, and reinstall it.
Edit: On another note, did you paint your irons? If so, just to be 100% sure the main ground is good, remove any paint on the surface of ground and in the bolt hole, degrease every part of the ground, and reinstall it.
I have tried start with and without fluid, if that's what you mean. I didn't paint any parts , I will mess with that ground if my injectors are fine.
The fuel pressure regulator in the FD has only limited use. Catch is it needs to have constant vacuum to prevent it from closing and causing fuel pressure to back up. Read the paragraph at the bottom of the page.
Clearly something is not fine. Do a boost leak test to be sure, not “should.” It’s a two-minute procedure the way your car is right now.
I did a boost leak test with a bag around the inlet elbow, and sprayed soapy water, didn't see any bubbles. would a vacuum leak cause it not to start.
I tested my only my primary injectors, as a fuel rail bolt is stripped. the injectors sprayed a solid stream is this normal as there is a diffuser for it ?
I will smoke test it when I put the rats nest back on
I did a boost leak test with a bag around the inlet elbow, and sprayed soapy water, didn't see any bubbles. would a vacuum leak cause it not to start.
I tested my only my primary injectors, as a fuel rail bolt is stripped. the injectors sprayed a solid stream is this normal as there is a diffuser for it ?
I will smoke test it when I put the rats nest back on
Yes, a vacuum leak of sufficient size can cause all sorts of problems. The FSM lists it as one of the things that could be causing your problem.
It can also keep you from idling.
If you don't have any boost leaks, you probably aren't going to have any vacuum leaks. You probably applied several times more pressure than your engine would apply as vacuum. So, I don't think a smoke test will tell you anything.
Did you test the injectors by hitting them with battery voltage, or by trying to start the car?
The question I have isn't whether the spray pattern is perfect, but rather whether they are actually firing when you try to start the car.
Come to think of it, does it matter which way the primary connectors go? I can't remember...
I would think it did, since the rotors are opposite of each other, and I am pretty sure they fire opposite of each other.
If they are directional, I can see how the primaries would easily get reversed. It's been a while since I've had to mess with my fuel system, though. I also only have two or three solenoids left on my car. Haha.
05-23-23, 11:39 PM
