crossbar17

i dont want heaps of power, i want 200-220 hpo with a streetport and carb setup, i can afford a carb cause i buy them at cost, i can do the work myself if i am told what ahs to be done, and if i can my dad can, we have a machine shop, can use FG if necessary, and have done more carb wpork than anythign else, i just want to know exactly what ahs to be cut, plugged, changed, etc etc, i dont care about mileage and i dont care about cold running cause its a summer car only......


CB

kabooski

Mazdaracing.com specializes on carb set ups
check out there site and there Turbo carbed low buck 1st gen with stock carb
that Beat Ari Yallons 50k+ Super FI High Tech
3rd gen last year

Felix Wankel

Go somewhere besides mazdaracing.com...

kabooski

Listen you got to understand Ted's and Nz's mentality
they come from "got to pass emissions" got to have smooth accleration with out the sudden surge you get when the secondarys come on.. on a Holly

Yet they know very well for some one who does not give a F about emissions or near stock drive'ablity

That Carb produces more HP for the $

Take a street ported N/A with TII 4 port plates
add 720cc secs and a fuel reg and pump

Take same motor with Jay-Tech Manifold and a 650 Barry Grant Silver Claw with a 85 dist(advanced)
Fuel Reg and Pump

The Later will cream the F.I period!

That is for N/A
for Turbo F.I is the Best
Thats why I had a nice box arrive today
.
.
.
.

RETed

Hey bitch, I am tired of you putting words in my mouth.&nbsp This is my OFFICIAL STANCE on this whole carb versus EFI thing - TAKE NOTES:
The car comes stock with a factory EFI - there is nothing wrong with it.
If you have problems with the stock EFI, it is "easy" to troubleshoot; if your frustrated with the stock EFI system and can't fix it, take it to a pro - you are not competent enough to mess with the stock EFI system, you have no business trying to "fix" it in the first place.
The stock AFM is about the most restrictive thing on the stock EFI system - swapping out for a MAP-based system easily frees up 15-20hp alone.
EFI is going to run more consistent day-today street driving.
EFI is going to be more efficient in terms of gas mileage.
I did NOT claim anything about emissions.
I did NOT claim anything about smoother acceleration - this has everything to do with how you JET the carb.


Sure, if you don't give a **** about emissions nor give a **** about driveability, go for it.&nbsp I didn't say it was impossible.&nbsp So you're going to have a car which you have to readjust everytime the humidty changes by 10%...or when the temperatures change by 10&#176F...or when the altitude changes by 1000 feet...&nbsp You did say you didn't give a **** about driveability, right?


I still haven't seen the numbers on this yet - care to give us the complete break-down of the costs involved?


In what?&nbsp You said earlier driveability goes out the door.&nbsp So already, you've lost in one area...


-Ted

kabooski

See you keep metioning driveability
maybe for colder climates there is issue with carbes
I dont know I've been in FL my whole life
so that is a non issue

Emessions was directed to Nz

Your missing the Point Ted
This guys wants to RACE

I had my N/A's and MY TII street port and one Bridged

They drive and sound nothing near stock

My TII sounds like a FreightLiner coming down the Road
Do I care? NO I want to RACE

crossbar17

ok.....those who want to help reply, i dont want to start arguments, TED undoubtedly knows more than most about everything, i give him that, but its a secondary car, a fun car, i am sick of the AFM you are right, my safc either doesnt work or my car is messed up, but i have had 4 different ones, professionally installed and they dont work, set adjustments all specs and the car not only reads the wrong voltages but wont run above 3000 rpms with safc, my ports didnt work, so i rmeoved them totally, my converter is gone, my air pump is gone, my power steering and a/c and compressor , a/c cooler all is gone, i want a light carbed streetported n/a........i am in college, cant afford a tII, and for the money i THINK this is the best way to go, chances are you are all older than me, mostly know more about FC's than me, but i want to carb it, efi is not the way to go after what i have removed, i'm a mans man, i love fire breathing naturally aspirated cars, although i am young i dislike turbo's, and boost in general, it give advantage to those with money and takes it away from those with talent and knowledge, if you cant tune a carb, arent smart enough to tune one, or just dont like to and want to flame this please don't, i dont care and i will just skip over it, those that have done it, can help all they want, as for Haltech and Wolf they can lick my *****, if i bought one it would be on the shelf in my room forever, i cannot tune it nor can anyone in Maine, however i and about every mechanic that works for and with my dad can, the only thing u have accomplished was to ALMOST convince me to SELL me FC because of this crap, I may be ignorant but i can learn, carb is the way i want to go, and also i want to get a tII when i can afford it, and then it will be FI, then and only then will i have time effort and experience to mess with and tinker it, now i now i cannot afford a tII nor a haltech or the drive to NJ to get it set up, i can do a carb in my back yard and tune it in a afternoon for next to nothing, please respect what i want to do and not flame or argue anymore its childish and a waste of time.....

Icemark

But this guy is in Maine... So it is an issue.

Hey I grew up on cars in So Cal. Back in the late 70's and early 80's a bigger or new performance carb was the best HP addition back then.

But I do remember always having to retune my set up for each weekend. That was in sunny always perfect weather San Diego. Maybe that's what this kid wants.

But I personally would never want a carb on any car I drove unless it was just drag racing. Frankly I think he could get the same if not more HP just by porting a polishing the intake as a carb would add.

But then I havn't driven a carbed FC to compare it too.

And I haven't seen any performance numbers of any sort (other than the standard bragging) to justify throwing away a perfectly good intake system.

NZConvertible

Don't put words in my damn mouth either! I couldn't give a crap about emissions. There are no emissions requirements in NZ and the first thing I did to both my EFI rotaries was pull it all off!
As for smooth acceleration, why the hell is that a bad thing?! I know you're only interested in drag racing (why else would you mention that POS 1st gen as an example), but some of us find that a little boring (and yes I've done plenty). Driving on a race track or a twisty road is a whole lot more enjoyable if throttle response is smooth, not a sharp, unpredicable kick in the pants as you put the power down exiting a corner!
And what's sound got to do with carbs or EFI...?

Felix Wankel

Hey! I have the same car.

crossbar17

here we go girls.....well what should i do? removed what i said, ported polished intake manifold and TB, full custom exhaust, if you are still gonna argue, do it in a helpful way, tell me what i can do to make it faster, if someone has time enough to port the everliving **** outa a intake without it breaking on install, and to bypass AFM without a Haltech, what to do what to do..

Turblown

iTrader: (12)

I was under the impression that carb's can produce more power than EFI too.

benjie

woah what the hell

i was expecting a nice convo. about carbs

and u get all this mess.


im not sure, but i dont think he asked "HEY WHAT IS YOUR OPINION ON CARBS?!lets argue over it!"


i actually really wanted to see, i would like to eventually have my fc running carbs.

more power on f.i, stock this blah blah.

i dont care.

its my car. i can put alarge rock under the hoo dif i wanted.

i think alot of people feel the same.

so..

... BACK TO TOPIC...

..any one have pics of a carb set up in a FC?

NZConvertible

Airflow produces power, not how you introduce the fuel. The stock ECU requires the airflow meter (it can’t be bypassed) and this will eventually limit the engine’s airflow potential. So if a carb and its manifold is big enough to outflow the stock AFM/TB/manifold it will produce more peak power. However because a carb can’t meter fuel anywhere near as well as EFI, it’ll probably lose power through the low- and mid-range, and will have the slower, rougher throttle response. Chuck on programmable EFI (no AFM) and it’s a whole new game. Any carb big enough to outflow that set-up would drive terrible at anything other than WOT and high rpm.

RETed

It makes me wonder if you actually have any experience with carbs.&nbsp You take all my words and sum it up with "colder climates" - it has to do with ambient temperature variations and humidity.&nbsp Sure, Florida is pretty flat, so we can throw out the altitude point.&nbsp I used to live in Hawaii - it comes very close to what Florida is like.&nbsp I've been through "duals" set-up since I had a CRX back in 1988 - when most of you have been in diapers.&nbsp 10&#176F flunctuation will change AFR's through the carb - this is as simple from going from a sunny day to a balmy night.&nbsp Are you going to tell me your temps don't fluctuate more than 10&#176F???&nbsp Humidity changes also factor into AFR's - I know Florida can hit 90% humidity, but it doesn't stay at 90% all the time.&nbsp 10% change in humidity changes your AFR's through the carb.


You talking aboutcrossbar17 who started this thread, right?
I do not see ANYTHING about a RACE-ONLY vehicle.&nbsp I see "summer" use only vehicle.&nbsp That's a BIG difference in my book.



You sound like you're 20 years old.&nbsp How old are you, BTW?&nbsp Just wait till you hit 40 - your attitude is going to change...trust me.

crossbar17, since you're so adamant on getting the carb up and running, I'd suggest you contact Racing Beat for more advice.&nbsp Racing Beat has probably the most experience with setting up a carb on a 13B - pay the ~$10 for their catalog; it has a ton of info about setting up a carb correctly.


-Ted

NZConvertible

Ported motor, ported manifold, TB mod, Pineapple aux port sleeves, S-AFC, pod filter, heat shield, cold air intake, quality exhaust (maybe full dual?), decent plugs and wires, ignition amp, blah, blah...
There are lots of things you can do. If you really want to go carb, get a decent one. In NZ and Oz, if it's not a Weber IDA (at least 48mm), you're not serious!

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

My beater '79 has a carb. I drive it in the winter. I would never, ever wish that kind of torture on someone else (note: I have fixed all carb related problems, and unlike it states in my signature, the secondaries are not stuck).

This conversation is making me want to scream.

Convert to carb, that's fine. I don't care. But you WILL LOSE power over any sort of equivelant fuel injection system. And it will cost the same to upgrade the FI system as it would to convert to carb...And the upgraded FI system will make more power than the carb.

crossbar17

everything u said NZ convertible i have already done and then some with exception to e ported motor, if u can read u will see i said my SAFC does not function, had it professionally installed, replaced, installed again, and it wont even rev over 3000 without bogging to ****, before its adjusted, also it reads incorrect voltages all across the board.....and when u say i will lose power by doing a carb aaron cake why would they sell a carb conversion and push the product if it did suck?? why dont u tell my dad his 69 camaro that runs sub 10's sucks or that his summer camaro that runs 13's sucks....i think not.

crossbar17

how then do i upgrade my FI system without a haltech or wolf i might add???????????

RETed

Find a competent shop that knows how to work on your car...
Is KDR too far for you?



-Ted

Felix Wankel

They would be infinitely more driveable and probably more powerful with an EFI setup.

There are 1000+ CFM TPI setups for Chevys out there...

Aaron Cake

iTrader: (1)

It's not the carb that makes the Camaro fast...It's the big assed V8 under the hood....Put FI on that car and I guarantee it will be faster.

Sigh, I'm not even going to try anymore....

crossbar17

wheres KDR

HN

if you want carb go with a racing beat manifold and holley 600, with old school ignition. i've had both setups and personaly i HATE carbs. but i am a believer that you can do whatever the hell you want with your money. i am wondering why nobody has tried the simple digital system for their na. i personaly use haltech for my t2 but for an na their system isn't to out of hand for the ~700 or so dollars. i think this is almost worth me buying one to try it out.

RETed

Why bother when I can get a Haltech E6K for ~$1,000.


-Ted