In a T2 that is. What all can you safely do to it before needing engine or fuel management? If I just wanted basic stuff for a while (Exhaust, dp, intercooler, and some kind of intake to be specific), could I have it on for daily driving without needing some kind of ems?

This is probably asked a lot, but I didn't see it addressed in the FAQ. And I didn't really know how to phrase it to do a search.

Thanks

 

First off, the Stock ECU is very limited in standard form. If you do any "breather" (exhaust, intake) mods to a T2, you need at LEAST an SAFC2. Thats a piggyback computer.

 

Engine management means stock ECU right?
If you just want to keep the stock ecu, you can go VERY far...

i.e. AIC + AFC + ITC should handle pretty much everything you would ever want.....

dont forget that was the only thing they had before aftermarket ems became popular

 

www.fc3spro.com

 

I'd say when you start go get close to the 300hp mark, it's highly recommended to go stand-alone EMS.

AIC's, when brand new, are costly.
You can almost get a full-blown stand-alone EMS for the same price.
You need to add the cost of the additional plumbing and fuel injectors.
At least with a stand-alone, a pair of 1600's (from eBay) for $250 will easily support 400hp with a big enough fuel pump - no additional plumbing, no welding of bungs for extra injectors.

The stock ECU has very conservative ignition timing, so even an ITC cannot run in true 3D mapping.
Running very aggressive timing in mid load ranges makes for a very peppy engine on the street - the ITC cannot do this.

Fuel computer still have their limits, especially with larger primaries.
Going beyond 720's in the primaries will cause flooding nightmares during cranking, cause the stock ECU doesn't know you're running bigger primaries during cranking.
Stand-alone EMS makes it moot.


-Ted

 

welding of bungs???

 

If you think putting fuel injector prior to the throttle body like that is optimal, you need to read up on EFi theory and the Mazda rotary engine.


-Ted

 

of course it is NOT optimal
of course stand alone is the BEST way to go
but the point was, he asked how far you can go without a new ecu
and the answer is, pretty far, and much farther than most people are willing to give credit for


if you can get the stock ecu at 11:1 AFR at 1 bar, flat, and have the itc with the same timing
and then you do that with a wolf 3d

at WOT,,,, the results will be very similiar, dont ya think?

remember, we are only talking about 400-500hp... not something you need overkill hi-dollar electronics for

 

the airflow meter.....how far can you go with it still in place?

 

if u actaully - somehow, manage to max it out by sucking air thru it - make it so it blows air thru it... and you can meter more air

 

Yea i've heard good things about mounting the AFM inline with the intercooler piping. (blowing through it) The air is already compressed so you can get more through it.

 

asking how much hp you can make without a ems is exactly like asking how high you can climb a cliff without a rope and harness.

a novice doing it could get pretty far but would be very unsafe and from there its only a matter of time..

a pro could do it no problem and would fully understand the risks and how to avoid trouble.




most projects are dependant on budget and know how. your gonna have a hard time making lots of power if your lacking on either end.