Mahjik

iTrader: (1)

If you increase the weight of the oil (if you go from 10w30 to 20w50), the pressure will go up as the oil is much thicker.

PVerdieck

I believe Pettit's Protek-R is repackaged Klotz synthetic 2-cycle oil.

I use Royal Purple TCW-3 synthetic 2 stroke oil for premix.

It's a fantasy that synthetics don't burn clean these days.

dr2turbo

could anyone point me in the right direction, maybe a site where i could learn more about the whole mixing royal purple with Gas??? i wannna go synthetic but i wanna learn more about the fuel addetive

vchacon

Motor oil (synth or dino) is not added to the fuel (gas). 2-stroke is added to the fuel in order to lubricate the seals and keep the combustion temps down. Several types of 2-strokes oils are avaliable from royal purple, mmo, etc. For normal use (street driving) you would pour 4-oz of 2 stroke oil into a full (or about to be full) gas tank.

No links though, sorry

ghettostamps

and you guys do this everytime you fill up the car?

vchacon

Yup.

Kento

The actual page that link got its info from is pretty old. It was actually written for a British motorcycle forum site quite a while ago.

Although modern synthetics do burn cleanly, nothing that goes into the combustion chamber (other than air) will "burn completely" and leave absolutely no deposits-- your fuel is going to leave some deposits. "Molecular structure"? You do know that there are several different types of base stocks that synthetics are derived from that are completely different from one another?

prrex4ever

iTrader: (3)

I been using IDEMITSU which is highly recommended by the crew at RX7.Com. It is what they use in their race cars. It was specially manufactured for the 4 rotor that won the 24 hrs. of Le Mans. Check it out at rx7.com or rotorsports.com. I have had great results with it personally.

Julian

iTrader: (14)

This link tells much. % Ash is the percentage by weight of what remains unburned. Some oils are 1%, some synthetics including Redline and Mobil 1 are have nil ash. I call that clean burning. Also, while oil temps may show 250 deg or 300 deg or what ever on a gauge.. look at where the reading is, in an oil line or oil pan an averaged large volume temperature wheather just entering or just leaving engine .. this is great for a relative measure of how things are doing. BUT DO NOT take this to mean that those thin layers of oil on the bearing of a turbo or behind the seal of a rotor are not boiling away. Get the best oil you can afford and change it to keep it clean.

I have said this before. Mazda will not endose syn oil cause they had problems with some brands. But if you ask Mazda Motorsport, as I did when I got delivery of my 3rd Gen, they will tell you that systhetic was used in their race engines and what is more important to you ... your warranty or your engine. I have used Mobil 1 in the engine of rotarys for 20 years and still have those same engines.

Kento

As I stated before, that link was from a British motorcycle club website; from the early 90s, IIRC. Many of those formulations have surely changed since then, and undoubtedly for the better. The OEM car manufacturers found that excessive phosphorous (an extreme pressure additive) was ruining the catalytic converters over time, costing them major $$ in warranties, so they dialed back the phosphorous in the late 90s and used other additives.

Mazda did not (and apparently still doesn't) recommend synthetic oils because when the 13B-REW was under development, synthetic oils were still basically in their infancy, using relatively crude PAO base stocks that didn't burn cleanly and had only marginal advantages in heat stability over standard refined petroleum oils. Due to the shaky financial status of the company, Mazda probably saw fit to omit bench testing the Renesis engine with synthetic oils, and just kept it safe by still recommending only petroleum oils for the RX-8.

Julian

iTrader: (14)

Mobil 1 was developed in the early mid 60's. Infancy???

Kento

Yep, because even Mobil 1 didn't really move from the comparatively crude PAO base stocks and additive formulations until well into the late 80s.

Julian

iTrader: (14)

The start of this thread was ... Are synthetic's are good or bad.

Mazda Motorsport (now Mazdaspeed) printed in the 1997 Competition Parts Catalog:

"When breaking in any engine (race or stock), use a low ash content, mineral-based racing oil (20W or 30W). After the break-in period, change to a mineral or synthetic racing oil (30W or 40W)"

Just be careful on your selection:

API Group IV Base Stocks Polyalphaolefins (PAO) used as base stock in Mobil 1, AMSOIL, and Royal Purple are fully compatible with mineral oil and engine seals. The other Synthetic API Group IV is a catch all for other non-mineral and non-PAO Base Stocks , some are poor quality, such as naphthenic based and others as esters, Polyolesters are high quality. Redline uses neo-pentyl-polyolester, Motul uses an ester based stock and Neo ??

Mobil, being the leading manufacture of PAO's of low and high Viccosity Improvers and Polyolester based oils states: [Kento: they stayed with PAO's for cars]

"We are very familiar with polyolesters. In fact, we manufacture them and use them in our aviation jet engine oils such as Mobil Jet Oil II® and Mobil Jet Oil 254® and in our refrigeration compressor lubricants, where the polyolesters are utilized for their compatibility with new HFC refrigerants. Polyolesters are indeed excellent at high-temperature oxidation stability and low volatility.
However, our work on automobile engines and jet engine designs has shown that polyalphaolefins (PAOs) offer the best all-around performance for gasoline engines due to their:

• Being completely compatible with conventional oils and gasoline engine seals.
• Providing both low- and high-temperature performance.
• Providing a stable oil in the presence of water and moisture.
• Having anti-rust capabilities. "

Be careful of the type you use.

The water thing IS important for us, we are not racing our cars in the catagory of doing engine teardowns after each race. Water/moisture does get in our oil from condensation ... polyolesters do crap out under these conditions. Also some synthetics today are not true synthetics. Castrol Syntec and perhaps some others are a Group III hydrocracked mineral oil to reduce waxes etal., these are much cheaper to produce and thus are developing much higher profit margins while producing an oil between Group II Dino oil and true Synthetic.

4CN Air

iTrader: (7)

Marvel Mystery Oil is also a great choice for a premix, and Wal-Marts now carry it for $3.50 which is enough for 6 or 8 tank fulls (I forget at the moment).

hiboost7

ok im a first gen owner, with a 12a turbo.....i dont think anyone has mentioned amsoil...amsoil is an awesome synthetic and i love it. my motor ran 10 times better when switching form regular pet. oil to synthetics,i stand by amsiol with rotaries.

Sled Driver

iTrader: (9)

The MAIN benifit of synthetic oil in the engine is that it doesn't coke up the oil passages & bushings in the TURBOS.

The reason people use turbo timers is to alow the turbo to cool down.

Why?

Because the dino oil would cook away & turbos would fail.

ptrhahn

iTrader: (9)

Hey guys... just to clarify in case somebody missed it:

DO NOT put motor oil in your gas tank. Motor oil goes in your "crank" case. Yes the car injects a small amount of it in the combustion chamber, but if you are going to pre-mix it in the gasoline, you need to use 2-stroke oil thats designed to be mixed with gas. Get a good quality, ashless 2-stroke oil. I personally use Protek R, and i've heard it is rebadged klotz or Lucas 2-stroke, but then again i've bought both of those too, and the consistency wasn't the same.

I've used Mobil 1 in the crankcase with no ill affects. Dave at KD rotary also told me it was fine. I mainly used Mobil 1 instead of Royal Purple or Amsoil because its easier to come by at many gas stations and KMarts and such, so if there's an emergency or anything, i can just go get some instead of mail ordering it.

4CN Air

iTrader: (7)

if you premix 4oz to 20 gallons, is that enough to safely be able to disable the OMP? I premix everytime with MM but this is on top of what my OMP does. But I wouldn't mind removing it from my engine bay, getting some cash for it, and running synthetic.

mad_7tist

mmo is not a pre mix. go ahead and run your 2 stoke weed wacker on it and see how it does... no 4 oz per 20 gal is not enough to disable the omp

seven samurai

actually Royal purple has address synthentic use on rotaries on their site.

they make an additive for your fuel tank as well. ( I honestly have used it once or twice but never really gotten around to doing it enough to make a comment)

Ive been using royal purple 20w/50 motor oil (weight was because rx7.com suggested it for high temp areas, I'm in CA) since royal purple hit the scene. I recommend it to anyone piston or rotary.

I felt a difference from first changing to them. And still feel a difference every 3000 mi change. Royal purple has been time tested and dyno tested with noticable results both in temp and horse power.

The first time I changed to Royal I picked up my girlfriend of three years at the time (who knows nothing about cars) and half way too the movie theatre she asked me if I added a part or something because the car feels faster. I was thinking it felt faster but thought maybe it was the placebo effect kicking in. but when she noticed and had no idea I changed the oil or anything it was enough to sell me.

4CN Air

iTrader: (7)

actually I meant 8oz for 20 gal, I use 4ozeverytime I add gas, which is usually 10gal. at a time ($20 normally). My mistake, but what do you mean about MMO? You're saying it's not designed to be mixed in with your gas? Of course I would not run a weedeater on straight MMO, I think I'm missing your point.

Maybe you could make your post more complete. Maybe instead of just saying what won't work, add something to the post, like what ratio one would needto premix inorder to safely disable the OMP.

RX-7racer88

I've always been told the best oil to go with is your basic dynos. Just sounds like and heard the synthetics can cause harm to the seals. I've alwasy ran you basic mobil and have had no problems with that yet. Thats just my 50 cents worth on this idea.

Stix37867

iTrader: (1)

I'm still wondering what some of you guys thought about the blend of the synthetic and non-synthetic oils?

I recently noticed a small oil leak coming from my rear main seal (at least from what I can see it is anyways), and it started after putting synthetic oil in it after changing from non-synthetic oil. Now I now seals don't expand when synthetic oil is used compared to non-synthetic so I guess what I want to now is what some of you guys think of the blended stuff and if it will stop my leak?

4CN Air

iTrader: (7)

Try it, your result is only an oil change away. Have you tried going back to conventional oil? Did the leak stop?

mad_7tist

ok. MMo is a additive. yes it can go in gas, oil and such. it is not a pre mix. premix is designed for 2stroke engines to keep them lubricated. mmo will not replace premix in a True premixing situation. yes you can put it in your car