FMIC vs Stock TMIC
09-15-12, 12:51 PM
#1
Rotary Dad
Thread Starter
FMIC vs Stock TMIC
Finally doing my T2 swap, just a quick question, Is a front mount better than top mount if I'm leaving everthing stock? Turbo, injectors,ect. I like the "LOOK" of FMIC ,but is needed? is there much of a turbo lag and pressure drop, or any stock turbo guys or gals happy with factory I.C.? I want reliability as well as some power but, looks are cool too. all advice is appreciated ty.
09-15-12, 01:05 PM
#3
BRUCE LEE APPROVED
Top mount is fine. No need to upgrade if you are staying stock.
I have seen about 320hp @ the wheels on a TMIC - not as efficient cooling wise but it will do it with a Knightsports highflow, injectors, exhaust etc. So for stock you will be fine.
I have seen about 320hp @ the wheels on a TMIC - not as efficient cooling wise but it will do it with a Knightsports highflow, injectors, exhaust etc. So for stock you will be fine.
09-16-12, 10:51 AM
#4
Rotary Dad
Thread Starter
Thanks. I have only seen 1 company who has an upgraded ecu for a s4. But I forgot who. Knight only does s5 right? If anyone knows a good s4 upgraded ecu please let me know.haltech is out of my budget.
09-16-12, 02:00 PM
#5
bcrotary.
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It's called Rtek. Very affordable and pretty much your only option for the stock ecu. I like the stock TMIC too but it is inefficient, and most people just end up doing the front mount in the end.
09-16-12, 11:36 PM
#6
BRUCE LEE APPROVED
Microtec used units are usually $600.00 AUD or so. Good gear and easy to tune. Best bet rather than an old tuned stock ECU from the 80's or 90's. Buy it, tune it and enjoy. Best bit is later if you go bigger turbo, FMIC then you can reprogram easily.
FMIC is better at cooling than a TMIC - If you are on a budget/want stock look a larger TMIC can be found from time to time. I tend to decide on the power I want then go for the mods to support it. The S5 TMIC appears to be slightly better from what I can tell I have one of each on the shelf. I am running a HKS aftermarket top mount. Thicker core and cast tanks. FMIC are very affordable too now so it's not a cost thing purely personal.
My motivation for TMIC is power level, it does not interfere with radiator and engine oil cooling capability (airflow) and near stock looking. Mine is a circuit car about 330 RWHP the TMIC at this level is fine.
Hope that helps.
09-24-12, 12:27 AM
#7
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I made around 300whp on the stock tmic, but when I would do back to back runs on the dyno, I would drop 15whp from iats getting so high.
My tuner gave it 15 mins to cool with ice on the tmic, and it was back up to 300 whp, followed by 280whp pulls immediately after lol
My tuner gave it 15 mins to cool with ice on the tmic, and it was back up to 300 whp, followed by 280whp pulls immediately after lol
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09-24-12, 12:49 AM
#8
The TMIC is fine with a stock turbo, rich mixture and retarded timing (if boost increased). But with a larger turbo/increased airflow, the TMIC cannot reject enough heat. The result is ridiculously high IATs; I've seen as high as 186F. But aux. injection solves the problem.
https://www.rx7club.com/2nd-generati...ction-1005319/
https://www.rx7club.com/2nd-generati...ction-1005319/
09-24-12, 07:13 AM
#9
Microtec used units are usually $600.00 AUD or so. Good gear and easy to tune. Best bet rather than an old tuned stock ECU from the 80's or 90's. Buy it, tune it and enjoy. Best bit is later if you go bigger turbo, FMIC then you can reprogram easily.
FMIC is better at cooling than a TMIC - If you are on a budget/want stock look a larger TMIC can be found from time to time. I tend to decide on the power I want then go for the mods to support it. The S5 TMIC appears to be slightly better from what I can tell I have one of each on the shelf. I am running a HKS aftermarket top mount. Thicker core and cast tanks. FMIC are very affordable too now so it's not a cost thing purely personal.
My motivation for TMIC is power level, it does not interfere with radiator and engine oil cooling capability (airflow) and near stock looking. Mine is a circuit car about 330 RWHP the TMIC at this level is fine.
Hope that helps.
FMIC is better at cooling than a TMIC - If you are on a budget/want stock look a larger TMIC can be found from time to time. I tend to decide on the power I want then go for the mods to support it. The S5 TMIC appears to be slightly better from what I can tell I have one of each on the shelf. I am running a HKS aftermarket top mount. Thicker core and cast tanks. FMIC are very affordable too now so it's not a cost thing purely personal.
My motivation for TMIC is power level, it does not interfere with radiator and engine oil cooling capability (airflow) and near stock looking. Mine is a circuit car about 330 RWHP the TMIC at this level is fine.
Hope that helps.
09-24-12, 08:31 PM
#10
Rotary Dad
Thread Starter
I think I'll keep top mount for the build begining. If my motor is good I'll step it up. If I painted my intercooler would paint interfere with it'd cooling ability. Maybe clog the fins huh?
09-24-12, 09:09 PM
#12
You can find them on ebay frequently.
09-25-12, 12:33 PM
#14
+1
rotaries and front mounts don't mix. friends don't let friends front mount.
front mounts are an easy solution for more power but it also puts your cooling system second in importance, which it should not be. i even somewhat remember BDC netting about 420whp with a stock top mount intercooler and alcohol injection(but popped the motor, would have likely survived if he ran straight water AI instead), obviously it is not efficient but it shows you can blow through a straw with enough force.
rotaries and front mounts don't mix. friends don't let friends front mount.
front mounts are an easy solution for more power but it also puts your cooling system second in importance, which it should not be. i even somewhat remember BDC netting about 420whp with a stock top mount intercooler and alcohol injection(but popped the motor, would have likely survived if he ran straight water AI instead), obviously it is not efficient but it shows you can blow through a straw with enough force.
Last edited by RotaryEvolution; 09-25-12 at 12:36 PM.
09-26-12, 12:11 AM
#15
Driving RX7's since 1979
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Installed my polished, heat shield added & ceramic coated, end tanks ceramic coated, HKS TMIC this evening. Thank you Anthony and JP Performance (Santa Ana) for modifications.
Next project is the H2O injection.
Next project is the H2O injection.
09-27-12, 03:46 AM
#16
BRUCE LEE APPROVED
Please?
09-27-12, 11:10 AM
#17
I am preparing a fmic setup for my 6port turbo project. As it is a street car, I don't see any need to overcomplicate. Since you are starting with a stock motor and you have a tii hood, leave it be for now.
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09-27-12, 12:27 PM
#19
+1
rotaries and front mounts don't mix. friends don't let friends front mount.
front mounts are an easy solution for more power but it also puts your cooling system second in importance, which it should not be. i even somewhat remember BDC netting about 420whp with a stock top mount intercooler and alcohol injection(but popped the motor, would have likely survived if he ran straight water AI instead), obviously it is not efficient but it shows you can blow through a straw with enough force.
rotaries and front mounts don't mix. friends don't let friends front mount.
front mounts are an easy solution for more power but it also puts your cooling system second in importance, which it should not be. i even somewhat remember BDC netting about 420whp with a stock top mount intercooler and alcohol injection(but popped the motor, would have likely survived if he ran straight water AI instead), obviously it is not efficient but it shows you can blow through a straw with enough force.
most front mounts make you take out the bumper support too which is not ok for a street car....
Rotary Extreme has an FC v-mount almost out of development...
09-27-12, 05:25 PM
#21
Rotary Enthusiast
Im on stock turbo and didnt really notice any lag. You deff dont need a FMIC but if you like the "look" of it then you can do it. SOme people say it it creates lag.but i didnt notice any.
09-27-12, 08:41 PM
#23
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Some will argue, but it's still pretty much a 10 lbs of boost thing to stay safe in my opinion. Just a far more efficient support to 10 lbs of boost. The H2O injections should allow more RWHP at that boost.
09-28-12, 01:50 AM
#25
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Ask and you will receive
I removed the HKS mount points and added mounts from a stock TMIC to eliminate a direct conduit for the heat from the engine to the TMIC to retard heat soak. I also did this as I needed to slightly re-locate the sit of the TMIC closer to the firewall to center the indentation to my now larger than stock FD alternator.
I added lower heat shielding from a stock TMIC to retard heat soak.
I ceramic coated the heat shielding and end tanks to help retard heat soak. I'm going to also add the stick on insulation discussed in another thread to further help retard heat soak.
I added a lip on either side so it would seal to the stock hood opening. Tomorrow I'll install the foam insulation tape at the perifory of the TMIC to complete the seal.
Final part of my plan will be H2O injection at the compression tube.