guy wants to sell me a turbo II set up for 1000
02-08-13, 10:49 AM
#26
OP: From the FAQ:
If I were you, I'd price it as if half the block was trashed and a turbo trans. 500 or so because the time and effort to part everything out has to be worth something to you. And it's a 20+ year old engine whose coolant seals don't have much of a life expectancy left. Better yet, take a battery and compression test it since the trans and engine are in one place.
No, you do not understand the answer to your question. There's a difference. The full functionality of the twin-scroll system is outlined over 6 pages in the FSM and more in the training manual, so please forgive me for not re-writing it for your viewing pleasure in the thread regarding purchasing a turbo swap. The Factory Service Manual, read it.
I've run the same turbo with an S4 and S5 hotside with the same S4 engine/tune/everything....It's barely noticeable. Although, I'm using the stock flywheel which dampens turbo response.
/Threadjack.
Can I install the Turbo II transmission into an NA?
Certainly. But you need to also install:
-TII flywheel, clutch, pressure plate
-TII slave cylinder
-TII starter
-TII driveshaft, differential, axels
-Adapt the wiring.
MazdaTrix makes a TII transmission to NA rear end driveshaft, so if you don't want to swap your rear end, you can use that shaft instead.
Certainly. But you need to also install:
-TII flywheel, clutch, pressure plate
-TII slave cylinder
-TII starter
-TII driveshaft, differential, axels
-Adapt the wiring.
MazdaTrix makes a TII transmission to NA rear end driveshaft, so if you don't want to swap your rear end, you can use that shaft instead.
I've run the same turbo with an S4 and S5 hotside with the same S4 engine/tune/everything....It's barely noticeable. Although, I'm using the stock flywheel which dampens turbo response.
/Threadjack.
02-09-13, 08:56 AM
#27
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wow ok mazda drive shaft all day. seems like a better idea to just repair my motor and buy the turbo trans along with clutch etc? what would be a good price to pay for the trans and components?
02-09-13, 05:28 PM
#28
what i'm saying is the series 5 doesn't have to rely on the twin scroll to spool to the turbo as quick as the S4. the S5 also has a solenoid to overshoot boost by holding the wastegate shut longer, giving the impression it kicks in harder than the series 4 turbo.
the turbos are very nearly identical except the s5 manifold compliments the turbo hotside design where a properly functioning series 4 manifold with twin scroll compliments the series 4 turbo hotside design. the wastegate is the major difference between the 2, where the S5 is obviously superior in almost every way except that it tends to wear the bushing in the turbine housing much quicker, allowing slop and boost leaks(internal exhaust leaks bypassing the turbine wheel, as well as pushing the wastegate open easier, impacting response) as well as slower response due to those leaks over the series 4 with smaller WG arm and flapper.
so what i'm saying is if you have a decent series 4 turbo with a full functioning twin scroll there isn't much benefit to switching to a series 5 turbo unless you NEED the bigger wastegate due to creep.
many people get the impression that the s5 turbo is much better because they had ridden in a series 5 car, which responds much better than the S4 due to the extremely low compression rate of the series 4 engine. add in the series 5 boost solenoid and it just picks up better all around, making the car feel faster because it is. could the series 4 also benefit from a boost control solenoid to alter overspool? yes, but the twin scroll generally did that without it, if it wasn't leaking or stuck open.
the main reason i consider the series 5 turbo better is because the manifold and turbos tend to crack less than the series 4 do.
the turbos are very nearly identical except the s5 manifold compliments the turbo hotside design where a properly functioning series 4 manifold with twin scroll compliments the series 4 turbo hotside design. the wastegate is the major difference between the 2, where the S5 is obviously superior in almost every way except that it tends to wear the bushing in the turbine housing much quicker, allowing slop and boost leaks(internal exhaust leaks bypassing the turbine wheel, as well as pushing the wastegate open easier, impacting response) as well as slower response due to those leaks over the series 4 with smaller WG arm and flapper.
so what i'm saying is if you have a decent series 4 turbo with a full functioning twin scroll there isn't much benefit to switching to a series 5 turbo unless you NEED the bigger wastegate due to creep.
many people get the impression that the s5 turbo is much better because they had ridden in a series 5 car, which responds much better than the S4 due to the extremely low compression rate of the series 4 engine. add in the series 5 boost solenoid and it just picks up better all around, making the car feel faster because it is. could the series 4 also benefit from a boost control solenoid to alter overspool? yes, but the twin scroll generally did that without it, if it wasn't leaking or stuck open.
the main reason i consider the series 5 turbo better is because the manifold and turbos tend to crack less than the series 4 do.
Last edited by RotaryEvolution; 02-09-13 at 05:35 PM.
02-09-13, 09:37 PM
#31
what was the question again?
oh, yeah... plan on a blown rotor and housing. at the rate people have and continue to go through them, you may have some difficulty find replacements for a decent price. i know i'm about close to doubling price of the turbo FC/FD stuff because it has become nonexistent in the past 2 years. and imported engines are even less than 50% good versus junk.
oh, yeah... plan on a blown rotor and housing. at the rate people have and continue to go through them, you may have some difficulty find replacements for a decent price. i know i'm about close to doubling price of the turbo FC/FD stuff because it has become nonexistent in the past 2 years. and imported engines are even less than 50% good versus junk.
Last edited by RotaryEvolution; 02-09-13 at 09:40 PM.
02-10-13, 03:49 PM
#32
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i know plan on just rebuilding my na engine and replacing the jacked up trans i currently have with the turbo trans. im gonna offer 200 bucks for the trans, slave and clutch components. sound good?
02-11-13, 05:08 PM
#33
You'll need the flywheel and starter, too. I'd want about 250 for the trans because I wouldn't sell junk, but I don't know what condition his trans is in. People agree to a lot of crazy stuff when you wave cash in their face, so feel free to start low.
02-11-13, 06:51 PM
#35
Well if he doesn't care, start with a 6-pack of beer! I'd start lower since you can't test the trans in any way. Transmissions off cars with modified turbo systems seem like they would've lived harder lives than most. Price also depends on how commonly they come up for sale in your area. So I can only give you guidance based on the my market.
02-11-13, 07:16 PM
#36
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thanks my friend. ill see how it goes. he is making a big deal about his 400 dollar clutch so i might just get a stock replacement from the parts store and go for 200 bucks on the trans and parts.
well i feel a build thead coming on, i started removing the engine today afterwork. all thats left is the mounts and wiring really. i got the rad and all that stuff out along with the powersteering and ac. here are pictures for you viewing pleasure.
well i feel a build thead coming on, i started removing the engine today afterwork. all thats left is the mounts and wiring really. i got the rad and all that stuff out along with the powersteering and ac. here are pictures for you viewing pleasure.
02-17-13, 02:09 PM
#39
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ok engine is out. damn i couldnt belive how light the trans is lol. literally one hand i can pick it up. got to thinking why not just replace the gears in the trans? has anyone ever gone down this road? if not i know there is a junk yard rx with a trans in it i can use, condition unknown. what do you all think? rebuild existing trans? replace with junkyard NA trans and hope for the best? or buy the guys 300 dollar turbo trans and replace starter, flywheel, clutch, driveshaft etc? i know i need a new pressure plate clutch cause the fingers on mine are all kadywhompus.
next question, whats the best way to get the flexplate nut off? goddamn thats a big nut!
also i read a thead a while back stating the engine could be rebuilt on a 5 gallon bucket, ilike that idea alot could someone locate it for me? already tried.
cant belive the engine is the size of the bellhousing lol!
next question, whats the best way to get the flexplate nut off? goddamn thats a big nut!
also i read a thead a while back stating the engine could be rebuilt on a 5 gallon bucket, ilike that idea alot could someone locate it for me? already tried. cant belive the engine is the size of the bellhousing lol!
02-17-13, 02:31 PM
#40
transmission rebuilds generally only consist of replacing bearings and syncros. you don't want to know how much it would cost to remanufacture a transmission with new gears.. you are talking thousands of dollars for a still weak transmission.
the flywheel nut socket you can usually get at a tool store or at sears, it is a size 2 1/8". in a pinch a chisel and a hammer will work. i got mine from sears many years ago and it's done more flywheels than i can count.
the flywheel nut socket you can usually get at a tool store or at sears, it is a size 2 1/8". in a pinch a chisel and a hammer will work. i got mine from sears many years ago and it's done more flywheels than i can count.
Last edited by RotaryEvolution; 02-17-13 at 02:34 PM.
02-17-13, 02:33 PM
#41
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buy junk yard one and put the two of them together best i can? or are you steering me away from retaining the NA trans? no major hp mods down the pipeline.
issues im having with mine currently is grinding badly in 3rd gear and sometimes into reverse everything else honkydory.
issues im having with mine currently is grinding badly in 3rd gear and sometimes into reverse everything else honkydory.
02-17-13, 04:02 PM
#43
steering you towards not dumping a bunch of money into the glass n/a transmission. most people just swap them out when they fail or rebuild it cheaply through a reliable rebuilder.
they can break even if you use brand new parts in them, i just had one a few weeks ago with a broken countershaft gear. the broken gear alone put the transmission into the scrap category.
they can break even if you use brand new parts in them, i just had one a few weeks ago with a broken countershaft gear. the broken gear alone put the transmission into the scrap category.
Last edited by RotaryEvolution; 02-17-13 at 04:05 PM.
02-17-13, 06:12 PM
#44
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no way am i dumping money into the trans, id just like to instead of possibly throwing in another junk trans to instead rebuild one out of two with the best parts they both have correcting the fluid leaks and installing a better shifter. I guess ill go this route, hey who knows i might get lucky and find a good clutch and pressure plate too. hopefully the junk yard rx is sitting just as i left it, trans about 45 deg angle to the deck.
anyway more progress today disassembling. man i need to start a build thread already.
anyway more progress today disassembling. man i need to start a build thread already.
02-19-13, 12:41 PM
#49
only way to know if one is good is by installing it, bench testing it through the gears still cannot verify the syncros or even the bearings are good.
i have a pile of transmissions but since i can't know any of them are good i consider them all rebuildable cores and not for sale used.
i have a pile of transmissions but since i can't know any of them are good i consider them all rebuildable cores and not for sale used.
02-19-13, 04:41 PM
#50
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only way to know if one is good is by installing it, bench testing it through the gears still cannot verify the syncros or even the bearings are good.
i have a pile of transmissions but since i can't know any of them are good i consider them all rebuildable cores and not for sale used.
i have a pile of transmissions but since i can't know any of them are good i consider them all rebuildable cores and not for sale used.
