gxlbiscuit

would the fact you guys are in canada have anything to do with it... i dont like canadians either....jk..... are the ecus different???

ddub

I'm not in canada and mine did the same thing.

ddub

How about we learn how to spell "lying" correctly before we be a smartass towards everyone and not contribute anything to a thread, hmmm?

Bukwild

"I'm not in canada and mine did the same thing."


Kirkland, WA is close enuff for me.

ddub

What does that have to do with anything? I have a US spec rx-7 with a US ECU, so go to hell.

casio

so who has contacted apex'i with this info? someone with a wideband would be a good example of someone having a question for them. record some numbers, do various tests and email/write apex'i. not having a wideband yet, i'm curious of this.

rs_1101

moreover, did anyone figure out why this is caused, and if my s4 would be affected?... guess ill just have to add 20% fuel and cross my fingers :-D

ddub

So far the only people I've seen this happen to are me and foild. Before foild I had never heard of another person having this problem and thought I was the only one.

My problem was an odd one. On the dyno the AFR's worked backwards with the SAFC, like taking out fuel made them richer and adding fuel made them leaner, just like how foild was. But then for my emissions test leaning my car out, taking out fuel, made my car's emissions go down which would make me think it was working properly (ie taking out fuel really did lean it out), because for my emissions test I ran -20% at idle and -15% for 2k and 3k. It ran like ****, wanted to die, and my idle emissions rpm was 510 But my emissions went way down, so I was lead to believe it WAS working properly there. This has really confused me because of the dyno/wideband readings, but we'll see once I actually install my LM1, still haven't gotten around to doing that.

casio

the +/- is rather misleading as is. anyone else ever sit and watch (as safely as possible) their air correction percentage. for mine, you have to be at nearly or no throttle (so obviously i'm referring to lo-throttle settings) to actually acheive the given percentage. when i couldn't pass emissions (it was a year and month overdue, so somewhat an "asap" situation), i put 1600 at -50% and 2200 at -40%. i dont know what the actual air correction was because i didnt have that much time to waste on the dyno (though the guys were VERY nice to me; i ran so many times for free). when driving around town in lo-throttle, i watch the air correction. depending on how much throttle is given, the air correction (and therefore fuel) is minute compared to the setting. again, these are all lo-throttle; i've never watched hi-throttle air correction settings.
as long as all that senseless typing was, all i'm saying is that the X% air correction is usually (in lo-throttle) much less than what its set at. the closer to no throttle, the closer to the number you have it set at.
*these are for how my safcII is set up.

ddub

Mine works fine, did you set the lo-throttle to be up to 98% and hi-throttle 99%? That's how mine is set and when I change the lo-throttle to say -15% for 1000rpm and below, and I'm sitting idling/not moving, it shows -15.0 correction on the s-afc.

totallimmortal

yeah i've got mine setup like ddub asid with the 99 and 98. Mine works right but i have heard of this problem before on hondas tho

casio

yea, remember, idle = 0 throttle. my settings are practically what they were default, though a little off just cause i was curious. i forgot what that setting is called, though. but lets say 2200rpm is at -20%. if you go up to just over 2200rpm, let off, watch the rpm fall over 2200, you'll be at -20%. then, if you put your foot on the gas, that reading may go up to -8% (for example) because of the throttle.
like i said, there's that other setting for lo- and hi-throttle that mine is still similar to default. because i dont know much about it, and more because i dont have a wideband yet, i havent gotten too experimental. luckily i'm just an n/a and not too worried about popping.

ddub

I have mine set up to change settings in 1000 rpm increments. The way the s-afc works is say you have -15% at 2000 and -10% at 3000, ok? What it does is inbetween 2000 and 3000 rpms it averages the correction based on what rpm it is at, ie closer to 2000 or 3000 and how close. So if you have -15% at 2000 and NO correction at 3000, it sees that as 0% correction at 3000 and of course when it averages the two it'll be off. This is why when tuning with the s-afc the numbers in the next increment should be close and the corrections throughout the rpm range should be somewhat gradual.

And my idle is 18.2% throttle thank you very much

gxlbiscuit

i just installed my safc2 on saturday. I connected it to switch high and low maps using the pressure sensor.. WORKS AWESOME.. it kicks in when its needed my lo map is blank and my high map starts correcting at 3000. WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE fun fast car... just dont dare venture over 10 lbs... need to get my fuel pump in and injectors....

HAILERS

The only time I've seen that was......when my finger slipped and I put in Hot Wire instead of FLAP. Then the readings were *** backwards for adding/subtracting fuel. Putting the settings back to Flap corrected the problem.

ddub

Well my settings are on flap and have never been on hot wire, so I dunno what to say

casio

yea, i know about the averaging, but i've sat there and watched the air correction. again, like i said, i'll use 2200 (mine goes by 600 increments starting at 1000rpm) for my example. say 2200rpm is -20%. give throttle passed that rpm while watching the airflow correction percentages. they should be less than (closer to zero) -20% because of the throttle. drive to, say, 2500rpm, then let off. when the rpm is dropping and the car is decelerating, the correction should be -20% with zero throttle. right when you see that -20%, step on the accel pedal a decent amount (still staying in lo-thottle settings, though). the -20% should (if its like mine) jump much closer to zero.
i drove ~40 miles with my safc tuned down to ~ -28%. it was all highway, so i was doing an experiment to save gas. i wasn't seeing upper -20s%, though, because i was on the throttle. most of the time it was -11% to -15% (at most).
as for idle, i dont consider idling having ANY physical throttle. if you're on the throttle, its revving, not idling, so this will be accurate of the setting on the safc. so your 18.2% may be a percentage between two numbers, but mine isn't because my lowest setting is 1000rpm, so my idle is the number i have set for 1000rpm (which right now is 0%).

ddub

I'm not really following what you're trying to describe, but mine works fine so I dunno.

As for idle, what are you talking about? My throttle at IDLE not moving, no foot on the accelerator is 18.2%. That means my throttle plates are 18.2% open at idle with the car sitting not moving in my driveway with me even outside the car. This is technically revving it, why? Because I adjusted my idle via the throttle stop screw (however I had to use an aftermarket bolt that was longer). When you tighten it down it opens up the throttle plates and raises idle.

casio

i'm in no way arguing your 18.2%, though i think you're referring to throttle position as opposed to air correction.

my safc works fine, too, i was just saying that the percentage at XXXXrpm is dependant upon more than rpm (ie throttle) (on my safc). where am i losing ya? i'm saying its not a fixed number from my experiences with watching the safc.

set your correction at -10% (or something) at 2000 and 3000 (since yours goes by 1000rpm increments). drive your car at various throttle between those two rpms (or whatever two you decide). if yours is like mine, you wont see -10% between those two numbers, but a negative number between -10% and 0%; UNLESS you completely let off throttle, in which case it should read -10%.

ddub

Never said it was air correction, though I have run at -40 correction at idle before when I had some leaky/flooding injector problems.

I was originally referring to this:

And I was jokingly saying that my idle has 18.2% 'throttle' not correction.

casio

yea, i was getting confused between throttle and air correction when you said that.
uhg, why must text translation get so confusing??

do you know what i mean about the air correction being dependant on more than just rpm, though? i dont know what other factors it looks at, but i would imagine the pressure sensor would be one and throttle position.

i havent really read the manual, so how did you make your increments 1000? mine are 600. which safc do you have? i have the SAFCII (black).

ddub

I have a blue screen SAFC and I can either put mine in 500rpm increments or 1000, but I am limited to 8 increments I think, something like that.

Are you tuning yours via the pressure sensor then instead of rpm? Because mine is only tuned based on the rpm and it works just like it's supposed to. The main reason I probably don't understand what you're saying is because mine doesn't work like that.

Throttle position does play a role. Just like how it averages between rpms, if you are at say 60% throttle it'll take corrections from lo and hi depending on what % of throttle you have setup for lo and hi, and again average them. If there is no setting it sees this as 0 correction and still averages, as far as I know.

casio

see, i guess its cause of those two numbers (sorry, but ****! i dont know what theyre called) which represents lo-throttle and hi-throttle. like you said earlier, yours is at 98 and 99; if its the same as i'm thinking, mine has that, but thats not what my two numbers are set to. well that may be it; everytime i'm over my lo-setting, it goes to averaging the lo- and hi-throttle. your lo-throttle is set so high that you're always at lo- unless you're at WOT (99%+).

am i getting that right? i'm trying to understand this thing!

ddub

Yep that's correct!

But thanks to the narrowband s4 TPS 100% reads at like 75% true throttle, which is why I have mine set to that.

casio

ah yes, the narrowband. i have absolutely no experience with that. i'ma have to mess with those other two numbers and see how my air correction changes.