socalrotor

iTrader: (1)

BTW you still should tighten the sway bar mounts with the car level on the ground IMO. I know from doing my 280z that the more grease the better!!

slo

iTrader: (1)

I saw that part of the post, which is why I know that you read the entire article. The very title if my post talkes about energy suspension bushings.

So why then did you decide to post part of the article coroburating your original reply, which you know has nothing to do what the situation at hand.

JWteknix

iTrader: (2)

it appys to free floating bushing does it? well can u plz read the last line above the url address plz and also you can tighten free floating bushing as much as you can and it will not change any thing do to the thick metal rod that the bolt passes thougth and it will not cause any additional pressure on the bushing nor the control arm

socalrotor

iTrader: (1)

Ok, mr L7, I posted it up to help those that didnt know. I have done countless poly bushings, some ES some not. EVERYTIME I have done it the same as EVERYONE I know does it, with no problems yet, so why not pass that on if someone is looking for help. Stop being a douche.

socalrotor

iTrader: (1)

forget it, I am wasting my time.lol

JWteknix

iTrader: (2)

i agree i did mine on ramps

socalrotor

iTrader: (1)

BTW if you read the link you would notice I ADDED THE LAST LINE OVER THE URL......for those that didnt read the whole thing, I was pointing this out.

JWteknix

iTrader: (2)

i appeciat ur post it tought me somthing i didnt mean take it out on you i just have a problem when this other guy comes in and starts saying im wrong when i was tryin to help slo and the other guy the whole time because i have done all my bushing and used the same ones while doiing it on a 4 post lift with no load on the suspention and had noproblems so idk

socalrotor

iTrader: (1)

I come off like an ******* most of the time but I try and be helpful thru the ****.

JWteknix

iTrader: (2)

i understand me too man its all cool

RotaryEvolution

iTrader: (30)

you guys are arguing about this over tightening the suspension while it is loaded? the bushings shouldn't be very stiff after installation, something is missing such as the sleeves that go INSIDE the bushings to space the frame mounting from the bushing, if you forget those sleeves then when you tighten the bolts down you are just sandwiching the bushings and of course they will bind.

as for tightening the suspension loaded with this kit, it may be important on some cars but not on the FC.. if after tightening the suspension mounts down you feel any binding then you did something improperly. feeling the motion of the arm after install you should realize that tightening the mounts down before or after loading would make little difference.

JWteknix

iTrader: (2)

ftw thank you karack

TalkSick

same issue here.. not only did i have a hell of a time gettin the rear pivot bushing on the front control arm, now that i finally have it all lined up an near torqued down the control arm certainly seems stiff in its up an down motion. i mean i can move it by hand but i can sit it at whatever height and leave it there without the weight of the arm pulling itself down, normal? anyone found out anything about this besides the lil mini flame war?

wildkats

I'm also in the same boat. I've checked that all the parts were on the parts list and very well lubed but the control arms still feels very stiff.

I checked the FSM and there are no other metal sleeves for the front FLCAB other then the one the bolt goes through and after removing the rear FLCAB (cutting the metal sleeve method) there were no other sleves to remove according to the FSM of from the instructions from ES.


I called ES and the tech said just to check that there's no grit on the bolt that goes through the metal sleves and try some antiseize.

I searched here (keyword 'torque' and 'bushings) and didn't find a clear indication of what the problem was so I was wondering how did slo or TalkSick fix their issues? I saw a thread a while ago that said the metal sleeve for the front FLCAB was too short. I'll have to take it apart again to check the length compaired to the ER specs. Or should I just put it all back, drive it around a bit (a few miles) to let the suspension settle, then check for binding again?

Thanks as always for the support!

JWteknix

iTrader: (2)

it could be because ur removing 20 +or- years that have a lot of play. inserting new bushing will stiffen up the control arms and the fact that you are now using poly bushings instead of the oem rubber bushings it will bee a alot stiffer suspension

wildkats

That could be true but it just seems overly tight. It takes maybe 20~25 lbs of force to move the arms without the struts/coils installed. I'm sure the weight of the car will compress the upwards and the tire/wheel/spring forces will force it down but I don't want to hit a bump and find the wheel hanging in mid air cuz the arm takes too long to return to the ground.

Also, I searched the 2nd gen forums and haven't found anything about this so I'll post/rant :-( I was talking with the ES guy about the front control arm ball joint dust covers and the steering end-link ball joint covers cuz they don't fit right. He basically said that they're generic 'show' covers that go over the existing factory dust covers! WTF!!! First of all there were no instructions included in the kit about installing them. Then I read the FSM and from what's written it seemd like both covers are removable and replaceable so I assumed that they would fit and took my OEM's off. There was no way for me to know that they wouldn't fit since I can't measure the inside diameters of the OEM ones until they were off. The ES LCA covers are way too large and the end link covers are loose enough to pop off while I was bolting the castle nut back on. So the guy at ES says to use them to cover the existing dust covers or use safety wires. It would've been nice to know that before I started to remove the OEM covers. Then I find out that Mazda no longer sells (or may never have sold) the LCA ball joint covers but instead sells teh whole ball joint for like $122!!!!! and the end-link cover sells for $77. That's a $400 repair that should've been avoided by proper warnings from ES! What a rip-off. ES should've included some instructions or at least a warning that they are generic and may not fit.

So now in addition to the binding I have to try to press the old covers back on. The old covers are cracked but not all the way through so maybe that'll be ok. If not I'll have to try to safety wire the ES one's on there and hope they stay.

Sorry about the ranting but stupid **** like this would probably **** anyone off.

TweakGames

iTrader: (3)

ok so I think this is why i have mad understeer now, but im not sure. Let me check. I made a front arm bar that goes between the two lower arm bushing bolts (I think) here is a picture of what I got. Is what this bar connects to the lower arms?



Ok well when I was doing my engine swap I took it off for no reason, and when I was done with the engine swap I drove the car a good 20 miles without even having the bolts in!!!! I then realized it when I have the worst understeer ever. But then I lifted up the car again, and put the bar back on. Still have understeer but not as bad. (With the bar and bolts in)

Do you think that I broke something while I drove it with no bolts, or its all understeer because I had the car lifted when I put the bolts back in.

Thanks
~Tweak

classicauto

iTrader: (3)

Holy-thundering-Jesus there's alot of words in a thread about a bushing.

1) If your aftermarket bushing comes with a metal sleeve insert like the factory one (never found any aftermarket for ANY vehicle...unless you replace them with OEM) you need to torque it in place at the neutral point in the car's stance.

2) If its a bushing thats constructed like 99.99999999% of aftermarket bushings like Energy Suspension's kit (ie. solid polyurethane) simply slip them on the arms, and bolt them up. End of story. They might feel tight to move, but this is part of the design and there should be no binding, just a slow but smooth sweep. And trust me, they're easier to move then the stock 20 year old ones were.

classicauto

iTrader: (3)

In your case, installing an arm bar, you should be doing it with the suspension in a neutral stance. Otherwise, because the bar is there to prevent flexing that occurs when driving (or jacking it up) you are simply locking it in place in the bent position.

Drive it onto an alignment rack (i.e. a full four post hoist) and loosen, then re-tighten the bar.

wildkats

Thanks classicauto, the kit is from Energy Suspension and there's no metal sleeve except the one the bolt goes through. The movement is smooth but like I said it takes about 20-25lbs of pressure to move it either way.

I still have one side not completely re-assembled so I'll just take it apart, check the specs and clean it up (once again). If they still seem stiff then I just drive it around for a bit and see if it feels obviously broken.

Black91n/a

The Miatas have a problem with swaybar bushings binding (see http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/new...-roll-bars.php )

You can either put washers under the bushing clamp, or shave the bushings to eliminate/lessen the binding.

I recognize that lower arm bar! I've got one just like it! https://www.rx7club.com/2nd-generation-specific-1986-1992-17/how-build-lower-arm-bar-under-%2415-448638/

TweakGames

iTrader: (3)

So something like this is considered a 4 port hoist?
(pictures of me getting aligned for the 3rd time after screwing seemingly screwing up the front.)















Opps it seems I can't stop posting pictures haha. I shall stop now.

Anyways I'm going to undo and redo the bolts tomorrow when I pull my rental engine and put in my 6 port na turbo.

Sgt. Pepper

Gonna bump this up for a question about this post.

If that's true, then why is it said to jack the front of the car up when you are installing a front strut tower bar?

Chief_MC

Hey guys!


I have the same problem: the lower arms are insanely tight after ES bushings were installed. You can move them only by enormous weights... I think it is completely not normal.

Have you solved this? Maybe shaving the part of the bushings that are going in between the arm and the frame will help? 'Cause the OEM bushing has the metal sleeve sticking out from the bushing and the ES doesn't.

AllMotorRotor

I have the same issue but havn't had issues on the road.

I was thinking making 1/32" - 1/16" spacers (Not washers) to go between the braket and the chassis.