Gryffinwings

iTrader: (3)

I have looked at aaroncake's website and pretty much looked at everything there, but I would like to have more info, I've also done some searching, didn't find a lot of what I was looking for. I am looking for some info on plumbing routing, placement of the AFM, also if the NA AFM is usable, as well as where it is mounted, I'm not sure if it is mounted before the turbo or else where. The setup is going to be going on a Series 4, so information regarding the setup for a series 4 would be great.

The turbo I will be using is comparable to a GT35R size. I have the chance to get 2 550cc injectors and 2 1000cc injectors. I was wondering if it would be better to use a set of 4 720cc injectors?

Pictures would be great.

1SWEET7

iTrader: (1)

Search more!

Gryffinwings

iTrader: (3)

Problem is, is that I did do a search, the entire forum and I used the keyword "Turbo". I didn't get very far even on google.

Scrims

iTrader: (2)

I will give you that questions like where the afm mount don't really come up that often.

First off, if you're planning on using a turbo sized similarly to a GT35R, using an AFM at all is a problem. Going that size especially with an NA block will require a standalone ECU. Depending on your power goals, a 720/1000cc injector combo might get you where you want to be, not positive on this point so hopefully someone else will jump in there.

Best suggestion in your situation is to read. Read a lot and then read some more. I know that searching can only get you so far on here, but just lurk every day and read through threads that are even remotely related to what you want to do.

Gryffinwings

iTrader: (3)

Thanks for the advice, so far that has been very help. So using the AFM is pretty much a bad idea huh? hmmmmm, looks like standalone after all. Next is going to be having to find an appropriate standalone, I was looking into getting a Megasquirt, but that may be a little bit much. I know Haltec makes good ones, but other then that not sure what to go with. I've heard of the Rtek, but not sure if it's compatible with my NA ECU.

Scrims

iTrader: (2)

Sorry, should have been a bit clearer.
The AFM itself isn't exactly a bad idea, merely the connotation that if you have an AFM, it means you are using the stock ECU which isn't good enough for an upgraded turbo.

As far as stand alones, you certainly have your options. Megasquirt is certainly good, I'm planning on using it sometime in the future, but it is more do-it-yourself, you can get prebuilt ones, but they will still need some modifications to run our cars. Benefits being that it is significantly cheaper than anything else. AaronCake has a complete write-up for assembling and installing a megasquirt on your car, it's quite good.
I've heard great things about haltec, but you're going to pay for it.
Rtek is good, and available for your NA ecu, but if you are going turbo, you should not be running an NA ecu, but rather get the turbo ecu (N332 I believe), which also has Rtek available for it. Drawbacks for the Rtek is it still requires the stock AFM, and it generally isn't recommended for a full turbo upgrade (ie. not stock or hybrid turbo).

Oh, and for future reference, the AFM attaches to the airbox/filter, and thus goes before the turbo.

Gryffinwings

iTrader: (3)

Actually, I was really considering the Rtek, I did some reading about the Stage 2 or 2.0 version and it gives you the ability to basically adjust fuel and timing. So basically, it is a standalone made out of your ECU. The 2.1 version from what I have been reading will allow the removal of that AFM but it isn't out yet, but going this route, I don't have a problem with that.

BigTurbo74

iTrader: (4)

you will want bigger injectors..

http://www.turblown.net/store/index.php?productID=63

Gryffinwings

iTrader: (3)

Those sound excessive, although they have a set of 1020cc injectors. Although right now I can obtain a pair of 550cc injectors and a pair of 1000cc injectors. Won't those be enough?

Scrims

iTrader: (2)

All true. Didn't say it was a hard fast rule never to ever use Rtek for a big turbo upgrade, just that people in general don't like to do it. You still have to rely on the stock old crusty wiring harness and all the stock sensors. The AFM removal has been in the works for a long time, IRCC, and the s5 TII is what's getting it first, so you'll probably be in for a fair bit of a wait if you hold out for it. Also, you will never have the same extensive control over everything with an Rtek that you do with a true standalone. That and a lot of people don't like being restricted to using a palm pilot for all of their tuning.
That being said, it may work just fine for you. Depends largely on your power goals (please tell us your power goals). Not trying to bash Rtek here, on the contrary I really like the work they do.

Gryffinwings

iTrader: (3)

Lots of good advice there. But I think I will actually still go with the Rtek, simpler to get installed and everything. And I have no problem working with a small palm pilot or simaler. My power goals are not incredibly loafty, around 250-300 hp is all I am looking for and I believe that is very attainable.

2slow4stock

iTrader: (18)

First of all, hybrid turbo's bigger than a t04e will cause TII or n/a AFM to max out. Do not stay n/a sensors. Buy pressure sensor and all TII sensors, including afm. Since you are s4, you have it easy, as parts are more readily available.

I have a 6 port turbo, with a .60 trim turbo. t3/t4 hybrid. I can say, afm sucks and rtek sucks. I am upgrading to a standalone. You will need to upgrade the secondary injectors. Also rtek you tune with a palm pilot, which I didn't really like.

Upgrade your transmission as well, since n/a transmissions are pretty brittle. (I drove my car like it's suppose to, so I went through 5 n/a transmissions within 8 months of being turbo'd)

Gryffinwings

iTrader: (3)

Already working on the sensor thing already, something I knew already. Anyways since I am not going for very high power output, and looking to get around 250 HP, I don't think using the AFM with Rtek will be a problem. As far as the n/a tranny is concerned, I've been reading into that, so far from my view that's up to debate.

FrankV702

iTrader: (14)

Back in the day when me and a buddy built my 6port GXL turbo engine, we placed the AFM on the intercooler piping in between the throttly body and the FMIC. I don't know much more details than that, as tuning and electronics is not exactly my strong point.. Somethin to think about though. It ran GREAT! On an NA ecu too w/ an S-AFC.. I only had a 3-5psi spring though on the wastegate.

Gryffinwings

iTrader: (3)

What's the benefit of running the AFM on the intercooler piping?

Sideo

by AFM do you mean Air Flow Meter, is it same thing as Mass Air Flow meter?

if the MAF is after the turbo instead of before it you dont have to recirculate the blow off valve.

Chris Boots

You could try reading my thread in my signature, I list all the part's numbers such as ECU numbers, boost sensor, AFM, etc. Although my thread is centered on an actual turbo engine swap, the info is the same. You'll need a standalone engine management to run those kind of injectors, look into Rtek being it uses a turbo ecu and is cheaper, and uses your stock harness.

V8kilr

I dont have a link but I found a huge write up on here that is even for an S4 while searching google for something when I was at work today and bookmarked it but it was on my work computer.

I think the post is even stickied.

Jimmy2222

iTrader: (3)

3100ccs will be enough if you run low enough boost levels. Mind you at a duty cycle of 85% you'll be flowing only 2635ccs and that's the MAX you want your injectors to hit. Going with 720/1000 or even 1000s all around would be safer. You can get 550s anywhere for dirt so I can see why it's an attractive option.

V8kilr

Oh and I think your going to have more bitch of a time programming your ecu with different size injectors.

FrankV702

iTrader: (14)

It wasn't crammed up on the TID.. I attached a small piece of piping and a filter straight to the turbo. I was trying to find pictures but I can't find any! :/

Gryffinwings

iTrader: (3)

Could you please explain this?

Anyways thanks the information guys, so far.

@Jimmy2222: Why are you posting such high cc injectors, why would I need those? wouldn't using those have problems with idle?

@Chris Boots: Thanks, I'll be reading that thread.

V8kilr

If your using something like a Megasquirt it assumes the same size injectors on all 4.
When I last looked into them it only asks the injector size once, i.e. it will think you have 1000CC injectors in all 4 banks.

Here is the post I spoke of

https://www.rx7club.com/2nd-gen-archive-72/s4-na-turbo-swap-details-813825/

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

That's too much turbo for 250HP. If you only want 250HP, just bolt on a stock turbo with a set of TII intake manifolds. And the use the TII ECU, appropriate sensors and 550CC/720CC injectors. At 250HP, depending on how you drive, the NA transmission may be fine.

That is a ridiculous amount of fuel. Absolutely ridiculous.

You can run whatever combination for primary and secondary injectors on the Megasquirt you want. Just change the settings in Injector Staging.

midnightbluefc

iTrader: (19)

i think im about to go this route, stock turbo pars i have the 318 pressure sensor, 550 injectors(cleaned by rc) the stock s4 turbo parts, rb down pipe, the uim, lim turbo, the turbo mani, the tmic, the piping the maf, all i need is probably a wideband no? i really just want to be at around 250 hp nothing to major.... any tips?